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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Montgomery County, NY
    Posts
    1,596

    Default Time for newer truck

    My mechanic has convinced me its time for a newer truck. I think I will keep my old F450 as a local yard truck but that will be it.

    I am kind of curious what everyone would buy if they were to buy a newer truck.

    Would it be a 20+ foot flatbed like a freightliner, F550, Ram 5500?

    I am leaning towards 20 - 25 foot flatbed. It seems like the most readily available are Freightliners.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Herrick, SD USA
    Posts
    4,226

    Default Re: Time for newer truck

    Quote Originally Posted by BMAC View Post
    My mechanic has convinced me its time for a newer truck. I think I will keep my old F450 as a local yard truck but that will be it.

    I am kind of curious what everyone would buy if they were to buy a newer truck.

    Would it be a 20+ foot flatbed like a freightliner, F550, Ram 5500?

    I am leaning towards 20 - 25 foot flatbed. It seems like the most readily available are Freightliners.
    I love my Ram 5500 but if you think a bigger truck is a better fit for what you want from a truck then I would second your notion of a Freightliner with a 20' flatbed (7 rows of standard pallets) and a wb somewhere around 230". There are some great buys out there in used trucks with gvw's of 26k just try to learn something about the history of the truck. I bought an IH like that a couple of years ago and had a really bad experience with some shoddy mechanical work that had been done to it, cost me 5,000 in repairs the first year (improperly torqued injectors) but no problems since. A bigger truck can handle up to 9 ton compared to about 5 with the 5500. Choose the tool that works best for the majority of your hauling.
    "People will generally accept facts as truth only if the facts agree with what they already believe."- Andy Rooney

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Salem, Oregon
    Posts
    938

    Default Re: Time for newer truck

    If you EVER plan to take this truck into California, you would be advised to carefully read the following link regarding emissions.
    There are a lot of good deals on trucks right now but spending a little more on a slightly newer one could save you $10000.00 - $15000.00 in upfitting and then replacement according to this:

    http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/onrdies...s/FSRegSum.pdf
    I have exactly ONE hive more than you.
    That makes my opinion beyond question.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Montgomery County, NY
    Posts
    1,596

    Default Re: Time for newer truck

    Thanks Harry. I dont much care about Ca. If my bees go there it will not be on any truck I own.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Mesa Arizona USA
    Posts
    163

    Default Re: Time for newer truck

    Hello Bmac, I am curious as to how old your truck is mileage and motor ie 6.0 7.3 or what. just curious thanks
    George Brenner @ www.valleyhoneyco.com
    Mesa, AZ

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Mesa Arizona USA
    Posts
    163

    Default Re: Time for newer truck

    Quote Originally Posted by HarryVanderpool View Post
    If you EVER plan to take this truck into California, you would be advised to carefully read the following link regarding emissions.
    There are a lot of good deals on trucks right now but spending a little more on a slightly newer one could save you $10000.00 - $15000.00 in upfitting and then replacement according to this:

    http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/onrdies...s/FSRegSum.pdf
    Harry thnk you very much for the link. I have been hearing of these new calif. regs for some time but have never been able to find anything in print. I bought a 2003 F-550 with a new motor and was curious how long it could be legal in calif. I planned to run it to Calif. for the almonds even though my buddy Jim Lyon cut me to the quick with a post about the 6.0 motor thanks again GB
    George Brenner @ www.valleyhoneyco.com
    Mesa, AZ

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Reno, NV USA
    Posts
    2,310

    Default Re: Time for newer truck

    I purchased a 24' international flatbed a few years ago and will add my two cents. If you have a forklift you might want to consider a shorter bed and stack the hives two pallets high. Unless you plan on getting a commercial license, a 26k gvwr will probably only get you a single layer on a 24' bed (maybe 50% more with a lower curb weight truck or not heavy with honey). Driving around with 30 feet of truck plus another 15' of forklift trailer is a pain in the rear in some places. The guys that have the "A" or "B" licenses have to deal with all the IFTA garbage plus some extra regs that someone else more knowledgeable that me can weigh in on. If you stick with a "C" license and a 26k GVWR then a 16 foot bed with 26GVWR can carry almost as many hives but you need to stack them. For short runs to out yards I wish I had a smaller truck. For trips into California, the longer bed does allow fewer trips. One of each would be great.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Herrick, SD USA
    Posts
    4,226

