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  1. #81
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX, USA
    Posts
    1,789

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    My foundationless comb:

    Well the pic won't upload, and it is not important enough to find my password to the photo website, so never mind.

    Tata...
    Stuck in Texas. Learning Permaculture in drought, guess I will teach permaculture in drought. The bees are still alive.

  2. #82
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Fair Grove,MO,USA
    Posts
    1,665

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    Mac, the moderator was concerned about contamination in the commercial foundation Vs natural drawn comb for comb honey. Myself i don't think there would be much difference, there are contaminates in the nector the bees bring in to make comb out of. If not we wouldn't be talking about contaminated comb in our comb honey.The thin foundation i buy for comb honey, i only use 1 in. or 2 in. strips for a starter and it has to be heated to a melting temp. to produce it which would kill some of the contaminates.(but probly not all) As for organic produce, it's not all contaminte free either.

  3. #83
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    DuPage County, Illinois USA
    Posts
    9,650

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    Quote Originally Posted by brooksbeefarm View Post
    Myself i don't think there would be much difference, there are contaminates in the nector the bees bring in to make comb out of. If not we wouldn't be talking about contaminated comb in our comb honey.
    Wait a minute. My concern isn't with what the bees bring into a hive. That has to be very small compared to the chemicals beekeepers put into the hive that gets into the wax. I could be proven wrong, but I'd venture to say the measurable contaminates in wax foundation come from the beekeeper, not the nectar brought in by bees.
    Regards, Barry

  4. #84
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Fair Grove,MO,USA
    Posts
    1,665

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    My mistake Barry, i wasn't thinking along the line of what other beekeepers put in there hives and sell the wax. Myself the only mite control i use is Tymol oil (an essential oil) and have used Fumagilin B when i detect a case of Nosema, i don't feed it yearly for preventive use.Other than that it's the Live or let die method.With the small starter strip i use for comb honey and the rest of the comb the bees draw out to make a frame of comb honey. i would be surprised if there was a measurable amount of contamination compared to a frame of comb honey drawn without foundation.

  5. #85
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    28,285

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    Er,ATTENTION BEEKEEPERS!! Do Not Use Miticides While Colonies Are Producing Honey.
    Mark Berninghausen
    The answers are the end. The questions are the journey. Journey on.



  6. #86
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    DuPage County, Illinois USA
    Posts
    9,650

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    I think we need to clear something up. Does anyone know if makers of wax foundation guarantee that wax used in comb honey foundation comes only from cappings of untreated honey comb?
    Regards, Barry

  7. #87
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    28,285

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    No they do not, afaik.
    Mark Berninghausen
    The answers are the end. The questions are the journey. Journey on.



  8. #88
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    DuPage County, Illinois USA
    Posts
    9,650

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    So the brood comb that gets treated with chemicals is the same wax being used for honey comb foundation.
    Regards, Barry

  9. #89
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    28,285

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    Beeswax foundation primarily comes from cappings wax.
    Mark Berninghausen
    The answers are the end. The questions are the journey. Journey on.



  10. #90
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    DuPage County, Illinois USA
    Posts
    9,650

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    Quote Originally Posted by sqkcrk View Post
    primarily
    Ah, this is too vague. I'm interested in real numbers, remember?
    Regards, Barry

  11. #91
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    28,285

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    For that, perhaps, you would like to speak to someone who produces comb honey foundation. Such as Dadant or Kelley Companys.
    Mark Berninghausen
    The answers are the end. The questions are the journey. Journey on.



  12. #92
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    McLean County, Illinois
    Posts
    166

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    Last edited by greengecko; 09-23-2012 at 08:54 PM. Reason: self delete - ancient secret

  13. #93
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    syracuse n.y.
    Posts
    2,061

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    here is a french study but only looking for beeks chemicals in wax

    http://community.lsoft.com/scripts/w...%3BMatches&z=4
    mike syracuse ny
    I went to bed mean, and woke up meaner. Marshal Dillon

  14. #94
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    syracuse n.y.
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    2,061

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    marryanne frazer's study on wax contamination

    http://community.lsoft.com/scripts/w...%3BMatches&z=4

    please note I don't have the time today to read them, just the summaries.
    mike syracuse ny
    I went to bed mean, and woke up meaner. Marshal Dillon

  15. #95
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    syracuse n.y.
    Posts
    2,061

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    a post by loyd speer about the french testing and testing he did on wax and his contacts with the manufacurer's

    http://community.lsoft.com/scripts/w...%3BMatches&z=4


    hopefully enough information to make an informed judgement.
    mike syracuse ny
    I went to bed mean, and woke up meaner. Marshal Dillon

  16. #96
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    DuPage County, Illinois USA
    Posts
    9,650

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    Thanks Mike.

    *******
    Honey Bees Suffer From Pesticide Buildup

    The researchers presented their analysis of pollen, brood, adult bees and wax samples today (Aug. 18) at the 236th national American Chemical Society meeting in Philadelphia. Those results show unprecedented levels of fluvalinate and coumaphos -- pesticides used in the hives to combat varroa mites -- in all comb and foundation wax samples. They also found lower levels of 70 other pesticides and metabolites of those pesticides in pollen and bees.

    "Everyone figured that the acaricides (anti-varroa mite chemicals) would be present in the wax because the wax is reprocessed to form the structure of the hives," says Maryann Frazier, senior extension associate. "It was a bit of a shock to see the levels and the widespread presence of these pesticides."

    ************
    "That said, a couple of years ago I had occassion to have some wax tested for contamination and the readings were far, far higher than those that have been reported here (in the past couple of days). This wax was being sold as capping wax, but had been sold to a rendering house by a well-known commercial beekeeper."

    "Something (unknown) in the manufacturing process is removing the coumaphous and fluvalinate."

    - Lloyd Spear


    Still leaves the subject matter quite muddy. Looks like we know for sure that cappings wax is contaminated and foundation is still testing positive for chemicals. Manufacturers are reducing the levels through their process, but it appears it is a hit or miss sort of thing across the industry.
    Regards, Barry

  17. #97
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    28,285

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    So whatcha gonna do Barry?
    Mark Berninghausen
    The answers are the end. The questions are the journey. Journey on.



  18. #98
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    DuPage County, Illinois USA
    Posts
    9,650

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    Personally, if I do comb honey again, I'd do it foundationless.

  19. #99
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
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    28,285

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    And on untreated hives?
    Mark Berninghausen
    The answers are the end. The questions are the journey. Journey on.



  20. #100
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Herrick, SD USA
    Posts
    4,624

    Default Re: Making "Comb Honey" Good or Bad..

    Nice links though they are a few years old some good info nevertheless. Too bad this testing stuff has to be so murky and secretive. Now that McDonald's posts nutrition information on their menu perhaps its time for some light of day on beeswax testing. Those who have avoided the use of Coumaphous and Fluvalinate should be justly rewarded.
    "People will generally accept facts as truth only if the facts agree with what they already believe."- Andy Rooney

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