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  1. #1
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    Mar 2008
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    Default Really raw honey aggravation

    Hello,

    Just wanted to share a pet peeve of mine. I sell raw on heated unfiltered honey. This year I made enough to sell it to local health food stores. Yesterday I made a sales pitch yesterday where the store owner was really excited about the honey. Today I brought it in-- a case of 24 queenline jars only to be met with a tepid "oh thats raw honey really?...It doesnt look like the raw honey on the internet.....?"

    I then had to explain for 15 minutes about how the honey is in fact raw but recently extracted and so it is still pretty clear. This company Really Raw honey makes claims on their website (which is one of the first one that comes up for raw honey that: raw honey is supposed to be smooth creamy and spreadable with wax chunks it"

    I told the store owner that what they were selling was more of a creamed honey, and that if mine sat around for untold months that it would crystallize up too, and that many customers don't even like the consistency of creamed honey (in my experience anyway). Also, I could have been lazy and not even strained it, so that there were big chunks of wax and bee carcasses in there which doesn't sell either.

    Anyone else have to deal with this nonsense? I left annoyed as the store owner implied by her questioning that I was somehow offering fake raw honey--she asked me several times if I heated it---which I never do. She bought it but still I don't need to be interrogated.
    http://www.peekskillnurseries.com
    Specialists in Ground Cover plants since 1937. Talk to me about ground-covers!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
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    Santa Monica, CA, USA
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    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    If the manager would read some of the postings at beesource telling how people heat honey in the sun (sink, what else?) or use commercial foundation for honeycomb production... or how many "beekeepers" have no their own honey and sell somebody else, sometime of unknown origin... As a responsible manager, she must be careful. I think, it is good, that she is responsible - quality control! I personally do not sell honey. I distribute it as a gift between my friends. I claim that my honey is " 102% natural organic ". 2% is for bees parts and other organic material naturally occurred in the honey.Sergey

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    St. Albans, Vermont
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    5,585

    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    >>cerezha; .... or use commercial foundation for honeycomb production... I personally do not sell honey.

    Well that figures. And would you tell that store owner not to buy comb honey that was made with foundation? And only buy honey with bee legs and wax bits? Seems like the poster is doing a great job presenting a clean product without heating. Is there something wrong with that?

    The only truly raw honey is comb honey. When was the last time you saw a bee leg or propolis bit inside comb honey?

    >>I distribute it as a gift between my friends. I claim that my honey is " 102% natural organic ". 2% is for bees parts and other organic material >>naturally occurred in the honey.Sergey

    Bee parts occurring naturally in honey?? Bees don't put bee parts and other particulates in their honey. You do.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
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    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
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    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    So true Michael. I have even put a label on comb honey which I sold which read "The Only Truly Raw Honey".

    xcugat,
    As someone who sells honey I have found that I have to market my honey and not worry what other people do. Stand behind your product. Explain to your customer, the store owner, what you have and how it is made and that you stand behind what you say. You are not responsible for what others do and say.

    I know it is frustrating, but you don't have to be frustrated. Sell your own product.

    I have helped a friend put up Really Raw Honey. I don't know how they get away w/ such a product. But they have established a market and an impression of what Raw Honey is and looks like. It is what it is and there are plenty of people out there who will buy your Raw Honey w/out wax chunks and bee parts. I bet you will sell all you put up.

    Raw honey is easier for the end consumer to use if it is in a round jar rather than a queenline jar. My observation.
    Mark Berninghausen
    The answers are the end. The questions are the journey. Journey on.



  5. #5
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    Dec 2005
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    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
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    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    Michael,
    I am sure you have noticed that there are always people who don't do what you and I do that have opiniuons on how we should do what we do. I'm sure I do it too.
    Mark Berninghausen
    The answers are the end. The questions are the journey. Journey on.



