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  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Roseville, CA
    Posts
    109

    Default Split two hives....one is building queen cells, the other is not.

    I like the stock that I have, so I have decided to let the splits raise their own queens. I checked on the splits three days later and one had several queen cells developing and the other did not. After three days, the eggs are past the point of creating a new queen at this point. So my questions are:

    1. Why did they choose not to create a queen? There were plenty of fresh eggs.
    2. What to do now? I can take a few more frames from the other hives that I split from or I can do a paper combine and make them one again.

    Keep in mind that the popoluation of all four hives are great at this point. They are bringing in pollen and I am feeding.

    Thanks in advance!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Great Falls Montana
    Posts
    3,974

    Default Re: Split two hives....one is building queen cells, the other is not.

    Look for eggs in the split without cells. I bet it has a queen. If it didn't and if it had eggs or larvae under 3 days, they would have built cells. Give it a frame of eggs with no bees. If they build no cells after that, you have a rare hive of trappist monks or they indeed have a queen.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Rockford, MI
    Posts
    2,592

    Default Re: Split two hives....one is building queen cells, the other is not.

    If you check and the hive doesn't have a queen, you have plenty of queen cells to add.

    Oh yeah if you have some cells left over... send a few my way. I have a hive that's been queenless since the end last Sept. lol

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Sacramento, CA, USA
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    1,728

    Default Re: Split two hives....one is building queen cells, the other is not.

    Vance may be correct that they have a queen in there somewhere to prevent them from making a new queen.
    Mr.Beeman, how come your queenless hive not have any drone layers yet? Could it bee still too cold for them to lay?

    meBeing me, I think our weather is still too cold for them to recognize their queen is missing or maybe there is really a queen in there. We are barely into the early Spring now even though there are plenty of pollens out there. Almonds and some peach trees already blooming though. But not the plum tree yet maybe in 2 more weeks or so. And if you split them too soon then there might not be a drone congregation spot for their queens to be mated. No drones and with the cold now so that maybe they don't want to make a queen yet. Without a queen bee when the weather warms up in late March and April they might become drone layer bees. You can continue to add more eggs from these strong hive (hoping) or recombine them now. Recombining is a mess that sometimes they might kill your existing queen bee too like they did to mine one week later at 2 times in late winter last year. I did a newspaper combine that did not work out so they killed off the old queen. Scrambling for a new queen bee that tripled the price is not fun that is if you can even find any queen bee for sale at this time of year. Nobody has queen for sale now because of the cold spell still going on. A queen breeder told me so when I emailed them for a queen bee for sale. If they can graft then I would of gotten my new queen early to make some splits already. One thing leading to another that was my experiences so far. I am not saying you will end up like my situation but seems like what I did last winter and heading towards that direction it seems. You can still put your new queen cells in there with a cell protector to see if they will accept the new queen bee. But if there is the old queen inside then they will have a battle soon.
    Last edited by beepro; 02-24-2013 at 03:18 AM.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Rockford, MI
    Posts
    2,592

    Default Re: Split two hives....one is building queen cells, the other is not.

    Not too sure if there is a laying worker or not in there. I have not been able to open it yet this year due to the cold weather. It may get to 35 degrees today for a high. lol I did however have the hive next to it (with the newly mated virgin queen) leave late in Nov.. They may have taken up resdience in this hive, but that's just hopeful speculation at this time.
    I will know in March sometime. Although, I've seen it snow here at the end of April.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Reno, NV
    Posts
    2,981

    Default Re: Split two hives....one is building queen cells, the other is not.

    take a cell or two from teh one hive that did make queens and give it to the one that didn't
    Stand for what you believe, even if you stand alone.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    collbran, co
    Posts
    537

    Default Re: Split two hives....one is building queen cells, the other is not.

    my Russians have wintered over drones.but most days too cold could make queens but would be very lucky to get a good day for her to go on a mating flight.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Sacramento, CA, USA
    Posts
    1,728

    Default Re: Split two hives....one is building queen cells, the other is not.

    So the Russians is a good type to raise, huh. Since they do not kick out their winter drones like the Italians or Carniolans do. Are all Russians do the same too or just your special hive to save their drones?

  9. #9
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Roseville, CA
    Posts
    109

    Default Re: Split two hives....one is building queen cells, the other is not.

    Quote Originally Posted by Daniel Y View Post
    take a cell or two from teh one hive that did make queens and give it to the one that didn't
    How do I attach those queen cells to the frame of the hive that needs a queen?

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Sacramento, CA, USA
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    1,728

    Default Re: Split two hives....one is building queen cells, the other is not.

    I saw on youtube, the fat bee man, he has helper or students to use a sharp knife to cut the queen cells carefully out
    of the combs. Then transfer the cell into the new nuc. I am sure you can find one nuc frame just above the brood to attach the queen cell to.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    greer south carolina USA
    Posts
    156

    Default Re: Split two hives....one is building queen cells, the other is not.

    take a small knife and cut a hole in the comb where you want to put the queen cell then cut out a qcell and gently push it in the hole. the bees will wax it in. if you have plenty o qcells then put two for good measure

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
    Posts
    46,136

    Default Re: Split two hives....one is building queen cells, the other is not.

    The one not building cells probably has a queen and you just don't know it, but you can always put one in for insurance...
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Sacramento,California,USA
    Posts
    3,670

    Default Re: Split two hives....one is building queen cells, the other is not.

    So, the split that is not raising queen cells, what's now in the hive that the split was taken from? If there's queen cells then the queen was in the split. If there are normal eggs and larva then the split didn't take and needs a frame of eggs.
    “When one tugs at a single thing in nature, he finds it attached to the rest of the world.” – John Muir

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Reno, NV
    Posts
    2,981

    Default Re: Split two hives....one is building queen cells, the other is not.

    Quote Originally Posted by Me Beeing Me View Post
    How do I attach those queen cells to the frame of the hive that needs a queen?
    I cut the queen cell out of the comb. leaving about a thumb size piece of wax at the top of the cell. I then press this wax into the frame being placed in the queenless nuc. take great care to not smash the queen cell in any way. not even a tiny dent in it. Handle it with care. more so if it has only recently been capped. Do not turn it over. lay it on it's side etc. the older it is the less care you need to take. But err on the side of caution.

    Place frame with queen cell in nuc leaving a larger than normal gap between frames. make sure the cell is not being smashed. The bees will take care of the cell one way or the other. No point in arguing if they decide they do not want it.
    Stand for what you believe, even if you stand alone.

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