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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    26,582

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    Quote Originally Posted by BeeGhost View Post
    Just curious what kind of "turf wars" happen between commercial or sideliner beekeepers! Also, how about under cutting prices to get pollination contracts?
    Just looking for some good stories whether you experienced it or have heard a good story on what happened to another beekeeper!
    Why?
    Mark Berninghausen "That which works, persists."

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX, USA
    Posts
    1,764

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    Good titles Adrian
    Time to be a gypsy again, 2014 will be my prep year, my bees want a better area with actual rainfall.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Outagamie County, Wisconsin USA
    Posts
    883

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    Call it.............. Going for the Gold!

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX, USA
    Posts
    1,764

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    I like it!
    Time to be a gypsy again, 2014 will be my prep year, my bees want a better area with actual rainfall.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Springfield, MO, USA
    Posts
    102

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    When I first moved to Springfield, Missouri from Indiana, I worked for a supposedly commercial beekeeper here (he claims to run 700 hives, but has to buy 400 nucs every year to maintain that number). He threatened me physically if I ever told anyone about his beeyard locations or the fact that he puts hives on the Conservation Areas. Told me he would put Sevin in any of my hives that he found within 5 miles of his hives.

    Angriest person I every met. I only worked for him a short time but I still remember how people kept asking me "Wow, you're still working for him? No one has ever lasted this long." I was told he assaulted an 85 year old man who criticized his nucs (that was the straw that broke the camel's back and caused the store to cancel his contract despite years of open hostility towards the customers). He is the only person I've ever heard of who was kicked out of a bee club.

    ON another note, I know of at least two states where there are multiple bee Associations because the beekeepers could not get along well enough to stay together in one club. So they split and compete against each other.
    Jeffrey Maddox
    www.MaddoxBees.com

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX, USA
    Posts
    1,764

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    I am part of a fish forum.
    A garden forum
    and 2 bee forums.
    And beekeepers do seem to have more prominent "stingers".

    Fish people are great and help each other. But then the odds of my aquarium fish invading someone else's aquarium are pretty low.

    Aquarium services are sometimes like beekeepers. There are only so many tanks to take care of. we don't share well. (I share better than most, trying to get out of it.)
    Time to be a gypsy again, 2014 will be my prep year, my bees want a better area with actual rainfall.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Livermore, CA
    Posts
    1,383

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    Quote Originally Posted by sqkcrk View Post
    Why?
    Just because, I remember when I first came onto this site one of the threads I read was talking about how some beekeepers would run over other beekeepers hives in the citrus orchards in Florida. And also about that poisoning of bees that happened there a well. The thing that got the wheels turning on this is seeing the hives starting to arrive for almond pollination, and how I am seeing adds on Craigslist for lower than the going price, basically cut throat stuff. Just curious is all. If you need more information, feel free to ask if this answer is not good enough for you. Better yet, PM me if you think I have left something out.
    Last edited by BeeGhost; 01-18-2013 at 10:03 PM.
    Coyote Creek Bees

  8. #28
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Livermore, CA
    Posts
    1,383

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    Quote Originally Posted by Flyer Jim View Post
    So BeeGhost, does this thread have anything to do with this thread http://www.beesource.com/forums/show...appy-beekeeper!! ? I thought you might be stepping on some toes out there. You'll find lots of toes to step on in the delta.
    Not stepping on any toes out here, I already made that clear with the farmer that if there is an issue I will move my bees. Not like I have the best spot on the entire 2500+ acres anyhow. The commercial guy that uses this guys land has been doing it for 20+ years I am told and he gets the yards on the flat land that is easy to get to, I get to use a place that is not quite as easy to get to and sure as heck would not get a large truck and trailer into. There was also another beekeeper that placed his hives on this land also, but from what I heard he wasn't respecting the land and was going to be asked to leave, but that is not my business, that's the farmers and I don't even know if it happened.

    Im sure there are lots of toes to step on out here in the delta, and I don't plan on doing that at all, I am a small fish in the big sea. The only way I would go sideliner status is if I locked up some land that was all to myself. I don't see that happening out here as there are far stronger ties than what I have.

    You guys sure like to assume a lot of things!!! If you want i'll start another thread on how to croche tea cozies if that makes you feel more secure about things....................just saying!! Oh ya, does my how to raise queens thread threaten anyone?? Hopefully OHB or other large queen breeders don't get offended or threatened when I start mass producing 20 queens or so a year, I might just put them out of business!!

