mite counts in tfb

[squarepeg]

primer: for the sake of this thread, and if barry is ok with it, it's not against any 'rule' to mention any intervention or treatment.

my interest in primarily toward understanding how beekeepers who avoid treatments deal with the varroa mite.

we all understand the bond method, but i am guessing that not all treatment free beekeepers are bond beekeepers.*

so, other than letting colonies just die out from varroa infestion, how do you who avoid treatments:

1. ascertain mite levels
2. decide on mite level that necessitates action
3. decide on an action, and what is it?



* if all treatment free beekeepers are bond beekeepers disregard this thread.

[Solomon Parker]

*In fact, not all of them are.

[squarepeg]

shewee, i was worried about that. i feel better now, thanks sol.

[Solomon Parker]

If you'd like me to explain the sort of actions one might take, the whys and why nots and whatnots, I can, but I'd rather leave it up to those who actually use those methods for now.

[squarepeg]

i would like anyone to feel free to chime in as they feel led to do so. i guess it would be more meaningful if folks are reporting real life experiences, but i don't mind the 'well, i was thinking i might try this.....' kind of post as well. at this point, i'm addicted to my laptop anyway, so it don't matter.

[Solomon Parker]

i'm addicted to my laptop anyway

Oh yeah?

[RedDave]

So, what is a "bond beekeeper"?

Dave

[Oldtimer]

Well, bizzare as it may sound, my hives that have a large (natural) amount of drone comb and drones, have done better mitewise than the hives that have a restricted amount of drones.

Of course that goes against everything we've ever been taught, we all know it's a fact that drones are mite factories, right!

It could be that i've only got a few TF hives and it was just chance. But anyhow I'm going to keep observing this to see if it starts looking like there's a correlation.

[Oldtimer]

So, what is a "bond beekeeper"?

Dave

James Bond as in live and let die. A Bond beekeeper does not do any mite treatment and if the hive is going to die he lets it. The theory is the strong survive and you breed from them. Actually I think there's another reason why the method got named the Bond method, but that's how most people remember it, live and let die.

[sfisher]

Im trying out small cell, queens that were born after june 15th, with a brood break, adding some survival feral stock. Nothing new just following in the footsteps of some others.

[sqkcrk]

primer: for the sake of this thread, and if barry is ok with it, it's not against any 'rule' to mention any intervention or treatment.

my interest in primarily toward understanding how beekeepers who avoid treatments deal with the varroa mite.

we all understand the bond method, but i am guessing that not all treatment free beekeepers are bond beekeepers.*

so, other than letting colonies just die out from varroa infestion, how do you who avoid treatments:

1. ascertain mite levels
2. decide on mite level that necessitates action
3. decide on an action, and what is it?



* if all treatment free beekeepers are bond beekeepers disregard this thread.

Apparently those who don't treat don't do much or any mite counting. When I asked if anyone was interested in participating in Randy Oliver's Monthly Mite Count Study I got a resounding "NO!!". So, sp, good luck w/ your Thread.

[StevenG]

hmmm I buy from treatment free breeders, and never do mite counts nor treat for mites. Haven't lost a hive to mites since starting this method, going on 6-7 years now. I guess that makes me a Bond Beekeeper.
Regards,
Steven

[jbeshearse]

hmmm I buy from treatment free breeders, and never do mite counts nor treat for mites. Haven't lost a hive to mites since starting this method, going on 6-7 years now. I guess that makes me a Bond Beekeeper.
Regards,
Steven

What have your losses been from?

[StevenG]

Mostly starvation late winter/early spring. Lost one hive to the small hive beetle. Lost a nuc to robbing. Had a newly hived swarm abscond.
Regards,
Steven

[squarepeg]

many thanks for the replys. i'm looking forward to joining the conversation, but the day job is holding me hostage.

[squarepeg]

i'm back, and just finished reading adam's new thread 'how long......'. i really enjoyed that.

i confess that my mite assessments didn't go beyond pulling a few drone larvae early in the season. i assumed all was well because the bees came from treatment free resistant stock, and by gross observation all appeared well as the season progressed. no mite treatments were used this year.

then i had a hive die. this one had been lagging behind the rest all along, but the number of mites i found in the alcohol wash took me by surprise. it makes me wonder if two other hives that i have, which are light on stores, are perhaps struggling with mites.

oldtimer, you have mentioned having several hives that you are managing treatment free. are you measuring mite loads in them? are you considering any intervention if they start to fail?

steveng, i know you've been at this for awhile, and i congratulate you for having one of the success stories. i mean no disrespect, but is it possible that your starvation and beetle losses occurred in colonies that were already weakened to some degree by mites? i think that you have mentioned having used 'soft treatments' in the past, can you elaborate on that? and, what is your approach to managing a hive that is in a death spiral?

[Oldtimer]

Yes I do a rough method of monitoring mites, just by eyeballing the brood and the odd bit of drone sampling, same as I do for my treated hives. Wouldn't recommend this method to anyone else though especially someone just starting out. It is VERY easy for someone to underestimate their mite numbers plus the damage they are doing, I see this all the time, your last post Squarepeg, gives an example. Many people think there is no mite problem, and only wonder after the hive is actually dead. But even then they'll often attribute it to something else, I've seen claims of starvation, when honey was 1/2 inch away from the cluster.

No I won't be intervening if they fail, goes a bit against the grain but to give it a fair shot I have to use exactly the same methods as those who claim success.

[squarepeg]

understood, thanks ot.

[Roland]

We check for mites in the drone brood with a cappings scraper.

More than one mite in a "coop" is concerning.

We strike drone brood at all times.

Crazy roland

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thanks roland. is a 'coop' a cappings scraper full of drone larvae? sounds like you don't normally see many mites, are you applying preventative treatments? by 'striking' drone brood at all times, you are getting rid of it, correct?