  6. #6
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    May 2012
    Location
    Sacramento, CA, USA
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    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    Cuz it's true if you read it on the interwebs!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
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    Santa Monica, CA, USA
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    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    to Michael Palmer
    Well, it was sort of "russian-style" joke about 100 and 2 %, which is impossible since 100% is the max... I apologize for confusion. Also - I had no intention to criticize the original poster, xcugat -my apology if my post was offensive or somehow hurts somebody's feelings.

    Since I am not native English speaker, sometime I feel funny how people use the words. For instance, in Russian, we would never call high-quality product "raw". We would use "nicer" words for it - "natural" comes in mind. So, to me, "raw" really associated with bees legs in the honey... thus,102% exclusively to my friends. I do not impose my opinions on anybody including store managers, but, if somebody ask me, sure, I will share my personal opinion. Regarding honeycomb (which is not part of this thread),my opinion is that wax foundation, which is used for food (honeycomb) needs to be regulated by FDA. Sergey

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    Quote Originally Posted by sqkcrk View Post
    Michael,
    I am sure you have noticed that there are always people who don't do what you and I do that have opiniuons on how we should do what we do. I'm sure I do it too.
    O, yes! People is trying to teach me how to do stuff "properly" all time! But I am doing stuff in my own way... I think, there is a difference between imposing and sharing. It is my understanding that public forums like beesource is about "sharing"... But to me, most valuable part is information. Sergey

  9. #9
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    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
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    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    You thought I meant you? Interesting.
    Mark Berninghausen
    The answers are the end. The questions are the journey. Journey on.



  10. #10
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    Oct 2011
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    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    Quote Originally Posted by sqkcrk View Post
    You thought I meant you? Interesting.
    Hi Mark. No, I did not take it personally. I just commiserate with you. I am not in position to teach anything in beekeeping, I am learning! But, I remember, for instance with my kids, it was always a problem - Russian "babushkas" love to teach since they had nothing else to do (governmental pension, subsidized living, free everything). So, they just sit outside and criticize my kids - everything was wrong with my kids! Ooo, they have no warm clothes, poor kids, bad parents... look, your baby is in the water, she will be sick by tomorrow... how horrible those parents are, they do not pay ANY attention to their kids! Let me show to you how properly put shoe on your baby... I think, it is slightly different from what you meant, but still, people love to "teach" others. Sergey

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
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    Westchester NY
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    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    I am bumping this thread as a warning to all of you selling Raw honey--sites all over the internet insist that if it isnt creamy and spreadable it is "fake raw honey" I have included some examples here--be ready to argue with customers over this if you sell at farmers markets or direct
    http://www.destination-healthy-foods...Raw-Honey.html
    Middle of page

    http://www.gorgeouslygreen.com/2012/...or-pure-honey/
    "Raw honey is solid at room temperature (like honey should be) and it also looks opaque and milky. You should be suspicious if a honey that is marketed as “raw” is clear and runny. The sold “milky” honey still contains the bee pollen granules, bee propolis, vitamins, minerals, and enzymes"

    and finally this beauty from the brilliant people at Ehow
    http://www.ehow.com/how_7430772_tell-honey-raw.html

    And this "live" example found on youtube
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAELXYAthqM
    Look around the net and on youtube and you will see what I mean
    http://www.peekskillnurseries.com
    Specialists in Ground Cover plants since 1937. Talk to me about ground-covers!

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    Since there is no regulation on what is called "raw honey", people confused and are trying to establish their own criteria. Nothing wrong with this. As for transparent "raw" honey, I never had clear honey. My crush-and-strain honey is always cloudy and crystallized withing 1-4 months. I could not speak for "creamy" consistency. Once, I got really creamy honey, but in most cases, honey has rough crystals in it. I do not think that texture may function as an indicator of the "raw honey". Moreover - I think, adding granulated sugar could effectively mimic a crystallized honey consistency. From another hand, it is difficult to me to imagine transparent crystallized honey. I think, the best way to ensure that honey is "raw" - to place a few bees parts in each jar.
    Серёжа, Sergey

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Fair Grove,MO,USA
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    1,665

    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    I sell strained unheated honey at the local Farmers Market, it sells it self, people tell me it's the best honey they ever ate. When i extract my supers i can tell that some are lighter in color than others, but i don't seperate it. The dark and light is all mixed together and it is usually a amber color in my Golden Harvest jars. Two years ago my honey was black and the bee club members said i was selling my used motor oil, but once customers bought some they came back and stocked up with it for winter, said they didn't want to run out of it and ask if i would have more of it next year.I had to tell them i had no idea,and that i had no idea what they made it from.Not had any since??

