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  1. #281
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    Sure. Right. I agree to the point that heated, filtered honey is not exactly the same as unfiltered, unheated honey. But to argue that one is "honey" and the other is not is where the pettiness creeps in, if you ask me.

    And arguing that one is "better" than the other is arguing personal preferences and opinions.

  2. #282
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    ...and every dairy farmer worth his/her salt knows that milk, raw and warm fro the cow is what milk is supposed to be. Anyone with a pristine well knows that cold, untreated water from the earth is what water is supposed to be. Any gardener worth his /her salt knows that fresh veggies from the garden (never refrigerated) is what veggies are supposed to be.

    I like raw honey. I make my living selling raw honey. I spend much of my time teaching others the beauty of raw honey (beekeepers and customers). I suggest those that think only raw honey should be sold as honey invest in raw honey, market it to a large chain retailer, and refuse to accept the chargebacks when the store and customers complain about it crystalizing on the shelf.
    If the person paying their hard earned money doesn't want it....perhaps you can force them?

    Deknow
    The perils of benefactors; The blessings of parasites; Blindness blindness and sight -Joni Mitchell 'Shadows and Light'

  3. #283
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    I think it is difficult to argue that honey has any appreciable food value.....now add in some protein (wax moth / shb / brood) and you might be able to make a claim.
    Deknow
    The perils of benefactors; The blessings of parasites; Blindness blindness and sight -Joni Mitchell 'Shadows and Light'

  4. #284
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    Herrick, SD USA
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    Quote Originally Posted by deknow View Post
    refuse to accept the chargebacks when the store and customers complain about it crystalizing on the shelf.
    If the person paying their hard earned money doesn't want it....perhaps you can force them?

    Deknow
    My choices were to come pick it up which could mean driving hundreds of miles, or donating it to a food pantry. The chargeback was just deducted from my next invoice with an upcharge for their freight and handling. I was given no choice. You margin could disappear in no time if you shipped out "improperly" processed honey. It was sooooooo frustrating. I made warehouse deliveries to 3 large grocery chains. They all had similar policies

  5. #285
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    Quote Originally Posted by jim lyon View Post
    ...or donating it to a food pantry.
    It would be an interesting study to see what happens to crystallized honey when handed out by a food pantry. I expect that a significant portion of it would be thrown out in the trash.

    deknow
    The perils of benefactors; The blessings of parasites; Blindness blindness and sight -Joni Mitchell 'Shadows and Light'

  6. #286
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    Garland, Bladen County, NC, USA
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    Quote Originally Posted by sqkcrk View Post
    So what is it when pollen grains are suspended in it? A suspension?
    Suspensions eventually settle out, so perhaps it is best to call honey a "Colloid".
    ďDonít tell me how educated you are, tell me how much you have travelled.Ē - The Quran

  7. #287
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    I always hoped someone appreciated it but never once received a thank you from anyone or any sort of acknowledgment

  8. #288
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    Apr 2008
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    Fair Grove,MO,USA
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    I was raised on whole milk straight from the cow (my children also), water from a 340 ft. well fresh veg. from the garden and canned veg. from the garden for winter,Honey,and meat from animals we raised, and still do. Our two children are married and doing the same.We are all in good health and active (5 grandkids and all). I credit most from staying away from proccessed food and city water, that is supposed to be safer and better for you.I sell veg. and honey at our local Farmers Market, or i should say i take it to the Farmers Market, it sells itself.I don't find it difficult to say Raw honey has some food value (studies have shown it does) and the health value of Raw honey. Now if you want to eat proccessed honey with less food value and body parts cooked in, you can have my share.

  9. #289
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    Sounds like you have identified your market, and are filling the demand of that market, brooksbeefarm. Good for you! But why disparage the competition?

    I like "raw" honey. I also like "processed" honey. I'll admit that I don't see as much difference between "raw" honey and honey that has been filtered at the 500-micron level (all pollens should go through such a filter) and heated to 110F to help it flow through "processing" as the discussion on this thread would make me believe exists.

  10. #290
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    Jul 2006
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    Grahamsville, NY
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    Quote Originally Posted by Roland View Post
    Boris - Did I miss your lab results?...Crazy Roland
    Roland,

    I uploaded my video here:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E5bWyeDKXgc

    But I will post my comments on it AFTER Ian’s reply to my questions about BeeMade’s HONEY processing technology from my previous post.


    Ian,

    I would like to know HOW your packagers make a final product (temperature, time, filtration).Please do not tell me about standards - just simply describe in details a PROCESS.

    Alberta Honey Producers processes and packages honey for its members.
    http://www.beemaid.com/alberta-honey-producers
    or
    Manitoba Honey Cooperative processes and packages honey for its members and purchases raw wax.
    http://www.beemaid.com/manitoba-honey-producers


    Boris Romanov
    Last edited by Boris; 02-13-2013 at 10:18 AM.

  11. #291
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    I couldn't find a definition of "honey" in your video, Boris. Did I watch the right video? All I saw was a demonstration of an inefficient way to warm crystallized honey.

