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  1. #1
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    Default America tackles AFB

    How are you containing AFB, in the USA

    Do you have a National policy on the elimination of

    Who pays for the control, inspection, and science

    Many questions, perhaps I can be directed to research papers

    The reason I ask, is here in New Zealand, AFB is our #1 enemy. We have had an elimination policy for many many years. Frankly, looking at the results statistically, it would seem there has been no headway in elimination

    Our top scientists in this disease, acknowledge that, 99.999% of all hives in NZ have AFB !! Luckily, only some progress to show ' clinical ' signs. ( And there's the vital question )

    Of those that do show ' clinical ' signs, 30 +/- % succumb quickly to the disease, another 30 +/- % show an improvement over a variable time frame, but then the hive will collapse. The balance, seem to shake off the disease, and carry on
    s
    We as beekeepers PAY an annual levy, based on numbers of apiaries and hives. I fear, our costs are going to skyrocket very soon, So far, the systems and science aren't working

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2012
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    Sacramento, CA, USA
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    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    I thought I read somewhere, most hives may test positive for spores, but I could be wrong on that.

  3. #3
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    Jul 2010
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    Auckland,Auckland,New Zealand
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    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    Quote Originally Posted by ladaok View Post
    Our top scientists in this disease, acknowledge that, 99.999% of all hives in NZ have AFB !! Luckily, only some progress to show ' clinical ' signs. ( And there's the vital question )

    Of those that do show ' clinical ' signs, 30 +/- % succumb quickly to the disease, another 30 +/- % show an improvement over a variable time frame, but then the hive will collapse. The balance, seem to shake off the disease, and carry on
    Where did you read that?
    "Thinking Inside The Box"

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
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    Mtn. View, Arkansas, USA
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    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    The 30/30/30% statement is in the AFB Control without the Use of Drugs booklet by Goodwin and Van Eaton. I have heard statements about the 99% of colonies having spores, but have never seen the information in a controlled study.

    I have read a study done in Switzerland on EFB that found that, in apiaries in areas with an history of EFB, 90% of colonies without clinical symptoms had the disease bacteria present.
    40 years - 25 colonies, 32 Nucs - IPM disciple - Naturally Skeptic

  5. #5
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    Auckland,Auckland,New Zealand
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    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    Thanks, I will look up the Goodwin book re the 30/30/30 statement. Once a hive has afb I have only ever seen it get worse, except for 2 times. One was around 40 years ago when afb was found in a hive, but when the guys went back to get it they couldn't remember what hive it was. Boss furious and we went back to go through all the hives to find it, but couldn't. So no hive got burned, and no hive at that site ever did get afb.
    The other time was when I found a very early infection in one of my hives but was unable to get a safe place to burn it due to a drought and extreme fire danger. So it got left a couple months till the fire ban was lifted, I went back through the hive for a look and there was no visible AFB. So, to experiment I left the hive, but to my dissapointment around 6 months later it did develop an infection, I had to burn it.
    To say that 30% of hives recover, I don't know how that could be known in NZ, as a hive showing AFB is required by law to be burned within 7 days. Unless the Goodwin results were based on some study they did.
    "Thinking Inside The Box"

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Nashville,"Golden Valley" TN
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    132

    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    I was at heartland in albion a few years back and the blueberry pollinators said AFB is often minutely present in the test due to the acidity of blueberry. Wonder in there is an acidity link in NZ.

