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  1. #1
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    Jun 2009
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    Default Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    I would like some advice on how or what to do.
    The Virginia State Beekeepers Association is having it's meeting next month and I'm shocked and amazed that one of the two speakers is Jerry Hayes, if your not familiar with him he is a honey bee guy that works for Monsanto!
    I just can not believe that the association is having him speak or thinks that he has beekeepers best interest. Am I just being crazy??
    I know that Jerry and Monsanto say they want to help control honey bee pest and find a solution for CCD but as far as I'm concerned they are the problem that's causing the CCD. Again I'm I crazy.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    It seems to me that you have two choices. You can go to the meeting and see what he has to say or you can presume he’s corrupt, without any evidence, and not attend.
    Dan www.boogerhillbee.com
    Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    Today was the annual meeting of the Maine State Beekeepers Association and one of the speakers was Jerry Hayes. The first portion of his talk, I thought, was very interesting as he discussed the historical background of CCD. The latter part of his talk, I thought, went too deeply in touting the wonders and benefits of Monsanto's genetically modified corn and it's contribution to the world's health, nutrition and well-being. It was necessary to go into this, I guess, since like the corn, the concept of mucking with the honeybees' RNA is apparently key to what was billed as Monsanto's quest to "control Honey Bee parasites and pathogens using non-chemical controls."

    Not sure what the "non-chemical" is going to be but he implied that it is a product that will be sprayed directly on the bees. When asked if it persists, he said no. Seems that the "non-chemical" will be a product to purchase and apply annually. He did not take many questions. I wanted to ask if there is any resulting genetic changes that can ultimately be spread to neighboring non-treated hives through drones heading out to do what drones do, but did not get a chance to. (I suspect Monsanto's lawyers have determined there is no risk for this and he would not be able to say otherwise.)

    The speaker before Mr Hayes was Michael Bush. Since I was sitting behind him, I could only imagine what his reaction to the talk was.

    My advice is to go to the meeting if there are other speakers and if you get a chance, ask Jerry Hayes about non-treated hives becoming genetically mucked up since Monsanto will obviously be unable to control the flight paths of drones treated with their "non-chemical."

    Wayne

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    Wayne,
    Thanks for the information. Very interesting as I wanted to go to the meeting and ask questions. Looks like Jerry and Monsanto are to smart to take questions. I'm just wondering why any beekeepers association would have him come speak. I can't believe that Monsanto has beekeepers best interest unless it is money to them. Ask the dairy farmers how Monsanto helped them. None I have talked to still use there product because it was so bad for the cows.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    In his defense, he did take some questions, though, perhaps due to time constraints, he didn't take a lot and I didn't get a chance to ask mine. Most questions did not get to the heart of the technology and it's impacts, except for the one person who asked if the treatment persists or needs to be done on a regular basis.

    The first questioner did directly ask why he was coming to our meeting to (and I'm paraphrasing.) act as a shill for a company that is causing so many problems for us. I suspect that that might have put him a bit on the defensive side though I would expect him to get used to it, since so many believe that the fox is now guarding the hen house.

    At the Maine annual meeting, the Monsanto promotion was a small part of the entire program, and as I said, the first half of his talk was interesting. You may find the rest of your meeting worthwhile and informative also. Dr, Nancy Ostiguy is researching CCD at Penn State, focusing on non-pesticidal approaches to pest control and should be an interesting speaker at your meeting.

    Wayne

  6. #6
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    Oct 2009
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    Panama City, Florida, USA
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    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    Sorry, you are just being crazy. Jerry was the head of the Florida Apiary Inspection division in FLorida prior to joining Monsanto. It is easy to paint with a broad brush. I am sure that he has nothing but the best intentions for the bees and beekeepers.

    If you do no research, you will never progress to a better position. Someone has to do the research and it has to be paid for. Be thankful that it is someone with your and the bees interest at heart.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    Quote Originally Posted by jbeshearse View Post
    Sorry, you are just being crazy....
    I have no interest in what he did in Florida. I know what I heard him say Saturday and I know who is paying his salary now.

