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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Tulsa OK. USA
    Posts
    846

    Default Re: I have a cutout to bid. Really.

    A stethoscope helps and as mentioned you can use a small metal rod or coat hanger to probe the walls or ceiling, just drill small holes in the paneling and insert the rod and see if you get honey back. Another tool you can use is a thermal themometer and check for warm/hot spots. You can get one at an auto parts store for around 60 bucks or check Harbor Freight. Jim
    Stop and smell the flowers, 50,000 ladies can't be wrong
    Bsweetapiary@aol.com

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX, USA
    Posts
    1,774

    Default Re: I have a cutout to bid. Really.

    Quote Originally Posted by sqkcrk View Post
    I haven't been fol,lowing this closely, but, when you mention infrared I see money being spent which I thought Gypsi didn't have to invest in bees. Maybe this project is going to cost Gypsi more than just buying bees would.
    Mark,

    I think you missed a few things. If I'd been drinking coffee and called to price the thermal imaging device, the coffee would have spewed everywhere. No, it won't cost me that much. But I am accumulating tools for future work too. I have a ton of word of mouth contacts locally, an almost 13 year business track record, this may be my first removal, but I doubt it will be my last. So I am examining all options to do professional grade work. My annual tool bill is at least $1K most years. I buy tools like most beekeepers buy bees. And I use them to pay for tools. Besides which, I already ordered 2 nucs. I NEVER have any money in late November, December or early January. And I didn't order bees until we got a weather report that said the drought would break this year. I INVEST money. I don't throw it away if I can help it. Last year, my bee money was educational - I lost the bees but gained the knowledge. And that too is an INVESTMENT.

    Gypsi

    (thank you to everyone who replied, I think that we will pull this off. Will pick up a stethoscope and may hit harbor freight for the heat sensor tomorrow. That is given the customer goes for the bid. And that my mentor concurs. If this customer doesn't bite, I can postpone the expenses, but still have gained knowledge. )
    Time to be a gypsy again, 2014 will be my prep year, my bees want a better area with actual rainfall.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Reno, NV
    Posts
    2,951

    Default Re: I have a cutout to bid. Really.

    Just looked at your photo. A larger image woudl help but this is what I would do if it where me. Regardless of the "Rules" I would pop that piece of siding off being prepared that the entire colony may be attached to it. I am assuming it is not tong and groove or ship lap or any other reason the edges would be held in place by joining pieces of siding. I also assume that it is screwed in place. I guess I should say hopeful that it is screwed in place. If it is nailed and possibly glued you may not be able to remove it without damaging it.

    It does not look like this is actual siding but painted plywood. The hope would be to remove the one piece be able to get the bees and get the heck out again. The Rule would be that the ply needs to be replaced with approved siding but they have to catch you first. I think there is very little chance of running into trouble with inspectors, just be informed.

    Hope for the best plan for the worst and realize you may have to destroy that siding to get it off. then there will be a hole that needs to be covered. On top of that the chances the bees will be nice and convenient once you do remove that piece are just a tad below nothing. Just being realistic with that thought.

    But yea I would try to see what is behind that one piece. That is until or if information dictates otherwise.

    Oops just took a second look at the photo and I can just barely tell that it is T-111 siding. Same issues about getting it off in one piece apply. IT does not strike me as installed all that well so there is some hope.
    Stand for what you believe, even if you stand alone.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Stillwell, KS
    Posts
    645

    Default Re: I have a cutout to bid. Really.

    A lot of times when I find bees next to brick chimney chases they have gone around the corner of the chase and are generally right over the fireplace mantel and only accessable from inside the house. The bees like it because there is always a big void with no insulation there:


    If thats the case here they will be very easy to find with a stethescope, listening from inside the house.

    Good luck. ...Don
    Last edited by D Semple; 01-27-2012 at 07:16 AM.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Danbury, CT
    Posts
    2,887

    Default Re: I have a cutout to bid. Really.

    I would try and locate them from the inside with a stethoscope. 50/50 chance they are behind brick which unless the homeowner would let you tackle it from the interior, will be a no go on a cutout. Also they are at a height that may put them in the floor joist for the second floor.
    Due to your inexperience I would only offer to do it for a donation to help offset your costs.
    Happy hunting.
    Always question Conventional Wisdom.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX, USA
    Posts
    1,774

    Default Re: I have a cutout to bid. Really.