  7. #7
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    Sep 2008
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    Mtn. View, Arkansas, USA
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    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    Oldtimer; The information is in section 5.1, page 15 in my manual.
    40 years - 25 colonies, 32 Nucs - IPM disciple - Naturally Skeptic

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Lottsburg, Virginia USA
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    701

    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    I believe AFB just like botulism is present in the soil and surroundings. For AFB the bacteria is either in an active form or in a dormant form. the bacteria can live with its host without any problems but if the amount of bacteria in the host is great enough it kills the host and when this happens the bacteria goes into this dormant phase and starts producing spores. When an insect is fed spores in their feed the high amount of bacteria then kills the insect and the bacteria goes back to producing spores again so once a colony is infected with spore making bacteria then the game is all over. However the bacteria could be on the comb in small amounts and does not pose a problem until a large amount is fed to brood. Similarly humans can handle small quantities of botulism but a large quantity could be fatal. I may be wrong but this is how I understand how AFB works.
    Johno

  9. #9
    Join Date
    May 2016
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    te puke new zealand
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    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    How are you containing AFB, in the USA

    Do you have a National policy on the elimination of

    Who pays for the control, inspection, and science

    Many questions, perhaps I can be directed to research papers

  10. #10
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    Jul 2010
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    Auckland,Auckland,New Zealand
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    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    Thanks ARB!
    "Thinking Inside The Box"

  11. #11
    Join Date
    May 2011
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    Greenwich, NY, USA
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    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    I wish that the USA's number one bee problem was AFB because it seems to be fairly low prevalance. Instead, it seems to be the much more widespread Varroa mite and the other diseases that the mite spreads.

    The USA plan involves a lot of cooperative efforts between states. Some states have better programs than others. There are inspections required for interstate movement of hives, but the enforcement might not be up to what some would hope. The ability of the inspectors is also variable. Some states have little or no inspection force. Other states have a large, highly trained staff.

    The big change in the USA that was launched by the federal government, so it affects everyone, is the new rules that antibiotics used in feed cannot be obtained over the counter. To obtain antibiotics (Terramycin, Tylan or Lincomycin), a beekeeper needs to engage a veterinarian. Some people claim that there is likely to be little effect on beekeepers because the antibiotics are overused and not needed. Others claim there is about to be a huge outbreak of AFB because beekeepers won't get antibiotics that are critical for AFB control. We will have to see what happens. Hopefully there are enough people looking and knowing what to look for to find AFB and deal with it before it spreads.

    Chris Cripps
    Greenwich, NY
    chris@betterbee.com

  12. #12
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    May 2013
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    Chardon, Ohio
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    533

    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    Quote Originally Posted by cowdoc View Post
    Hopefully there are enough people looking and knowing what to look for to find AFB and deal with it before it spreads.

    Chris Cripps
    Greenwich, NY
    chris@betterbee.com
    Having lived thru a local AFB outbreak 40 years ago I can assure you this will not happen. It sure did not happen here 40 years ago with the eventual result being we had zero ferals left and burned probably 80% of the domestics over a period of three years for at least 40 miles in all directions from where I live. Maybe farther than that. I do not have any data. Our only advantage today is nearly no ferals anymore. Some argue none like our local inspector. But, I know he is not quite right. Just close. Huge healthy booming hives went to full blown AFB with nearly every cell infected in periods of a month sometimes. I had one like that. Pulled a massive honey crop the end of June and every frame of brood was loaded with AFB by the end of July.

  13. #13
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    Jul 2013
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    Morro Bay, California, USA
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    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    AFB is a relatively slow disease. The Varroa virus kills hives long before AFB really expresses. This dynamic explains the apparent decline of AFB in America since the spread of Varroa.

    Unfortunately, the new wave of hobby keepers have no experience with AFB. Some of those new "woo-woo" keepers have been infected by the "meme" spread by irresponsible "natural gurus" that AFB is no issue for magically adapted "natural" hives. The believe that treatment free hives will evolve resistance to AFB in one generation just as they claim to have observed with their varroa free (but reliably dead) colonies.

    In many states, the state inspection regime has been systematically dismantled -- including my state of California.

    A couple of years ago, I documented a case where a TF partisan was deliberately offering AFB comb to others, in the mistaken belief she was innoculating the population.

    The TF lecture-circuit guru really need to begin to act responsibly on this issue.