    I have no intention of ever buying a Monsanto product so I'm just going to have to continue with the soft-treatments I use if required. My only fear is the possibility of our bee stock being ruined by Monsanto-generated genetics. He didn't rule that out in his presentation in Maine, didn't even broach the subject.

    And please, don't call me crazy. That's quite rude of you. Learn some manners.

    Wayne

  8. #8
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    Oct 2009
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    Panama City, Florida, USA
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    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    Quote Originally Posted by toad View Post
    I just can not believe that the association is having him speak or thinks that he has beekeepers best interest. Am I just being crazy??
    I know that Jerry and Monsanto say they want to help control honey bee pest and find a solution for CCD but as far as I'm concerned they are the problem that's causing the CCD. Again I'm I crazy.
    The crazy statement was not for you WaynesGarden. When someone asks a rhetorical question they should expect an answer they may not like.

    And believe me, if they try and patent bee genetics then charge everyone who's bees get contaminated with them we will all be screaming like crazy. Paint them how you wish, but Monsanto has fed a lot of people. I don't want to get into an aurgument here and I know that many feel that Monsanto is "The Great Satan". But there is always more than one side of any story. I just think it is shortsighted and frankly, to condemn someone from association and ignore all past accomplishments and things they have done is insulting.

    I would bet you benefit from Monsanto products quite often, like it or not.

    As for manners, pot calling the kettle I would say.

    Matters not, You take care and you do have my best wishes.

    jeb
    Last edited by jbeshearse; 10-14-2012 at 10:08 PM. Reason: added content

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    cumberland me
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    227

    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    One thing Jerry Hayes mentioned was the Israeli Acute Paralysis Honeybee Viruses. I remember first reading about this honeybee virus in the Zola Leavitt newsletter. I don't have a copy of the article and cannot find it on the internet. It was a good article. Jerry Hayes just briefly mentioned about the Israeli Acute Paralysis Virus. linn

  10. #10

    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    Quote Originally Posted by waynesgarden View Post
    many believe that the fox is now guarding the hen house.
    I always find it interesting when folks immediately associate a paycheck and corruption. So many people believe everyone thinks the same as they do themselves….making such insinuations a personal reflection.
    It just might be that Jerry Hayes is in the fox den protecting the chickens. It seems reasonable to me to give folks a chance to prove their worth.
    Dan www.boogerhillbee.com
    Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
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    Washington County, Maine
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    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    I too was at the Maine meeting and heard Jerry Hayes speak. I am generally skeptical about all of the big ag chemical companies, however Jerry seemed to go out of his way to say that Monsanto has not always been a perfect corporate citizen. Monsanto purchased the company Jerry now works for - Beeologics - which sounds like it was a smart move for Monsanto. My understanding is that Beeologics did not have the cash resources to complete the research they wanted to do and Monsanto does.

    Now I'll be the first to acknowledge that Monsanto is acting in Monsanto's best interests: yet the RNA research is fascinating, particularly for beekeepers who dislike using older ag chemicals for mite control in their hives. I'm inclined to see where they go with their research and product development, making up my mind as to whether or not their products are something I want to use as more information becomes available.

    I was sitting next to Michael Bush at the meeting (one of the benefits of being a State Association Board member) and I got the impression (he was not all that talkative) that he understood very clearly that he was speaking at a meeting with lots of chemical users present, and that the typical natural approach to beekeeping lecture would not go over well. He spoke on myths in beekeeping, which having read his book and on-line materials, covered no new ground for me. Michael also had the speaking slot right after lunch which didn't help. I know I was drowsy!

    My conclusion: Jerry Hayes knows bees and is worth listening to for that alone. The work of Beeologics is interesting, and I am not willing to completely dismiss it just because the company is now owned by Monsanto.

