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Checkerboarding verses Opening the Broodnest

43K views 157 replies 25 participants last post by  wcubed 
#1 ·
Hi Guys,

I'm just getting back into beekeeping after several years and I've recently read a lot about Checkerboarding and Opening the Broodnest to help prevent bees from wanting to swarm and to also help build up larger populations.
Has anyone done any tests or seen scientific studies with a number of hives that compare the two methods?

It would seem that Opening the Broodnest by inserting empty frames requires more bees to stay in the hive to maintain brood temperatures, due to the increase in the volume of the nest area. So may not be useful at lower temperatures.

So what about a combination of both? For example using Checkerboarding in early spring when temperatures are low and Opening the Broodnest in early Summer once temperatures are closer to brood temperature?

Thanks
Matthew Davey
 
#2 ·
I think that the only way a brood nest should be opened up is by splitting it in the middle. For example you have two boxes and insert a third box in the middle of the two.

Moving individual frames like is done with checkerboarding sets a hive back weeks. The brood nest is specifically organized with brood in the center and stores around the fringes. When you change that dynamic bees scramble to reorganize everything back where they need it. This involves moving stores and in some cases they will even discard brood creating a break in the brood cycle.

It may prevent swarming, but only because the bees are busy undoing the mess their Keeper just created.
 
#3 ·
Moving individual frames like is done with checkerboarding sets a hive back weeks. The brood nest is specifically organized with brood in the center
Checkerboarding doesn't involve any manipulations in the brood nest - the checkerboarding is done in the honey supers above the brood nest. It creates space where the brood area can expand upwards without separating the nest from overhead reserve stores. The theory is that without both of those two elements (space and reserve stores) the brood nest won't expand and the hive will start swarm prep.
 
#5 ·
To a certain extent checkerboarding begins the previous year when you reserve resources so that come February (in my area) the hive still has 2 supers full of honey, and you have in reserve another super of drawn comb. Then in February you shuffle in your drawn comb with the first super of honey, and still have a full super of honey on top of the stack. So you end up with (from the bottom) - Brood nest, box of alternate full/empty comb, another box of full/empty comb, full box of honey. It's probably not something your going to be able to do during your first year or two of bee keeping.

Disclosure - I wenta to the seminar, anda watcheda the video - but I've never actually done it.
 
#6 ·
I have been at it... 20 years now I guess. I still never keep extra honey on my hives in the winter and definitely don't keep any in reserve. IMO forget "checkerboarding" and just insert a box of drawn comb between the bottom and top brood chamber to expand the broodnest. That way brood stays out of supers because you don't break the honey band that is in the top of the upper brood box and the bees quickly set out filling in the new space in the broodnest with stores and eggs.
 
#8 ·
Checkerboarding and Opening the Broodnest are two different methods of accomplishing the same goal, keeping lanes open for the bees to expand the broodnest and not begin to backfill in swarm prep. Checkerboarding should be done well before broodnest expansion begins and is much less intrusive. It keeps the bees moving up and expanding without hitting a solid honey dome. Opening the Broodnest sets up the same configuration but is started later in the spring season about the time you might begin to add honey supers. If you come into late winter/early spring and there is not enough capped honey left to set up Checkerboarding then opening the broodnest and supering will be the way to go. I think that using one or both methods depends on your climate, your set up, and how much honey is left in the colony in late winter. If they have burned through their stores over the winter then you won't have enough to work with to checkerboard and it would be unnecessary because the honey dome is not there to stop their expansion.
 
#11 ·
If they have burned through their stores over the winter then you won't have enough to work with to checkerboard and it would be unnecessary because the honey dome is not there to stop their expansion.
What if they have burn through to the top but have not consumed the stores in doing so? In other words they just went up and there is a lot of honey on the sides or below them. I am a new beek so I don't have a lot of experience to go on but I have heard the bees can do this when there is a lot of honey left on the hive.
 
#9 ·
I think that (in theory) the "honey dome" - Reserve stores - are part of the swarm prevention/colony expansion strategy. Ed Holcomb who is another highly respected local honey production guru (and great speaker - not a checkerboarding guy though) says this - If you do an early inspection, and the cluster is at the top it's already too late (to prevent swarming and build a big strong hive). Mr. Wright (if I understand correctly) says that lack of reserve stores is one of the factors that causes the colony to start the swarm process instead of expanding the brood nest.

Something that everyone should keep in mind is that this might be a great strategy here in the Mid south where Walt Wright, is from, perhaps not as effective where there is a strong late flow - or some other regional difference. In this area If you aren't ready to capitalize on the spring nectar flow with strong hives by May 1 you almost certainly will not get a honey crop .
 
#10 ·
One's method of approaching this is driven by regional conditions. You need to know where your bees will be in late winter/early spring and what their typical reserves are at that point. In my area the following paragraph from Walt's manuscript in the Recovery chapter is usually where I find my colonies in early spring. But if there is a box of overhead capped honey remaining, then checkboarding is in order.