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
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    St. Albans, Vermont
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    5,585

    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    Quote Originally Posted by xcugat View Post
    and finally this beauty from the brilliant people at Ehow
    http://www.ehow.com/how_7430772_tell-honey-raw.html
    From the link above...

    "Look at the honey at the top of the jar to see if it is clear, opaque or if it contains a thick crust of brown pellets. Raw honey will contain a thick crust of healthful propolis, which will look like small brown or tan pellets on the top of the honey."

    Since when do bees put anything in their honey that would form a thick crust of brown and tan pellets?

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Rader, Greene County, Tennessee, USA
    Posts
    6,703

    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    The site EHow.com, is part of Demand Media, a content farm chain. These type of sites typically have masses of poor quality content on anything they think they can get someone to click on. They are experts at nothing, they make their money serving up ads to unsuspecting eyeballs. Its just another form of spam.

    I use Google search tools to block sites like this from even showing up in search results. They are simply worthless. That way I don't waste my time trying to figure out if they have a clue on that particular subject. Here's a related story:
    http://www.webpronews.com/demand-media-ehow-2011-10
    Graham
    USDA Zone 7A Elevation 1400 ft

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
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    28,274

    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    Quote Originally Posted by xcugat View Post
    I am bumping this thread as a warning to all of you selling Raw honey--sites all over the internet insist that if it isnt creamy and spreadable it is "fake raw honey" I have included some examples here--be ready to argue with customers over this if you sell at farmers markets or direct
    http://www.destination-healthy-foods...Raw-Honey.html
    Middle of page

    http://www.gorgeouslygreen.com/2012/...or-pure-honey/
    "Raw honey is solid at room temperature (like honey should be) and it also looks opaque and milky. You should be suspicious if a honey that is marketed as “raw” is clear and runny. The sold “milky” honey still contains the bee pollen granules, bee propolis, vitamins, minerals, and enzymes"

    and finally this beauty from the brilliant people at Ehow
    http://www.ehow.com/how_7430772_tell-honey-raw.html

    And this "live" example found on youtube
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAELXYAthqM
    Look around the net and on youtube and you will see what I mean
    If you have to argue w/ a customer, they won't be your customer. Better change you attitude. Sell your honey. If people like it, you will build a customer base who will retrun to buy more and spread the word that you have a product worth buying. Don't try to compete. Sell your own.
    Mark Berninghausen
    The answers are the end. The questions are the journey. Journey on.



  17. #17
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    Nov 2007
    Location
    Kenton, OH USA
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    26

    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    Amen, Mark!

  18. #18
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    Mar 2008
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    Westchester NY
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    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    I understand where you are coming from Mark--there are enough people out there to buy my honey as it is--but.....Based on the huge premium that these other "raw honey" Peddlers are getting I am tempted just to seed my honey with creamed honey after extraction to make it "white and creamy" throughout, but then I would be playing into this false definition myself
    http://www.peekskillnurseries.com
    Specialists in Ground Cover plants since 1937. Talk to me about ground-covers!

  19. #19
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    Dec 2005
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    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
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    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    How much more than them are you charging for your honey?

    Is your honey raw? Do you heat your honey at all? If your honey is raw, you have no need to alter what you are doing. All you have to do is sell your own honey. And charge a premium price for a premium product.
    Mark Berninghausen
    The answers are the end. The questions are the journey. Journey on.



  20. #20
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Westchester NY
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    Default Re: Really raw honey aggravation

    I am charging less than them currently but maybe that should change...
    http://www.peekskillnurseries.com
    Specialists in Ground Cover plants since 1937. Talk to me about ground-covers!

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