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  1. #221
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Portland, Oregon
    Posts
    976

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Camero7,

    Whenever any person, even someone like Russell - whom, by the way I in no wise hold out as a man of good character...he himself acknowledged himself a liar… and that he accepted money for product not delivered being indisputable -- when *any* man is the subject of slurring attacks by way of insinuation concerning theft, etc. until there is some evidence to that *Additional* crime, to insinuate, or accuse him of it *is* dishonorable.

    It is not Robert Russell being defended here.
    It is honor, and honorable behavior, even toward someone who has behaved dishonestly and dishonorably.

    In like manner Sippy, I’ve not accused you of stealing anything, but rather gave example of how easily one can believe something that may not be true.

    There are innocent men –good men – whose business is harmed if moonbeam bees, for example, don’t have the traits claimed.
    I have observed bees I bought (which are not regular MB, but am told were crossed w/ Alaskan bees) to fly in the dark, to fly when cold prevents my other bees, and to be aggressive toward mites.
    While that doesn’t prove anything about MB, it does present evidence.

    No matter whom I buy bees from, the only proof of the sellers claim that matters much is the bees performance in my yard.

    I expect that before Joe C, Kale, or Jason sell any queens out of the bees they’ve got from Russell, they’ll prove them in their own yards.
    (I know Kale isn't carrying them anymore at all b/c of association w/ Russell.)

    I think it’s foolish to attack a product because the breeder’s character is flawed.

    I expect to get a couple of Moonbeams (not crosses) this spring and will determine if they are as represented or not based not on imagination, or fear born of the breeder’s poor business practice, but based on their performance.

    And I’ll refrain from comments born of suspicion (though granted, the suspicion is reasonable) and imagination until there is actual evidence that the lines are tainted or exaggerated.
    To do otherwise isn’t just casting deserved doubt on Russell, but liable to damage the honest businessmen breeding from JN’s stock…which no one can say didn’t exist, only perhaps that he didn’t see them.

    I encourage the lot of us to be circumspect and cautious not to be cheated by Russell, and not to damage these other (honest) men’s interests with speculation, but instead to wait for evidence [that the bees don't have the traits claimed] should there be any.

    And if those lines of bees are fraudulent, there certainly will be.

    The bees don’t lie.

  2. #222
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Anderson, Indiana, USA
    Posts
    17

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    mudlake, very similar to my queen experience. My order was eventually handed off to "Matthew-Nebraska after I requested a refund late in the season. This followed many attempts to contact. I had ordered Cordovans but all Matthew could supply were "Northern Sunkist." But I agreed to take them figuring I'd better take what I could get. He stated that they would be coming from his Nebraska Operations. Strangely though, the package was postmarked from Mississippi. 50% survival so far. Maybe not too bad for bees I got so late in the season. By not being Cordovan though, I have no idea what they really are. My question now is, has anyone ever met the real Matthew?
    Quote Originally Posted by mudlake View Post
    I got 5 queens from RA not what I ordered, not one survived the winter. Ordered northern bees told by RA what to order. I had to e-mail several times to get my order, lots of phone calls, stamped on the package had a Missippi post mark.

  3. #223
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Portland, Oregon
    Posts
    976

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Sippy,

    If you'd like to meet and settle some differences over a cup of coffee when you're headed back south again, shoot me a PM.

  4. #224
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Roy, Wa
    Posts
    1,866

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Too easy to create an allis on forums. Don't get fooled again folks. Just sayin'
    Last edited by Lauri; 02-24-2013 at 08:45 PM.

  5. #225
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Raymond, Mississippi, USA
    Posts
    177

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Beregondo.... I believe my sentiment for Robert is very close to the majority of people here have.... maybe I am being too hard on him, but in MY mind... he has put a WHOLE new perspective to dishonest businessman. I knew some of his claims were lies but I had NO IDEA he would pretend to be different people straight to their face.

    As for hurting the other businesses.... if you owned that business would you want to know the truth or just pretend as much as you can that it did not happen? If I sold you a pug and told you it was a pit bull.... would you really want to know??

    I believe the subs will be the ones who have lost the most.... and I highly doubt that anyone of them knew any different than you or I. NY Blues was the first to step up.... and I highly commend that.... though personally I understand it may take some time for all the subs to be able to repay what Robert misrepresented or stole. I would not hesitate ONE SECOND to order from ANY of the subs today if I wanted bees... AND... if they do have any of Robert's stock... be it moonbeams, tigers, or venus star chasers or WHATEVER... Robert started out with some good stock.... and I am hoping I can get a few more of Russell's sunkists... whether it is from a sub or from Ricky. Whether any of Robert's lines of bees are indeed distinguishable from just a normal Italian.... I will leave that up to the individual who has them.... but honestly... you can't blame a few of us for making fun of them.