    I have a stethoscope appointment with my customer for 11 am tomorrow. Simplest way is the best. Thank you Don. (and everyone)

    oh - that siding - it's kinda fiberboard stuff with vertical grooves cut in it, they sell it at Home Depot. Never figured it would come off in one piece, even with unscrewing it, planned on having to replace. It's cheap - maybe $35 a sheet.
    Time to be a gypsy again, 2014 will be my prep year, my bees want a better area with actual rainfall.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    San Mateo, CA
    Posts
    4,879

    Default Re: I have a cutout to bid. Really.

    I think removals are fine if you are in the removal business - for profit or entertainment. If you are doing it for increase, buying a $25 queen is a better value in your life. Plus, to stay out of trouble you probably/often are required by law to have several different insurances and licenses.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX, USA
    Posts
    1,774

    Default Re: I have a cutout to bid. Really.

    I want to learn to do removals, because a bad removal is why I had to buy bees. poisoned honey from a bad removal a block from me killed every pollinator in the area - even the yj's, in 2010.

    I will eventually do them for profit, but this one is pro-bono, covering my costs, but being carefully done all the same, as I learn to do them properly, with my mentor. And I have the insurance. I expanded my coverage. Licensing, in Texas? Well it is pretty darned slack except for plumbing, electrical, hvac, and pest control involving poisons. Mostly non-existent.
    Time to be a gypsy again, 2014 will be my prep year, my bees want a better area with actual rainfall.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Nacogdoches,TX,USA
    Posts
    77

    Default Re: I have a cutout to bid. Really.

    Texas does require a permit to remove bees from property other than your own it costs $35.00
    From dept agg
    Google texas bee removal permit for form
    But there is little emforcement

    Dave

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX, USA
    Posts
    1,774

    Default Re: I have a cutout to bid. Really.

    Really? Yikes. I guess that's why most of the removals I've encountered were with Raid, and the poisoned honey wiped out everything. Well, I'm still exploring - tomorrow with Stethoscope.
    Time to be a gypsy again, 2014 will be my prep year, my bees want a better area with actual rainfall.

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX, USA
    Posts
    1,774

    Default Re: I have a cutout to bid. Really.

    It is going to be a trap out. Encased in brick, are these bees, I believe. Took my stethoscope and a coathanger. Never hit honey from either side, but found a huge crack in the mortared brick wall at the edge of the right bookcase, just behind it. This is how they have been getting in the house. Stuffed napkins & tissue in the crack for now. Location isn't inconvenient for me to get by weekly or bi-weekly, when on other errands, and I don't want to make a mess, so it will be a trap out and educational all the same. jeans_hs_inside.gif

    The brick wall appears to continue all the way up behind the bookcase. Certainly for the first inch or 2. Blue tape and tissue over bee entry points (and the top corner of bookcase, ceiling, wall as well, but a wire inserted did not encounter honey or hive.)

    Gypsi
    Time to be a gypsy again, 2014 will be my prep year, my bees want a better area with actual rainfall.

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Tulsa OK. USA
    Posts
    846

    Default Re: I have a cutout to bid. Really.

    Good job. one small step towards removing bees and one large step towards doing it right. A little time today saved alot of time and disapointment(you and the home owner)if you had torn apart a wall only to find the bees not where you or he THOUGHT theym to be. Jim
    Stop and smell the flowers, 50,000 ladies can't be wrong
    Bsweetapiary@aol.com

  13. #33
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Location
    San Francisco, CA
    Posts
    2,365

    Default Re: I have a cutout to bid. Really.

    Nice investigative work Gypsi. I think you're a natural.
    President, San Francisco Beekeepers Association
    www.habitatforhoneybees.org

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Location
    Fort Worth, TX, USA
    Posts
    1,774

    Default Re: I have a cutout to bid. Really.

    Your confidence really helps Charlie - I feel a bit under-educated and overwhelmed, but I make up for it with pure bloody perseverence.. Moved over to the "how to get the queen out" thread. Good pictures!
    Time to be a gypsy again, 2014 will be my prep year, my bees want a better area with actual rainfall.

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