Would you all recommend an inside cut-out or outside trap-out?

[PatBeek]

Thanks jredburn and robherc.

And robherc, yes, that would be a blast, wouldn't it? I almost feel guilty getting paid for all of this because it's so fun, but I have to justify it for the wife.

I think I may have secured a very experienced central Florida removal expert. We have tentatively agreed on the money situation, but he still thinks, even after seeing the photos, that it's a soffit job.. Haha, I think I agree with you all that it goes beyond that area.

Here's an excerpt from his email:

I am still betting soffet.

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[PatBeek]

Is gambling legal on this site?

Who wants to go JUST for soffit?

Who is going for the soffit AND wall/attic?

Of course I don't know yet, but will very soon.

[robherc]

With as much noise as you were saying you heard from that window, I'll take the chance on you & bet 500 worker bees on wall/attic, the soffit part I'm not sure on; they could be using it for comb, or they could simply be entering there & traveling further in before building. I did a cut-out in a horse barn where the bees went in about 3.5' from the entrance, past loads of empty space, 'til they found a spot that was "just right" for whatever reason & started building...I couldn't tell any difference between that particular spot & the entire 12' of the rest of the wall section they were in...bees do what bees decide to do.


P.S. If I lose this bet, the winner has to come to my bee yard to collect...attitude of bees is not guaranteed, but they may be enoucouraged to give you your payment in STINGERS! Mwah ha ha ha!

[PatBeek]

With as much noise as you were saying you heard from that window, I'll take the chance on you & bet 500 worker bees on wall/attic,

Only 500?

I'm betting several thousand in the attic/walls.

And hey, I may be in Texas in the next few months doing work. I grew up in Dallas. But I will be working in the Houston area.

I'm not even sure where Calhoun County is.

[robherc]

Houston & my bee yard are just under 3hrs apart. If you want to PM me about meeting sometime before you come down, we might be able to make plans to meet somewhere.

As far as the 500 workers, it's 100 less than the LD50 dosage of venom in humans...so usually wouldn't be lethal, but ALWAYS would hurt...a LOT

[Medic1259]

:
As far as the 500 workers, it's 100 less than the LD50 dosage of venom in humans...so usually wouldn't be lethal, but ALWAYS would hurt...a LOT

Thats a medic statement if I ever heard one...lol

[PatBeek]

This cut-out won't happen until Monday the 30th approx. The original gentleman who I worked with before is back on board with this job. The other company I got fell through because they wanted a deposit from the owner "for unforseeable issues". The owner got pissed off about that.

So anyhow, I won't have any photos/videos for a week.

Thanks again for everyone's help.

[WISHBONE]

This cut-out won't happen until Monday the 30th approx. The original gentleman who I worked with before is back on board with this job. The other company I got fell through because they wanted a deposit from the owner "for unforseeable issues". The owner got pissed off about that.

So anyhow, I won't have any photos/videos for a week.

Thanks again for everyone's help.

i agree with jredburn. bees will likely be in soffit or between rafters.i've done several cutouts like this and bees have been in soffit every time. its vinyl soffit, so you can unsnap the locking edge & pull down a little to see up into the cavity, thus being able to know where the bees are. if in rafters you can take the shingles off on a cool morning & remove a section of roof sheeting to get to the bees. take care not to damage flashing around dormer. remove bees & put sheeting & shingles back. should be a very easy job.bare in mind ive been building houses for 40 years & been around bees all my life. if i can be of any help with any questions please let me know. Randy

[robherc]

I just did my church cut-out that I'd told you about tonight Pat ... bees were going in @ the corner where the bottom of the roof met 2 walls. When I pulled up the flashing & removes a couple decorative fascia boards on the corner I saw bees coming out along over 1' total of the 3/4" plywood roof decking. Once I saw that, I knew it was time to start prying up the roof as the most likely target for finding the combs. Pried up the roof about 1/4" & saw a few combs hanging off the underside of the decking ... suspicion confirmed. At the end of the removal, I had cut a fairly neat 18"x36" approx. hole in the roof, without damaging any of the rafters (used a circ. saw & adjusted the depth to just barely MISS cutting all the way through the ply...then used the prybar to lift it up until it separated the rest of the way) & was able to remove 90% of the bees (including the queen) and 100% of the comb, leaving the parishoners quite happy over the small amount of damage done.
The moral of the story is, pay attention to the signs the bees give you. Start with the most obvious & least damaging steps, then just go where the bees point you & you'll find them everytime; usually while causing a minimum of damage (unless, of course, it's a monstrous 4'x5' hive that's 5-6years old...then the damage will be a lot greater...lol). You don't necessarily need to go out & spend $500 on gadgets to do the job; they don't hurt, but a little skill, attention, and patience can easily replace them 9 of 10 times.