  12. #292
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    My video is not about "an inefficient way to warm crystallized honey".

    Please read my previous post . I stated: "But I will post my comments on it AFTER Ian’s reply to my questions about BeeMade’s HONEY processing technology from my previous post."

    See my request to Ian also.


    Boris Romanov

  13. #293
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    My mistake. I believed the video was the "explanation" you said you would make in video form:

    I need a brake to make a short video with explanation of my opinion. -Boris, post #249
    I didn't see anything demonstrating any difference between "raw honey" ("honey?") and "processed honey" ("not honey any longer?") in the video. I did see a hair dryer being used in an open room to blow warm air at two glass jars containing honey. The honey appeared to be crystallized, considering that I saw no change in its form while it was suspended in open jars over plates. That is, I believe that liquid honey would flow out of such containers, and this did not; hence, it appeared "solid," or crystallized to me. I consider using open air to warm honey that way to be a very inefficient way to transfer energy.

    Keep in mind that when making videos such as these, what the viewer perceives may be very different than what the producer intends.

  14. #294
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    Fair Grove,MO,USA
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    Kieck, i don't have to disparage the competition, when i sell raw honey at the Farmers Market, my customers tell me that there is no comparision between the two.With all the call backs of food stuff from the retail stores people are becoming more aware of what they eat and feed there families,and that's a good thing.I'm not big time, i only produce 2000 to 4000 lbs. of honey per year for local sales, but usually sell out before the first of the year.Had a little better year last year and have 7 quarts left, but it's spoke for.I enjoy selling fresh veg. and honey at the local Farmers Market and answering questions about honey bees. (if i can.

  15. #295
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    Jacksonville, NC
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    218

    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    Quote Originally Posted by deknow View Post
    I like raw honey. I make my living selling raw honey. I spend much of my time teaching others the beauty of raw honey (beekeepers and customers).
    Deknow
    What is the beauty of raw honey? Could you elaborate on it?
    Lets pretend...I am a potential customer, sort of confused about all the "information" I hear and read about honey...I like honey...but I am sort of on the fence after being wrapped in all the noise about what is or what is not considered honey...Then, I meet you, or Ramona and say, please help me understand the beauty of raw honey. What would you tell me?
    Thanks!

  16. #296
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    I think that's great, brooksbeefarm. Like I wrote, you identified a market, you've meet the demands of that niche market, and it seems to be working well for both you and the customers. Well done!

    So why make statements about "processed honey" being so inferior that it doesn't even qualify as the same thing?

    At the risk of going down a different rabbit hole, I witnessed an instance where a few people swore that they could detect differences between the two major brands of colas, blind. The person who put them to the test mixed the two brands equally before putting them into paper cups marked "A" and "B." Those tasting insisted that one was one brand, and the other cup contained the other brand (although they were not consistent from person to person about whether the cups marked "A" contained the same brand). They also all avowed that the liquids in cups "A" and "B" were markedly different, so distinct that it was "easy" to tell the difference.

    Sometimes, I think items that we expect to taste differently do simply because we expect it.

  17. #297
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    Leominster, MA USA
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    174

    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    Quote Originally Posted by apis maximus View Post
    What is the beauty of raw honey? Could you elaborate on it?
    Lets pretend...I am a potential customer, sort of confused about all the "information" I hear and read about honey...I like honey...but I am sort of on the fence after being wrapped in all the noise about what is or what is not considered honey...Then, I meet you, or Ramona and say, please help me understand the beauty of raw honey. What would you tell me?
    Thanks!
    No need to elaborate...We just hand over the tasting sticks...

  18. #298
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    Jacksonville, NC
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    Thanks Ramona! Easy enough...but since we are communicating with words, most of the time anyways, and since deknow said :"I spend much of my time teaching others the beauty of raw honey (beekeepers and customers)", I was thinking... maybe we can have a conversation about it.
    Certainly handing out tasting sticks of something that soothingly touches and caresses ones tasting buds, is a great strategy, would it be all that it takes to have that "teaching" experience?

  19. #299
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    Grahamsville, NY
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    Quote Originally Posted by Kieck View Post
    ... I consider using open air to warm honey that way to be a very inefficient way to transfer energy...
    Please STOP to misinform forum's members, because I already answer to your question:
    "My video is not about "an inefficient way to warm crystallized honey"." (Post # 292)

    And I also stated: "But I will post my comments on it AFTER Ian’s reply to my questions about BeeMade’s HONEY processing technology from my previous post."
    Are you in rush?

    In fact you never confirmed that you have bees.
    Could you do it now? Otherwise - this is my last reply to your posts.

  20. #300
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    Default Re: Tests Show Most Store Honey Isnít Honey

    300+ posts into a discussion you started about what is and what is not honey isn't too soon to offer a rough definition. It's hard to consider anything short of that a discussion.

    deknow
    The perils of benefactors; The blessings of parasites; Blindness blindness and sight -Joni Mitchell 'Shadows and Light'

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