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  1. #21
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Baltimore, MD, USA
    Posts
    24

    Default Re: Small cell foundation / bees

    As a beginner, I'm curious about this. If I start my bees on standard foundation and then any new frames I put in are small cell foundation, will the bees immediately start drawing the small cells?

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Walker, Alabama, USA
    Posts
    900

    Default Re: Small cell foundation / bees

    A few months back Solomon Parker posted a link to a survey from 2011. (I don't think the survey for 2012 is available yet.) It looked at the hive--what factors were helping, hurting, or didn't have any effect. One of the items was cell size and the findings were that cell size didn't affect results one way or the other. It didn't help or hinder anything. This suggests, to me anyhow, that you should use whichever cell size appeals to you for whatever reason.

    JMO


    Rusty
    Rusty Hills Farm -- home of AQHA A Rusty Zipper & Rusty's Bees ( LC and T)

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Vernonia Or
    Posts
    87

    Default Re: Small cell foundation / bees

    Quote Originally Posted by Rusty Hills Farm View Post
    A few months back Solomon Parker posted a link to a survey from 2011. (I don't think the survey for 2012 is available yet.) It looked at the hive--what factors were helping, hurting, or didn't have any effect. One of the items was cell size and the findings were that cell size didn't affect results one way or the other. It didn't help or hinder anything. This suggests, to me anyhow, that you should use whichever cell size appeals to you for whatever reason.

    JMO

    Rusty
    I'd like to see that. The consensus I've gotten says otherwise. The conclusion I've come to is that arguments for small cell size, primarily geared toward the Varroa mite problem, are very compelling. The sound logic comes from enormously successful keepers as well as just successful keepers. I don't hear arguments against as much as just posts from "prove it" skeptics. "Natural" in itself is appealing all by itself, to me anyway, and I think that's provable to be in the "small cell" range.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Rader, Greene County, Tennessee, USA
    Posts
    6,119

    Default Re: Small cell foundation / bees

    Here's the thread Solomon started regarding the Bee Informed survey:
    http://www.beesource.com/forums/show...ghlight=survey
    Graham
    USDA Zone 7A Elevation 1400 ft

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Vernonia Or
    Posts
    87

    Default Re: Small cell foundation / bees

    Quote Originally Posted by Rader Sidetrack View Post
    Here's the thread Solomon started regarding the Bee Informed survey:
    http://www.beesource.com/forums/show...ghlight=survey
    Thanks for that. A lot to digest there - that'll take a bit of free time...sometime. Appears generally that if one is pro-active at anything their loses are less. I'm gonna be pro-active towards "natural." It's got a good ring to it
    Last edited by Joel_T; 03-27-2013 at 11:39 AM.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Arlee MT USA
    Posts
    548

    Default Re: Small cell foundation / bees

    Has anyone every shown any evidence of any kind that small cell is bad? It seems to me that even if there is no clear evidence for small cell it doesn't matter as long as their is no evidence to the contrary. Why not use it?

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Douglas, Ma, USA
    Posts
    1

    Default Re: Small cell foundation / bees

    I've purchased my first bees this year - 2 packages of Russian/Carniolan (they're supposed to be a small cell bee). I plan to use pf100s in one hive's brood boxes, and pf120s in the honey supers. The other hive will be foundationless except for 2 pf100 frames to put the queen cage between. There are just so many differing opinions that I'd like to get some first hand experience with difference between foundation and foundationless bee keeping. Hopefully next year I'll have input to this subject.
    Last edited by fahmahbob; 03-27-2013 at 04:33 PM.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Delhi, New York, USA
    Posts
    351

    Default Re: Small cell foundation / bees

    "Without a doubt, the pf100 series plastic frames are the way to go."

    Can you have two different sized cells in one colony?

  9. #29

    Default Re: Small cell foundation / bees

    Quote Originally Posted by Joel_T View Post
    I think I’d rather start with natural "small" cell from the get go.
    I reckon you first have to decide which...natural or small cell.....they aren't the same.
    Dan www.boogerhillbee.com
    Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Feb 2013
    Location
    Vernonia Or
    Posts
    87

    Default Re: Small cell foundation / bees

    Quote Originally Posted by beemandan View Post
    I reckon you first have to decide which...natural or small cell.....they aren't the same.
    From what I've read, technically maybe not, but generally speaking I'm thinking they're pretty much the same. While engineered, 4.9mm foundation is closer to what nature makes than 5.4mm.

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Delhi, New York, USA
    Posts
    351

    Default Re: Small cell foundation / bees

    "I reckon you first have to decide which...natural or small cell.....they aren't the same."

    Dan, I had bought frames and foundation and didn't realize that they were a smaller size than what I have now. Can I still interchange the small cells with the other hives that have a larger cell foundation...all plastic. Thanks, Deb

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