I'll bee looking forward to your pics/vids & updates next Tues!

[PatBeek]

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robherc,

That sounds like quite the cut-out.

How are those bees doing now?

Did you have to vacuum any?

[PatBeek]

if i can be of any help with any questions please let me know. Randy

Thanks.....and I also forwarded your advice to the gentleman who will be helping.

[robherc]

I left the bees in my vac until about an hour ago (made the vac with the intention of being able to "hive" them in it for a day or two safely as my bee yard's a 45min drive away) when I hived them. I transferred the bars & frames into one of my swarm boxes (7-frame deep), whacked the box on the ground, then shook all the bees in over the bars & frames, just like a package of bees. Ended up seeing about maybe a hundred or so dead bees, but those could just as easily been injured by the cut-out process, as by the vac itself, so overall I'd call the vac an astounding success (especially considering that the first one I made was a total failure)!
If you're interested, I'm planning to post the design for my bee vac in a new thread sometime in the next couple days...with construction plans.

[NCbeek]

Instead of smoke try sugar water spray. Then suck them up with a bee vac.
Regards
Joe

Just a thought about that. Sugar water makes them sticky and will gum them up in the hose of the vacuum. The inside of the hose will be sticky and constantly clog with bees who are sticking to each other no matter how little water you use. You won't need smoke or sugar water IMHO.

[robherc]

I agree with NCbeek ... this cut-out I used the bee vac, and only the bee vac. No smoke OR syrup & things were still nice and smooth/calm. Hard for bees to come at you from the inside of the vac box.
Just make sure your vac's saving them, not killing them.

[WISHBONE]

Thanks.....and I also forwarded your advice to the gentleman who will be helping.

PatBeek, looking at your inside pictures, it looks like there might be 3 or 4 feet between the bottom of the window & the floor. if so, there should be attic access. if that is the garage to the right you could go thru that attic space into the space between upstairs wall & boxing(soffit). if its framed the way we do, it will have subfloor on the joist in that attic area. its unlikely bees will be in walls or floor system because of insulation. to me it looks like a fairly easy job. i normally get about 300.00 repairs included if its close to home for stuff like that. 864-809-0026

[PatBeek]

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Are we ready to settle some bets now?

.

[PatBeek]

[mrqb]

Bravo...well done and very nice video...now who owes who???

[PatBeek]

Bravo...well done and very nice video...now who owes who???

Hehehe, well, no one knew for sure. Every situation is different.

But yeah, we went up into the attic directly above that room after we found out the soffit was a complete dead end. There were no signs of bees in the attic above that room - no dead ones or anything.

Roberts IR temperature gauge gave us no usable results.

So, we just listened to the wall again to see where the buzzing was the strongest and made the decision to go for it. The first cut was on the right side of the stud, but no biggie. I don't think we did too much damage considering what it could have been. We also siliconed the outside soffit entrance and the bees were amassed there as were were wrapping things up.

Some of you may be wondering why I had to feed them other honey besides their own (yes I know the controversy with AFB problems, etc), but the hive had almost zero honey stores. I believe it was a young and struggling hive, especially with the wax-moth larvae taking hold. I'm pretty sure we got most of those larvae out of there, so I'll have to keep an eye on that and research how to try to control it. My partner-in-crime, Robert, says that keeping the hive in full sun makes the wax moths die-off or unable to take hold. Can anyone confirm or deny that with your personal experience? My hive has full morning and afternoon sun up until about 1 or 2 pm.

Regarding the scene where the bee vac had the bottom open and the bees making a mecca into the lower TBH, well, obviously something like that should be done right at home where the new hive will be set up. Unfortunately, that was Robert's bee vac and my top bar hive and we don't live too close to each other We made the decision to just do it in the driveway of the cut-out house.

I will be building my own bee vac soon enough, however.

I appreciate very much everyone's tips and comments on this whole matter.

Please feel free to offer more advice on what happened and the hive in its present state.

Oh, one more thing - I can't confirm it for sure - but I THINK I may have the queen in my hive. There is still a ball of bees in a corner ceiling. The hive is very active with bees cleaning debris and making orientation flights, so hopefully they are going to survive just fine without too many interventions.

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[DLMKA]

nice job! Looks like a clean removal with minimal repairs needed.