    Many of the ag chemical companies are often demonized for their practices. I tend to shy away from Animal Farm like generalizations ("four legs good") and will wait to see how this plays out. And I will be watching.
    Master Beekeeper (EAS) and Master Gardener (U Maine CE) www.beeberrywoods.com

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    duplicate post
    Last edited by Andrew Dewey; 10-15-2012 at 07:14 AM. Reason: duplicate post
    Master Beekeeper (EAS) and Master Gardener (U Maine CE) www.beeberrywoods.com

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
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    Worcester County, Massachusetts
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    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    I have nothing against Jerry personally (hey, we thanked him in our book...it was an answer he provided in his Classroom collumn that lead us to our interest in the microbial aspects of honeybees).

    BUT

    One must accept that as a director of Beeologics (owned in whole by Monsanto) that Jerry now has obligations....specifically fiduciary duties....under which it would be a breach of his duties to do anything that isn't in the best interest of the corporation (Monsanto and/or Beeoloiogics...I believe their interests are one and the same).

    From: http://business-law.lawyers.com/smal...porations.html
    Directors must act in the best interests of the corporation and its members or stockholders. More specifically, the duty to act in good faith prohibits members of the board of directors from:

    Failing to act in the face of a known duty to act
    Acting in a manner unrelated to a pursuit of the corporation's best interest
    Maintaining a sustained or systematic failure to provide oversight
    Again, there is nothing personal in this evaluation....Jerry simply has no freedom to act in the best interests of anyone but Monsanto...in many cases, such a breach would be an actual felony, not just grounds for being fired (and losing a fat monsanto retirement package to boot).

    This is a cut and dried issue...there is no room for Jerry to act in your interest if it conflicts with that of Monsanto.

    deknow

  14. #14

    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    Quote Originally Posted by deknow View Post
    This is a cut and dried issue....
    Nothing cut and dried about it. If a product produced by a company is faulty or unreasonably dangerous its delivery and use would be deemed ‘not in the best interest of the company’. The board of directors has a responsibility to assure the success of a company and delivering a defective product is the surest means to failure.
    Dan www.boogerhillbee.com
    Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards

  15. #15
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    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    Yes, Jerry will act in your best interest in the cases in which your best interest and the best interests of Monsanto are one and the same. I don't find this reassuring. ...but in such a case, is the best interest of Monsanto to have Jerry talking about the evil Monsanto publicly at a bee meeting, or working within the corporation behind closed doors? Do you think that dangerous products and profits are mutually exclusive?

    deknow

  16. #16

    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    Quote Originally Posted by deknow View Post
    I don't find this reassuring. ...
    I don't look for reassurance. I look for evidence. Until such time as there is any, I refuse to form an opinion based on anyone's prejudice.
    Dan www.boogerhillbee.com
    Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards

  17. #17
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    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    ...prejudice? This is the letter of the law, and most assuredly of Jerry's contract. What do you think his job description is?

    deknow

  18. #18

    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    Quote Originally Posted by deknow View Post
    ...prejudice?
    Jerry is obligated to do his best to assure the success of the company.
    You have already presumed the worst case. You don’t have a stitch of evidence. Prejudice….yes.
    I will allow the man to prove himself, one way or the other.
    Having said this, I am not going to engage in a never ending, convoluted, semantic debate with you.
    So…go ahead….have the last word.
    Dan www.boogerhillbee.com
    Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards

  19. #19
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    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    Quote Originally Posted by beemandan View Post
    You have already presumed the worst case. You don’t have a stitch of evidence.
    Please don't put words in my mouth...I've presumed nothing other than his obligations are to Monsanto. My concerns over the RNAi technology predate Jerry's hiring, and are based on my understanding of the technology...I've written quite a bit on beesource about it.

    The only "worst case" I've discussed is that the best interests of monsanto (monsanto profits) are most adssuridly not the best interests of beekeepers (I don't own monsanto stock, and don't benefit if monsanto makes a profit).

    deknow

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Feb 2004
    Location
    Fredericksburg, Va
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    796

    Default Re: Virginia Beekeepers Ass. meetng advice

    I am planning to attend this meeting. Listenning to his presentation does not mean that I will sign up to be a follower. I attend the state meetings to help stay informed of all new developments in bee management. Sometimes I learn some new 'dos' and sometimes I learn some 'do nots'.
    Bee all you can Bee!
    http://www.hamiltonapiary.net

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