    Default Re: Time for newer truck

    Quote Originally Posted by G B View Post
    Harry thnk you very much for the link. I have been hearing of these new calif. regs for some time but have never been able to find anything in print. I bought a 2003 F-550 with a new motor and was curious how long it could be legal in calif. I planned to run it to Calif. for the almonds even though my buddy Jim Lyon cut me to the quick with a post about the 6.0 motor thanks again GB
    Ah yes, the infamous 6.uh oh Don't worry George they can't all be bad. Actually I had a pretty good Ford diesel mechanic say they are a pretty good engine as long as you keep good fuel in them but the injectors just don't tolerate any fuel gelling incidents. We load our 26k IH to 30,000 a lot here locally but wouldn't want to try to do it interstate.
    "People will generally accept facts as truth only if the facts agree with what they already believe."- Andy Rooney

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Montgomery County, NY
    Posts
    1,596

    Default Re: Time for newer truck

    My F450 is actually an F Superduty. It pre F450 days as its a 97 with the 7.3 engine. Not many miles to speak of only 170k. I have a 95 F250 flatbed capable of pulling my skidsteer where I need it to go so pulling a skidsteer behind it isn't terribly important. Being able to run equipment to and over a semi load back from Ga is fairly important at this point though. I talked with a guy that hauls alot of hives and he stated if I am going with single rear axle then anything over 18 feet is a waste, so if I lean more towards 25 foot flatbed then get the tandem rears in it.

    I know the issue with my F450 is computer related. I will eventually fixed it as its got posi 5.13 gears in it which is great locally for the hills. I just need to replace some of the sensors and such. Its crazy because my 95 f250 has 7.3 powerstroke and I have 390K on that truck and it runs like a champ. All the power in the world, just lite on truck!

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Salem, Oregon
    Posts
    938

    Default Re: Time for newer truck

    I recieved confirmation from O-DOT and Oregon Farm Bureau that our interpretation is correct.
    Farm trucks that meet the requirement under MAP-21 Section 32934, and are under 26001 pounds are exempt from the listed regulations ANYWHER IN THE COUNTRY.

    MAP-21 Amendments Affecting the Transportation of Agricultural Commodities and Farm Supplies: FAQs

    What statutory exemptions from trucking safety regulations are included in MAP-21 for the trucking operations in the agriculturalindustry?
    Answer: Section 32101 of MAP-21 provides a statutory exemption from the hours-of-service regulations for certain carriers transporting agricultural commodities and farm supplies, and section 32934 provides a statutory exemption from most of the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations for the operation of covered farm vehicles by farm and ranch operators, their employees and family members, under certain circumstances.
    Note the first exemption does not place restrictions on the type of carrier using the exemption while the second exemption is strictly limited to farm and ranch operators. Both statutory provisions are self-executing and take effect on October 1, 2012.
    Which carriers and drivers may take advantage of those exemptions?
    Answer:
    There are two separate MAP-21 statutory exemptions for the agricultural industry. They are section 32101(d), “Transportation of Agricultural Commodities and Farm Supplies,”and section 32934, “Exemptions from Requirements for Covered Farm Vehicles.”

    Section 32101(d):

    Section 32101(d), provides relief from the Federal hours-of-service (HOS) rules during the planting and harvesting seasons, as determined by the States in which the carriers are operating. This exemption covers:

    (A) drivers transporting agricultural commodities from the source of the agricultural commodities to a location within a 150 air-mile radius from the source;

    (B) drivers transporting farm supplies for agricultural purposes from a wholesale or retail distribution point of the farm supplies to a farm or other location where the farm supplies are intended to be used within a 150 air-mile radius from the distribution point; or

    (C) drivers transporting farm supplies for agricultural purposes from a wholesale distribution point of the farm supplies to a retail distribution point of the farm supplies within a 150 air-mile radius from the wholesale distribution point.


    Section 32934:
    Section 32934 provides a statutory exemption from most of the FMCSRs, including those pertaining to commercial driver’s licenses (CDL) and driver physical qualifications (medical) requirements, for the operation of “covered farm vehicles” by farm and ranch operators, their employees, and certain other specified individuals under specific circumstances. The operation of “covered farm vehicles” is exempt from:

    49 CFR Part 383: Commercial Driver’s License Standards; Requirements and Penalties

    49 CFR Part 382: Controlled Substances and Alcohol Use and Testing

    49 CFR Part 391, Subpart E: Physical Qualifications and Examinations

    49 CFR Part 395: Hours of Service

    49 CFR Part 396: Inspection, Repair and Maintenance

    The term “covered farm vehicle” includes any commercial motor vehicle (CMV)(defined in 49 CFR 390.5, but excluding vehicles transporting hazardous materials in a quantity requiring placards), traveling in the State in which the vehicle is registered or another State, and:
    (a) Is operated by—
    (i) a farm owner or operator, or an employee or family member of the farm owner or operator; or
    (ii) a ranch owner or operator; or an employee or family member of the ranch owner or operator.