  14. #14
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    Auckland,Auckland,New Zealand
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    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    Quote Originally Posted by Richard Cryberg View Post
    Huge healthy booming hives went to full blown AFB with nearly every cell infected in periods of a month sometimes.
    Very interesting. In most cases the hive starts out with a small infection which progresses slowly till if not dealt with eventually kills the hive. For a hive to become massively infected in a very short time indicates a big intake of heavily infected material, ie, a "rolling AFB bomb" effect. This would have to be caused by so many hives going down and being robbed the situation persists until all susceptable hives are dead. This would be facilitated by either a very large feral population, or careless beekeepers. Or both.
    "Thinking Inside The Box"

  15. #15
    Join Date
    May 2013
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    Chardon, Ohio
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    533

    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    Quote Originally Posted by Oldtimer View Post
    Very interesting. In most cases the hive starts out with a small infection which progresses slowly till if not dealt with eventually kills the hive. For a hive to become massively infected in a very short time indicates a big intake of heavily infected material, ie, a "rolling AFB bomb" effect. This would have to be caused by so many hives going down and being robbed the situation persists until all susceptable hives are dead. This would be facilitated by either a very large feral population, or careless beekeepers. Or both.
    I believe both were happening. Sure had no significant ferals after the attack. And a lot fewer hives also.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
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    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
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    51,923

    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    >How are you containing AFB, in the USA

    Each individual state has it's own laws.

    >Do you have a National policy on the elimination of

    The federal government has no policy and no authority on the matter unless it is about bees coming into the country from outside the country.

    >Who pays for the control, inspection, and science

    In some states beekeepers pay a fee which is used to fund the inspections. My state has no full time inspector and no registration. You have to pay to have your hives inspected if you are selling bees and otherwise they do not inspect them, and someone from the Ag Dept who is a beekeeper (and has another job) does the inspections.

    >The reason I ask, is here in New Zealand, AFB is our #1 enemy. We have had an elimination policy for many many years. Frankly, looking at the results statistically, it would seem there has been no headway in elimination

    Most states have a policy to burn the hive if AFB is found. My state (Nebraska) has always had a policy that as long as you were treating for AFB they would let you continue to do that, but if the inspector found it, they would burn the hive. I never understood it since treating won't kill the spores...
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 42y 40h 39yTF

  17. #17
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    Jul 2010
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    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Bush View Post
    You have to pay to have your hives inspected if you are selling bees and otherwise they do not inspect them, and someone from the Ag Dept who is a beekeeper (and has another job) does the inspections.
    What is the cost of that? A token fee govt subsidised or the real cost?
    "Thinking Inside The Box"

  18. #18
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    Aug 2002
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    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
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    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    >What is the cost of that? A token fee govt subsidised or the real cost?

    In Nebraska I pay $150 for them to inspect. If they had to drive a lot further they would charge me mileage. My guess is that is a little below their actual cost but the man doing the inspection is already on salary and is 40 miles away.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 42y 40h 39yTF

  19. #19
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    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    Thanks. My interest is that here there is a compulsory hive levy, which funds AFB inspections. There are constant rumblings about the amount people are charged, so just curious how it works in the USA, ie, do they charge based on a hourly rate, or so much per hive, and if so how much.
    "Thinking Inside The Box"

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
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    Rader, Greene County, Tennessee, USA
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    Default Re: America tackles AFB

    In the State of Tennessee, all hives are required to be registered with the state. There is no fee for registration, and no fee if you request an inspection. To the best of my knowledge, there is only one (1) state inspector on salary. There are also a number of local inspectors (semi-volunteers) trained by the state inspector, that are [partly] compensated on a per-inspection basis, that is until the funds appropriated for that year's inspections run dry.

    If bees are destroyed as a result of an inspector finding AFB, there is no compensation offered.

    https://www.tn.gov/agriculture/artic...y-registration
    Graham
    USDA Zone 7A Elevation 1400 ft

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