" In more northerly locations where it takes more honey to sustain the colony through winter, the bees often have brood to the top. If the lower empty is raised, the colony is operating in the recovery mode immediately. All that is required to prevent swarming is to maintain empty comb above the raised empty hive body, so as not to let them fill the space to the top."
 
#12 ·
Sometimes my bees will do that. In a three medium set up they move from the middle box into the top box and are there through winter. I don't like to mess with their honey on the outside frames at that time of year, they might need it close to the cluster when our temps take a quick dive. If the bottom box is unoccupied it goes above the cluster. If it's empty comb it goes on as is. If it contains capped frames of honey that would be the time to add another box and divide the honey frames between the two, alternating every other frame capped - empty. That keeps them moving up as the season progresses and they expand the brood nest.
 
#15 · (Edited)
I agree, that's a great drawing. Makes the words come to life when you have a visual. The bottom line, as Grant mentioned, is to provide plenty of room for storage and brood rearing. There are numerous ways to go about it, some quick and easy, and others more time consuming. Returning to the checkerboarding concept, the diagram illustrates what I think Walt is attempting to eliminate with his method. As you can see in the drawing, adding a box of empty frames in the center of the brood nest will give the queen much more room for brood and would temporarily curb the swarming impulse. But you still have a solid dome of capped honey above the top of the brood nest. With that dome in place the bees will tend to try to store incoming nectar from the dome "downward". You will need to regularly insert a new box in the center of the brood nest and keep pushing the dome up or the bees would start to backfill the brood nest area. With checkerboarding there are alternating lanes of empty comb going all the way up through the dome and into any supers that are added. The theory is that this will prompt the bees to expand the brood nest up and store excess incoming nectar "up" through the fractured dome and to the highest point above the brood nest. I don't want to put words in anyone's mouth, but this is my interpretation of his method after reading his material.
 
#20 ·
But you still have a solid dome of capped honey above the top of the brood nest. With that dome in place the bees will tend to try to store incoming nectar from the dome "downward". You will need to regularly insert a new box in the center of the brood nest and keep pushing the dome up or the bees would start to backfill the brood nest area.
This is quite contrary to what I have read and was told by older beeks. As long as you have enough space in the brood chamber (defined as two deeps or three mediums) the honey cap will keep the queen from venturing upwards but will not impede the worker bee from storing honey in empty supers above. If you don't have the supers on you will be in trouble.
 
#18 ·
Reversing and moving a box with empty drawn comb above the brood nest at the correct time of year will allow them to expand their brood nest upward. At the same time a super or two should be added so they start to store any excess nectar up and away from the brood nest area.

The goal in my area is to have the maximum number of bees in the colony at the end of May when the swarming season is winding down and the main flow starts to peak. The boxes are rearranged in mid to late March to allow for rapid unimpeded brood expansion through April and into May. If I can get them into May without swarming things are looking good. So March and April it's key to have a lot of room available for brood rearing and nectar storage.

8 foot stacks? - too much for this old coot. I'll extract before it gets close to that.
 
G
#19 ·
8 foot stacks? - too much for this old coot. I'll extract before it gets close to that.
Yeah, really, and especially because I run all deeps....I was mostly going by the photos of Walt and various folks that checkerboard. Most folks wonder how to get the extra drawn comb for CBing. I have comb, but I don't usually leave so much capped reserves that I still have deeps full in Spring. I mountain camp. So I'm just wondering if simply adding drawn comb above the brood nest produces the same results as actually CBing with honey and comb alternating, etc....Seems like it would serve the same function.

Now if I can just find the best way to CB a top bar, but that's a different thread........
 
#25 · (Edited)
Thanks for your comments, it does clarify a few things. My purpose though, in starting this thread was to get actual results from those who have tested the two methods.

I would like to see actual results from a single bee yard where several hives were Checkboarded, several hives were had Opening of the Broodnest and another several that just had supers added. Then a table listing which ones swarmed and the honey yield from each and when in the season things were done.

The site bluegrass listed is along those lines, but only two hives were Checkerboarded:
http://www.k4vb.com/Walt%27s%20BIO%20reduced.htm

Also this one where Dennis Murrell said he tried NOT Checkerboarding one year:
http://beenatural.wordpress.com/legacy-beekeeping/checker-boarding/

I did see another site with some results but can't find it at the moment.
 
#26 ·
ok, heres a question!!

I run two deeps for brood/food and then super with mediums above that. I have limited drawn frames as I go into my second year of bee keeping, maybe a total of 40+ fully drawn deep frames, and a total of 10 fully drawn medium frames. The star thistle flow started about the first/second week of July this year and went through about mid-September. It was really strong through the month of August. Until then, I dont think we have much of a flow going on out here on the flatlands, except maybe bull thistle in the spring. I imagine that they will be growing hardcore (atleast I hope) until star thistle starts producing nectar and at that time could possibly swarm then?