    As for making insinuations about Robert.... well... I think he earned it... and maybe you think bad of me for doing it.... but I will live with that if I must. You are correct that in the end I think we will all see how this plays out and who is really WHO. I have ZERO doubts about anything I have said in the last 2 months. Had it just been a few white lies or exaggerations I would have laughed and not cared what he said or claimed..... but when I came back HERE and see 20 pages on this forum from so many people that got screwed THAT made me ANGRY. When I read someone saying they would never buy anything from a Russell.... that just made me more angry at Robert for what he has done to his daddy's reputation.

    Beregondo.... we may never see eye to eye about some things.... I try to respect people even when they differ from my own opinion... try to remember that with me also. I did not CAUSE all of this to happen to Robert.... he did it to himself... and it started long before my first post about him was made here. In some way I do feel sorry for him..... but mostly for his dad. I was not some distant customer... I know pretty much all of the Russell clan and their friends... EXCEPT ROBERT... and you know why that is already.

    I will say one more time here.... I would order and pay for bees from ANY of the RA subs.... I believe they were as in the dark as any of us were. I have ZERO DOUBTS about the integrity of any of the subs.... especially the ones who stepped up early to show their sincerity....

  6. #226
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Walker, Alabama, USA
    Posts
    947

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Is Rob Hghes and Beehugheshoney the sme person aka Robert Russell? Why do I see NYBlues now posting-who is registerd on Beesource as Beehugheshoney??? Check it out folks! What the heck??
    http://www.beesource.com/forums/memb...beehugheshoney
    I don't understand this statement. beehugheshoney's profile says he's 17 years a beek from MS whereas NYBlues' profile says he's 26 and from New York. So why do you think they are the same person? NYBlues is listed as a friend of beehugheshoney, but isn't that to be expected, since he was a sub for RA? It sounds like the subs got even more royally screwed than the ordinary customers, so why are you tarring him with the same brush? Do you have any proof he's not who he says he is? Otherwise, you need to back up and cool off a bit.

    JMO

    Rusty (who does not have a horse in this race)
    Rusty Hills Farm -- home of AQHA A Rusty Zipper & Rusty's Bees ( LC and T)

  7. #227
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Cattaraugus,New York, USA
    Posts
    345

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by Lauri View Post
    Posting again to be sure someone looks into this.

    Is Rob Hughes and Beehugheshoney the same person aka Robert Russell?

    http://www.beesource.com/forums/memb...beehugheshoney

    Too easy to create an allis on forums. Don't get fooled again folks. Just sayin'
    Lauri, it is quite possible that Robert was using multiple screen names on this and other sites. I believe that Barry could look at the IP addresses to see if the registered user is posting from the same internet router or modem.
    As for trying to say that I am Rob Hughes or Robert, I am sorry that you are mistaken. Please PM me and ill give you my phone Number so you can call me if you would like to verify my true existance. I am sure my NY accent would be out of place for someone that has lives in Vicksburg MS, as beehugheshoney claims he does.
    Allegany Mtn. Bee Farm
    Quality Queens and Honey from Western New York

  8. #228
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Roy, Wa
    Posts
    1,866

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Just a few red flags for me. Beehughshoney joined Beesource 5-17-12..right about the time the first Russell thread startd when people started to squeek about not getting their orders, no response from the company, etc etc.
    He has only posted comments on the Russell posts.

    Sorry NYBlues if I am out of line here, but some may feel you are guilty by association and I fear you have some big time identity proving to do.

    NY-I'll PM you. I only want to see folks happy again and Beesource back on a postive note. I see after skimming through your long history of threads and posts you look totally legit. Got to check these days ya know...
    Last edited by Lauri; 02-25-2013 at 08:52 AM.

  9. #229
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Raymond, Mississippi, USA
    Posts
    177

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Lauri... go back and read NY Blues extensive posts about refunds etc... if there were unhappy customers we will be seeing it here... but as of yet, to my knowledge there is no one complaining....
    I do want to be clear that I have not and never have tried to force culpability for Robert's actions on the subs.... they got screwed the worst of all of us...FWIW

  10. #230
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Roy, Wa
    Posts
    1,866

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Let's hope it goes well for all concerned. I asked that the money I felt was due me for my incomplete order be donated to the local food bank. That still has never happened.

  11. #231
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    28,276

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    So, I guess Robert Russell is a fraud. Do we have to keep going on and on about it? Seems pretty well established already.
    Mark Berninghausen
    The answers are the end. The questions are the journey. Journey on.



