Good titles Adrian
Call it.............. Going for the Gold!
I like it!
When I first moved to Springfield, Missouri from Indiana, I worked for a supposedly commercial beekeeper here (he claims to run 700 hives, but has to buy 400 nucs every year to maintain that number). He threatened me physically if I ever told anyone about his beeyard locations or the fact that he puts hives on the Conservation Areas. Told me he would put Sevin in any of my hives that he found within 5 miles of his hives.
Angriest person I every met. I only worked for him a short time but I still remember how people kept asking me "Wow, you're still working for him? No one has ever lasted this long." I was told he assaulted an 85 year old man who criticized his nucs (that was the straw that broke the camel's back and caused the store to cancel his contract despite years of open hostility towards the customers). He is the only person I've ever heard of who was kicked out of a bee club.
ON another note, I know of at least two states where there are multiple bee Associations because the beekeepers could not get along well enough to stay together in one club. So they split and compete against each other.
I am part of a fish forum.
A garden forum
and 2 bee forums.
And beekeepers do seem to have more prominent "stingers".
Fish people are great and help each other. But then the odds of my aquarium fish invading someone else's aquarium are pretty low.
Aquarium services are sometimes like beekeepers. There are only so many tanks to take care of. we don't share well. (I share better than most, trying to get out of it.)
Last edited by BeeGhost; 01-18-2013 at 10:03 PM.
Coyote Creek Bees
Im sure there are lots of toes to step on out here in the delta, and I don't plan on doing that at all, I am a small fish in the big sea. The only way I would go sideliner status is if I locked up some land that was all to myself. I don't see that happening out here as there are far stronger ties than what I have.
You guys sure like to assume a lot of things!!! If you want i'll start another thread on how to croche tea cozies if that makes you feel more secure about things....................just saying!! Oh ya, does my how to raise queens thread threaten anyone?? Hopefully OHB or other large queen breeders don't get offended or threatened when I start mass producing 20 queens or so a year, I might just put them out of business!!
I love having to explain myself!!! I'll be sure to return the favor!!
Coyote Creek Bees
Not sure if many people have a big issue with price competition........ Rarely an issue in the long run cause the guy who undercuts everyone, especially dramatically usually gets out of the business from lack of capital fairly quickly.
Regarding jumping on established yards that's a whole different story. AKA "let the buyer" beware as stated so adeptly in the third person by MR. Logger mike. Yard jumpers in this industry are / have been dealt with like claim jumpers in the 1850's. Most commercial guys don't mind if a hive or two steps in their zone by a hobbyist but beyond that problems often arise anytime someone steps on another guys long established territory.
Acknowledged in most places its legal to do so but patently unwise.
There are two types of rules in all societies. The written ones and the unwritten ones. Most long established bee guys know the long established unwritten ones and follow them. Don't jump or steal another beeks yards!!!!!!!!!
Those who don't are shunned and are the folks who culminate their carrier as the person that everyone in the business avoids like a "friendly" lady with AIDS. Some times the "law breakers" face other "justice" as previously stated by the Logger whose "examples" are from an area I might call "turf war hell" from stories that come out of Northern California . Most good bee territory is long ago taken......A very long time ago at that. Many newbees think of this business as a free-for-all which it surely is not.
If you decide to grow big be patient and buy someone out when they retire.... Especially if someone is leaving you hints that you are in the "wrong" place. Prudent judiciousness will save you time and heartache if nothing else.
With all the technology today...... With Satellites, Remote control aircraft, Regular planes, Spy cameras, gps units.... Its fairly easy to find a jumper for those willing to invest the time to "secure" their beespace. Those who are known to bee "wise" in finding new yards wisely utilize the same resources and make sure they aren't in the wrong spot before the put bees in that big "new" yard... be they new or old at this business.
Don't expect that your hives will be Bee "GHOSTS" IN their new yards... Someone is already looking out for them before you even put them down. . Guaranteed.
Very well said, Honey4 all. All the best territory was taken long ago in California.Over the years I managed to step on some toes , and got mine stepped on too! As a general rule, if it looks like a great bee location, it is already taken.
Beekeeping turf wars begin when beekeepers start using shanks instead of their normal beekeepers tools.
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I appreciate your advise. I do believe that I am not cutting in on anyone by obtaining this spot. It isn't like this is a whim. This has been in the works for a few months, and I am quite sure the farmers I am dealing with have talked to the long time beekeeper, due to the questions that were asked of me when I met with the farmer to go to the location that I can place my hives. I was asked how many hives, my answer is no more than twenty, the number of hives I can fit on my 16' trailer. I also stated that they will always be on the trailer and not set on the ground, that way if I need to move them in a hurry, I can strap down, hook up and roll and be out in one trip.
Now I havnt met the commercial guy yet, but I would like to. I am sure he is getting ready for almonds, but not positive. Actually, I don't even know how many hives this guy has, since the farmer actually has a guy come from Washington to pollinate his 600 acres of almonds.
Im not out to cut anyones throat. Im not out to undercut someones honey prices to have the local health food store carry my honey. And I sure don't plan on getting big enough to have to warrant buying specialized equipment.
If any of you on here have hives in the Manteca/Tracy/Lathrop area..........feel free to PM me and I will tell you exactly where I plan to put my bee trailer. Or if you know the person in those areas, or people in those areas, again, feel free to PM me.
And another question, why would a commercial guy care about someone with 20 hives compared to their..........who knows how many hives?
Looks like I have ruffled some feathers, didn't mean to by any means, just basically found a place to keep my HOBBY close to home and now I feel like I am being treated like a claim jumper.
How does someone define someones beespace, in miles or acres.
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Correct me if I am wrong, but, it looks like you are planning on setting 20 hives in or adjacent to an almond grove perminently. Is that right? A grove that a commercial beekeeper gets paid to pollinate? If that's accurate, that 20 fewer hives which the grove owner needs to pay for. So, in effect, you are taking money out of someones pocket, if that is so.
Also, I wouldn't think that having a yard perminently established in an almond grove would be a good idea regarding hive health, what w/ all the spraying which will be going on there.
I'm new enough to beekeeping that I haven't run into any issues with my hives being too close to another beek's hives but since I'm planning on growing my own beekeeping operation I've often wondered about whether those issues are taking place out there. I do feel that individual's putting in new yards should be respectful of other beek's established yard locations. If they are aware of another beek's large bee yard being close by then they should act smart about their decisions. Putting in another yard too close to an existing yard only causes problems for both beeks at a time when the original yard was already there and not having a problem. Having said that, I also understand that what is one person's opinion of the nectar and pollen providing capacity of an area is not the same as another person's opinion.
I am curious why some beeks seem to think that a landowner/farmer doesn't have any rights and seems to be left out of the equation? (Not talking about going against contracts) What about land that is sold or inherited by family? What about the fact that there can be multiple owners all with their own acreage? Farmer A can have hives and Farmer B cannot? Messing with someone else's property (bees and equipment or even the land) to cause damage and loss of bees is dishonest and another form of stealing. That's what it boils down to. Be gentle.....