Hogan trap; more questions

[Beev]

The trap I placed this spring has produced a couple of real good starts. The owner of the tree isn't in a hurry but wants the bees gone, so, about 3 weeks ago I placed the funnel in the transition and the trap began to get some bees (about a pound) after a couple of days. I just decided to leave it and let as many bees get in as I could( I figured the hive was weak anyway). Meanwhile, I got called away for work and wasn't able to return till yesterday.

Here is what I found:
1. The bees had discovered a hole in the roots and had been using that.
2. The pound of bees were still in the box but none were trying to get into the funnel and none were coming out.
3. The queenless bees in the box had developed a laying worker.( a couple of larva in drone comb and multiple eggs in a few cells)

Here is what I did:
1. Plugged the holes the bees have been using.( I hope)
2. Removed the funnel so the bees will resume using the box, and hopefully head off the laying worker.

Anything else I should do? Advise? I really need to get the remaining bees out of the tree so I can seal it up.

[jrbbees]

? start squirting beego or beequick in the bottom hole as a last resort. see if it would push them out the top.

[Cleo C. Hogan Jr]

I would remove the worker brood. I don't like worker brood anywhere in the bee yard.

I would place a new comb of unsealed brood in the trap. Let the remaining bees use the brood you put in the trap to make a new queen. This will help to draw out the remaining bees. The presence of laying worker indicates the colony did not produce a new queen, and the feral colony is doomed.

As you weaken the feral colony it is going to be vulnerable to wax moths and small hive beetles. This should doom the feral colony. At some point, remove the trap and seal off all entrances to keep another swarm from moving in.

cchoganjr

[Beev]

thanks guys. I considered using Bee Quick but still haven't made my mind up on that one.

Cleo - Due to the way they act, I suspect that the feral queen is still in the tree, and the trap bees acted just like a queen-less hive would. I will see how they are acting in a couple of days and add brood if all looks well. Is the "Great Stuff" expanding foam suitable for sealing things up?

[Cleo C. Hogan Jr]

Beev.. Ref.. "Great Stuff.... Can't answer that one. Perhaps some one else can. I never used it and don't know it's uses and limitations.

cchoganjr

[All About Bees]

I used the Great Stuff once on a hive in the house walls. They ate a hole through it after it cured. I would use silicone.

[bevy's honeybees]

Are they using an entrance at the base of thet tree? The Hogan trap-out I'm doing now is at the base of a tree. I also have a property owner that wants to seal it up as soon as I'm done and we talked about Great Stuff. I think I"m going to try pea gravel. I bought a bag of it and it has helped greatly at that ground level entry point, and in holding down the plastic and tape. I also had to do bee leak repairs several times. I don't think it affected anything much.

I have removed bees twice now from the same tree. I have 5 full frames of bees. First 3 frames I put into a 4 frame box and they are making a queen--there is a sealed queen cell already.

Last night I removed 2 more frames. Both times I've replaced with 1 frame open brood in hope of drawing out queen (and empty drawn comb). Hasn't happened yet as the frame of open brood I took last night, 3 more open queen cell starts with larvae. I added those 2 to a weak nuk, with double screen for transition between boxes. I used a double piece of lanai screen scrap.

Property owner asked me about plugging it up and I told him I'd find out about that. Good to know Great Stuff doesn't work. Maybe pea gravel and silicone.

I hope so much the queen comes out in my third attempt from last night. I think I will have it pretty depleated with this one. I plan to go back either Wednesday or Friday. I have the tunnel blocked and they are using the cone.

[bevy's honeybees]

Mr Hogan,

"Let the remaining bees use the brood you put in the trap to make a new queen. This will help to draw out the remaining bees."

Do you mean that in making a new queen the remaining bees come out? Before they seal the cell, or even after that?

I'm wondering if I should wait a bit before going to pull the frames I put in yesterday. I left only 3 frames in the box. I'd like to wrap this up soon, as would the property owner. Without killing bees if possible.

My apology for the piggy back questions.
Beverly

[whiskers]

Is there some reason why no one is suggesting common masonry mortar as material to plug up these holes? It's cheap and one bag of mix will probably make enough mud to plug up the next ten trees you do.
Bill

[DLMKA]

Is there some reason why no one is suggesting common masonry mortar as material to plug up these holes? It's cheap and one bag of mix will probably make enough mud to plug up the next ten trees you do.
Bill

I used a bag of Quickrete to seal up a rotten cavity at the base of a bee tree. Worked great!

[Cleo C. Hogan Jr]

bevy... Sorry I wasn't able to get back to you sooner, severe medical problem and been laid up in bed for 10 days.

What I was saying is, if there is a laying worker, then in all probability there is no queen. If you introduce a frame of unsealed brood, that will draw more bees out of the tree to tend the brood and in all likelihood they will attempt to make themselves a queen from one or more of the unsealed cells.

If you have the funnel, (plastic or screen cone) installed, the bees in the tree will all come out eventually for cleansing ,rest, etc. If you are in a small hive beetle area, and if there are any adult small hive beetles in the tree, as the number of bees in the tree diminishes, the small hive beetles will overwhelm the remaining bees and the bees will leave.

You may wind up having to kill a few if the property owner is in a hurry. I don't feel badly about this if I have taken as many as I can.

cchoganjr

[whiskers]

Cleo- Hope you are better.
Bill

[bevy's honeybees]

May you have a quick and complete recovery Mr Hogan. The bees need you!