    (b) Is being used to transport to or from a farm or ranch—
    (i) agricultural commodities;
    (ii) livestock; or
    (iii) machinery or supplies;

    (c) Is equipped with a special license plate or other designation by the State in which the vehicle is registered to allow for identification of the vehicle as a farm vehicle by law enforcement personnel; and

    (d) Has a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR), gross combination weight rating (GCWR) or gross vehicle weight or gross combination weight, whichever is greater, that is—
    (i) 26,001 pounds or less, for vehicles operating in interstate commerce anywhere in the United States; or
    (ii) greater than 26,001 pounds and traveling in interstate commercewithin the State in which it is registered, or
    (iii) greater than 26,001 pounds and traveling in interstate commercewithin 150 air miles of the farm or ranch with respect to which the vehicle is being operated, regardless of whether it is being operating within the State it is registered.

    Does FMCSA have to amend the Federal Motor Carrier Safety Regulations (FMCSRs) in order for the exemption to take effect?
    Answer: No. The exemptions take effect on October 1, 2012 because the statutory provisions are self-executing. This means motor carriers and drivers may use the applicable exemptions at any time beginning on or after October 1, 2012, even though FMCSA has not amended the FMCSRs. The Agency will amend its rules later this year to reflect the statutory language.
    When does FMCSA plan to change the current regulations to include the MAP-21 language and why are there delays in making those changes?
    Answer: The Agency will change its regulations later this year to reflect the statutory language. Additional time is needed because any changes to regulatory text require a rulemaking notice to be published in the Federal Register, even in those cases in which the reason for the change is a statutory provision. In this case, because the statutory exemptions are self-executing (i.e., take effect automatically), the rulemaking notice would be a final rule, rather than a proposed rule requesting public comment, followed by a final rule.
    Are the States required to make changes to their safety regulations in response to the MAP-21 exemptions?
    Answer: Yes, but not until after October 1, 2012. However, FMCSA requests that States immediately take action to put into place policies and procedures to provide the regulatory relief provided by MAP-21. The Agency will amend the FMCSRs to reflect the MAP-21 language and the States will then be required as a condition of receiving Motor Carrier Safety Assistance Program (MCSAP) funding, to adopt and enforce compatible safety regulations. After FMCSA changes its regulations, the effective date of that rule would begin the 3-year period during which the States must adopt compatible regulations to remain eligible for MCSAP funding.

    What is MCSAP?
    Answer: MCSAP is a Federal grant program that provides financial assistance to States to reduce the number and severity of crashes and hazardous materials incidents involving CMVs. The goal of the MCSAP is to reduce CMV-involved crashes, fatalities, and injuries through consistent, uniform, and effective CMV safety programs. The MCSAP rules (49 CFR Part 350) include conditions for participation by States and local jurisdictions and promote the adoption and uniform enforcement of safety rules, regulations and standards compatible with the FMCSRs and Federal Hazardous Materials Regulations (HMRs) for both interstate and intrastate motor carriers and drivers.


    States are required by 49 CFR 350.331 to amend their laws and regulations within 3 years after the effective date of any newly enacted regulation or amendment to the FMCSRs or HMRs. After FMCSA amends the FMCSRs to reflect the exemptions in sections 32101(d) and 32934, the States will have up to 3 years to adopt compatible regulations to remain eligible for MCSAP funding.

    With regard to hours of service (HOS), what’s the difference between the HOS-specific exemption and the HOS relief provided for the operation of “covered farm vehicles?”
    Answer: The primary difference between the HOS relief provided by section 32101(d) and section 32934 is that the first exemption includes a distance limitation of 150 air-miles for the transportation of the agricultural commodity or farm supplies.
    The second exemption limits the relief from the HOS rules to the operation of covered farm vehicles by farm and ranch operators (including their employees and family members) under certain circumstances. The second exemption also includes restrictions for covered farm vehicles with a gross weight or weight rating greater than 26,001pounds such that they may only use the exemption within the State in which the vehicle is registered, or within 150 air-miles from the ranch or farm with respect to which the vehicle is being operated.
    Therefore, the statutory HOS exemptions in MAP-21 may have an overlap with regard to certain farm and ranch operators during planting and harvesting seasons, as defined by the States in which the vehicles are being operated.
    I have exactly ONE hive more than you.
    That makes my opinion beyond question.

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