    I love having to explain myself!!! I'll be sure to return the favor!!
    Coyote Creek Bees

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Solano, California, USA
    Posts
    1,301

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    Quote Originally Posted by BeeGhost View Post
    Just curious what kind of "turf wars" happen between commercial or sideliner beekeepers! Also, how about under cutting prices to get pollination contracts?
    Just looking for some good stories whether you experienced it or have heard a good story on what happened to another beekeeper!

    Not sure if many people have a big issue with price competition........ Rarely an issue in the long run cause the guy who undercuts everyone, especially dramatically usually gets out of the business from lack of capital fairly quickly.

    Regarding jumping on established yards that's a whole different story. AKA "let the buyer" beware as stated so adeptly in the third person by MR. Logger mike. Yard jumpers in this industry are / have been dealt with like claim jumpers in the 1850's. Most commercial guys don't mind if a hive or two steps in their zone by a hobbyist but beyond that problems often arise anytime someone steps on another guys long established territory.

    Acknowledged in most places its legal to do so but patently unwise.

    There are two types of rules in all societies. The written ones and the unwritten ones. Most long established bee guys know the long established unwritten ones and follow them. Don't jump or steal another beeks yards!!!!!!!!!

    Those who don't are shunned and are the folks who culminate their carrier as the person that everyone in the business avoids like a "friendly" lady with AIDS. Some times the "law breakers" face other "justice" as previously stated by the Logger whose "examples" are from an area I might call "turf war hell" from stories that come out of Northern California . Most good bee territory is long ago taken......A very long time ago at that. Many newbees think of this business as a free-for-all which it surely is not.

    If you decide to grow big be patient and buy someone out when they retire.... Especially if someone is leaving you hints that you are in the "wrong" place. Prudent judiciousness will save you time and heartache if nothing else.

    With all the technology today...... With Satellites, Remote control aircraft, Regular planes, Spy cameras, gps units.... Its fairly easy to find a jumper for those willing to invest the time to "secure" their beespace. Those who are known to bee "wise" in finding new yards wisely utilize the same resources and make sure they aren't in the wrong spot before the put bees in that big "new" yard... be they new or old at this business.

    Don't expect that your hives will be Bee "GHOSTS" IN their new yards... Someone is already looking out for them before you even put them down. . Guaranteed.

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    NE Calif.
    Posts
    2,297

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    Very well said, Honey4 all. All the best territory was taken long ago in California.Over the years I managed to step on some toes , and got mine stepped on too! As a general rule, if it looks like a great bee location, it is already taken.

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    IG, Slovenia
    Posts
    21

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    Beekeeping turf wars begin when beekeepers start using shanks instead of their normal beekeepers tools.


  12. #32
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Solano, California, USA
    Posts
    1,301

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    Quote Originally Posted by Markwell View Post
    Beekeeping turf wars begin when beekeepers start using shanks instead of their normal beekeepers tools.

    Shanks ?

  13. #33
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    Livermore, CA
    Posts
    1,383

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    Honey-4-all,

    I appreciate your advise. I do believe that I am not cutting in on anyone by obtaining this spot. It isn't like this is a whim. This has been in the works for a few months, and I am quite sure the farmers I am dealing with have talked to the long time beekeeper, due to the questions that were asked of me when I met with the farmer to go to the location that I can place my hives. I was asked how many hives, my answer is no more than twenty, the number of hives I can fit on my 16' trailer. I also stated that they will always be on the trailer and not set on the ground, that way if I need to move them in a hurry, I can strap down, hook up and roll and be out in one trip.

    Now I havnt met the commercial guy yet, but I would like to. I am sure he is getting ready for almonds, but not positive. Actually, I don't even know how many hives this guy has, since the farmer actually has a guy come from Washington to pollinate his 600 acres of almonds.

    Im not out to cut anyones throat. Im not out to undercut someones honey prices to have the local health food store carry my honey. And I sure don't plan on getting big enough to have to warrant buying specialized equipment.

    If any of you on here have hives in the Manteca/Tracy/Lathrop area..........feel free to PM me and I will tell you exactly where I plan to put my bee trailer. Or if you know the person in those areas, or people in those areas, again, feel free to PM me.

    And another question, why would a commercial guy care about someone with 20 hives compared to their..........who knows how many hives?

    Looks like I have ruffled some feathers, didn't mean to by any means, just basically found a place to keep my HOBBY close to home and now I feel like I am being treated like a claim jumper.

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Myrtle Beach, SC, USA
    Posts
    874

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    How does someone define someones beespace, in miles or acres.
    https://www.facebook.com/stevesbees99
    Please visit my page, Thanks

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    IG, Slovenia
    Posts
    21

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    Quote Originally Posted by Honey-4-All View Post
    Shanks ?
    A shank is a crudely, improvised knife (also called a shiv).
    It was a joke, dear sir.