  12. #232
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Cattaraugus,New York, USA
    Posts
    345

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by Lauri View Post
    Just a few red flags for me. Beehughshoney joined Beesource 5-17-12..right about the time the first Russell thread startd when people started to squeek about not getting their orders, no response from the company, etc etc.
    He has only posted comments on the Russell posts.
    Sorry NYBlues if I am out of line here, but some may feel you are guilty by association and I fear you have some identity proving to do.
    Lauri, I understand your reluctance to believe that I am not Robert, Rob, or anyone else, other than me. I joined Beesource in May of 2009, well before any of the Russell alias'. I have worked for Brian McDonald, known on here as BMAC, and am working for him again this spring. Please take a moment, if you wish, and contact him and ask him if I am truly who I say I am.
    I do believe that people feel that I am guilty by association. I have worked hard at trying to prove to folks that I am trustworthy. For starters, I did openly come out within a matter of minutes of finding out Robert Russell lied to everyone, and I condemned his actions. I stopped selling any bees that were associated to Russell Apiaries, and removed the Russell NY site. I have refunded all orders for queens that I had taken, and even though there were a number of folks that did not want their money back, but would rather have queens, I still sent them their money. I have fully withdrawn from the "Sub Producers program, and took a large financial hit. I cant change the past, or I would. I can only change what happens from today onward. If you dont trust me, thats fine, there are many folks that do. Actions speak louder than words, always. I realize that negative actions take longer to forget than positive ones. People may not remember anything about me other than I was associated with Robert Russell, and for that I am sorry. They may forget the public condemnation of his actions, the refunded orders, the withdrawl from the program.
    Allegany Mtn. Bee Farm
    Quality Queens and Honey from Western New York

  13. #233
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Athens, OH
    Posts
    2,740

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by sqkcrk View Post
    So, I guess Robert Russell is a fraud. Do we have to keep going on and on about it? Seems pretty well established already.
    But now we need to torture everyone else even remotely associated.
    Buy the ticket, take the ride. -H.S. Thompson

  14. #234
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Strafford, NH, USA
    Posts
    409

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Has anyone figured out where the queens were coming from that were getting sent out? I will have to check my copy of Queen Rearing Essentials tomorrow, but I am pretty sure the photos in the back showing the Miska's (name?) operation show racks of cells with the name R. Russell as the customer to receive them. I may be way off base and there are likely other R Russell folks out there keeping bees but...?

  15. #235
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    DuPage County, Illinois USA
    Posts
    9,649

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    It saddens me that we started out working together to expose wrong doings and now are starting to fight amongst ourselves. The longer the current discussion continues, the farther it will stray from what was once helpful and focused information. Not sure at this time there is more that needs to be said/discussed in regards to the thread title.

    Let's not continue discussion about various bee strains. That is off topic to this thread.
    Regards, Barry

  16. #236
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Roy, Wa
    Posts
    1,866

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    I did go to NYBlues page and see he has a very long history of posts that address many different topics. Not like those few who create an allis to address their own messes.

    My Appologies NY-you look a lot better after some checking. Just being real here. Those that got burned are understandably touchy. That may include you too. You seem to be handling the problem well. Hopefull it will all work out for all concerned.
    Last edited by Lauri; 02-24-2013 at 09:03 PM.

  17. #237
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Cattaraugus,New York, USA
    Posts
    345

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Barry,
    Please lock the thread if you feel that we are going to far off line, but please leave it visible to act as a warning for anyone that wants or needs to read this discussion.
    Allegany Mtn. Bee Farm
    Quality Queens and Honey from Western New York

  18. #238
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Cattaraugus,New York, USA
    Posts
    345

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by Lauri View Post
    I did go to NYBlues page and see he has a very long history of posts that address many different topics. Not like those few who create an allis to address their own messes.

    My Appologies NY-you look a lot better after some checking. Just being real here. Those that got burned are understandably touchy.
    No need to apologize, I understand your concern, it is well warranted, given the circumstances.
    Allegany Mtn. Bee Farm
    Quality Queens and Honey from Western New York

  19. #239
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    28,276

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    Quote Originally Posted by Lauri View Post
    I did go to NYBlues page and see he has a very long history of posts that address many different topics. Not like those few who create an allis to address their own messes.

    My Appologies NY-you look a lot better after some checking.
    Lauri,
    (if that's your real name, lol) Barry has exposed very few people who have established aliases and expelled them. Whereas it may be easy for some people to establish fake IDs, Barry tends to things pretty well the way I understand things.
    Mark Berninghausen
    The answers are the end. The questions are the journey. Journey on.



  20. #240
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Roy, Wa
    Posts
    1,866

    Default Re: Robert Russell is a fraud

    [QUOTE=sqkcrk;900131]Lauri,
    (if that's your real name, lol)
    Ya, that's my name, but I am really a man Just ask Acebird
    I have all the faith in the world in- AKA- 'Barry the Bloodhound'

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