  16. #36
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    26,582

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    Quote Originally Posted by BeeGhost View Post
    Just because, I remember when I first came onto this site one of the threads I read was talking about how some beekeepers would run over other beekeepers hives in the citrus orchards in Florida. And also about that poisoning of bees that happened there a well. The thing that got the wheels turning on this is seeing the hives starting to arrive for almond pollination, and how I am seeing adds on Craigslist for lower than the going price, basically cut throat stuff. Just curious is all. If you need more information, feel free to ask if this answer is not good enough for you. Better yet, PM me if you think I have left something out.
    Thanks. Just curious about where you were coming from.

    Turf wars happen. I imagine in all industries.
    Mark Berninghausen "That which works, persists."

  17. #37
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    26,582

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    Quote Originally Posted by BeeGhost View Post
    Honey-4-all,

    I appreciate your advise. I do believe that I am not cutting in on anyone by obtaining this spot. It isn't like this is a whim. This has been in the works for a few months, and I am quite sure the farmers I am dealing with have talked to the long time beekeeper, due to the questions that were asked of me when I met with the farmer to go to the location that I can place my hives. I was asked how many hives, my answer is no more than twenty, the number of hives I can fit on my 16' trailer. I also stated that they will always be on the trailer and not set on the ground, that way if I need to move them in a hurry, I can strap down, hook up and roll and be out in one trip.

    Now I havnt met the commercial guy yet, but I would like to. I am sure he is getting ready for almonds, but not positive. Actually, I don't even know how many hives this guy has, since the farmer actually has a guy come from Washington to pollinate his 600 acres of almonds.

    Im not out to cut anyones throat. Im not out to undercut someones honey prices to have the local health food store carry my honey. And I sure don't plan on getting big enough to have to warrant buying specialized equipment.

    If any of you on here have hives in the Manteca/Tracy/Lathrop area..........feel free to PM me and I will tell you exactly where I plan to put my bee trailer. Or if you know the person in those areas, or people in those areas, again, feel free to PM me.

    And another question, why would a commercial guy care about someone with 20 hives compared to their..........who knows how many hives?

    Looks like I have ruffled some feathers, didn't mean to by any means, just basically found a place to keep my HOBBY close to home and now I feel like I am being treated like a claim jumper.

    Correct me if I am wrong, but, it looks like you are planning on setting 20 hives in or adjacent to an almond grove perminently. Is that right? A grove that a commercial beekeeper gets paid to pollinate? If that's accurate, that 20 fewer hives which the grove owner needs to pay for. So, in effect, you are taking money out of someones pocket, if that is so.

    Also, I wouldn't think that having a yard perminently established in an almond grove would be a good idea regarding hive health, what w/ all the spraying which will be going on there.
    Mark Berninghausen "That which works, persists."

  18. #38
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    SNOW SHOE PA USA
    Posts
    1,210

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    Quote Originally Posted by Markwell View Post
    Beekeeping turf wars begin when beekeepers start using shanks instead of their normal beekeepers tools.

    Tonight on fox ! I know i would watch / With all the reality shows out there it may just last a year!
    Fight on beekeepers .
    Say hello to the bad guy!
    year five==== 31 hives==== T{OAV}

  19. #39
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
    Location
    Richardson, TX, USA
    Posts
    84

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    I'm new enough to beekeeping that I haven't run into any issues with my hives being too close to another beek's hives but since I'm planning on growing my own beekeeping operation I've often wondered about whether those issues are taking place out there. I do feel that individual's putting in new yards should be respectful of other beek's established yard locations. If they are aware of another beek's large bee yard being close by then they should act smart about their decisions. Putting in another yard too close to an existing yard only causes problems for both beeks at a time when the original yard was already there and not having a problem. Having said that, I also understand that what is one person's opinion of the nectar and pollen providing capacity of an area is not the same as another person's opinion.

  20. #40
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Outagamie County, Wisconsin USA
    Posts
    883

    Default Re: Has anyone ever had a confontation with another beekeeper, especially sideline/co

    I am curious why some beeks seem to think that a landowner/farmer doesn't have any rights and seems to be left out of the equation? (Not talking about going against contracts) What about land that is sold or inherited by family? What about the fact that there can be multiple owners all with their own acreage? Farmer A can have hives and Farmer B cannot? Messing with someone else's property (bees and equipment or even the land) to cause damage and loss of bees is dishonest and another form of stealing. That's what it boils down to. Be gentle.....

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