Before I got bees (last May) we had a swarm come through in Mid April and take up residence in a euc tree. So common sense would tell me to start swarm managment out here about the first part of march??

Now, I will be having a couple hives in the city, where blooms and nectar happen all the time it seems, so that operation will need to be watched carefully I imagine. I will be checking those hives about every two weeks in the spring to make sure they dont get crowded.

I dont know, maybe I am just thinking this swarm prevention thing over to much, and will just try to keep the brood nest open and give them some drawn frames to store nectar in. Im sure I will have a swarm or two happen until I can get enough drawn frames to checker board and such!!
 
#27 ·
With all respect to Wcubed, I agree with another poster that checkboarding is not well adapted to the northern flows.

I disagree, again with respect with most everything Bluegrass stated in post #2.

We run a single deep brood chamber, and manipulate combs every 12-14 days between the dandelion bloom and Basswood bloom. These main production hives average more production than the couple hives that we have scattered at friends houses that get less attention.

A wise man wrote:

The goal in my area is to have the maximum number of bees in the colony at the end of May when the swarming season is winding down and the main flow starts to peak.

I agree wholeheartedly with the above statement, with the addition of one month to compensate for our latitude differences. To achieve this goal we manipulate frames every 12-14 days from dandelion to basswood bloom. To test our methods, we invited a fellow local beekeeper to join us this July, and it appeared that the number of bees in our hives was intimidating.

Crazy Roland, 5th genbeekeeper
Linden Apiary, est. 1852
 
#29 ·
To test our methods, we invited a fellow local beekeeper to join us this July, and it appeared that the number of bees in our hives was intimidating.
Was it the number of bees in the hives or the number of ticked off bees in the air because you mess with their home so often? A hundred thousand bees in the hive spilling out all over wouldn't phase me in the least but 20, 000 bees in the air zinging by my head and doing the "your going to get it dance" does.
 
#30 ·
There where bees in an upper entrance at eye height that was intimidating. They asked, "What do you want me to do to this hive?". Christian replied "Make it bigger!"(more populace).

Square peg wrote:
>we...manipulate combs every 12-14 days...

please elaborate on how you manipulate your combs.

With skill and care. There is no "20, 000 bees in the air zinging by my head and doing the "your going to get it dance" does. "

I believe this was all worked out in the 30's or 40's, was his name Seely? Our methods have not changed much since then.

Crazy Roland
 
#32 ·
roland, that was ace's comment about the 20,000 bees. i was just wondering what kind of moves you were making with the frames. i also have brood in single deeps with medium supers above. i try to research seely. thanks.

ps: is ernie von shlagon still on main st? :)
 
#33 ·
Sorry about the misrepresented quotes, no offense intended.

Yes, Ernie Von Schledorn is still on "Main street in Menomonee falls" .

I will try to provide more details, but it is not complicated. Make sure the queen has PLENTY of open comb. The difficult part is knowing how much you can spread them out without chilling the brood because the bees cannot cover it. Every round of inspections is different because the bees are increasing in number.

I will try to look for the authorities.

Crazy Roland
 
#34 ·
In answer to the original question: No, there has been no valid comparison of the effects of checkerboarding versus "opening the broodnest." And further, there has been no test of CB vs any other swarm prevention techniques. I tried a test of CB vs hive body reversal, but Mother Nature threw a couple wrinkles in the flow that spring that made the results inconclusive. Short form: The double deeps were reversed early during good field forage, and brood jumped into the upper deep. The CBed team was manipulated later during a dip in field forage and they were dragging their feet in expansion. The lack of field forage continued and the reversed group had about the same population at the start of main flow as the CBed. Honey production ended in a dead heat.

Tried it again the following year. For consistancy, supering was done with new Permacomb. The new plastic had not been treated for acceptance, and neither team would store nectar/honey in the supers. Another botched test. Turned my attention to other things.

The demonstration at the Huntsville club yard is a constant embarrassment for me. It's my system and I did it wrong. No excuses. It's history that can't be changed, and denial doesn't help. The mistake made was putting the empty pollen box medium from the bottom board to just above the brood in the deep brood chamber. The checkerboarded supers should have been placed there and the empty at the top, above the CBed supers. Major blunder. The empty medium above the deep brood chamber stopped expansion into the supers for several weeks. It's a wonder that they didn't swarm from the single deep.

The sketches of the demo debacle show up in two different links above. Those are good sketches of how NOT to do it, and they differ somewhat. When we realized the error and corrected the configuration, we sent Bob an explanation that got garbled somehow. We didn't know Butch also had reported it on his site. Note that in the pic of me between the two hives, the medium box is located next to my shirt sleeves. I don't think either description gets it there.

It is reported that confession is good for the soul. Sorry, Father, I don't feel any better.
Walt
 
#37 ·
>You should never have that much honey left in the spring to work with

There seems to be a lot of misunderstanding of the "when". You would not be checkerboarding in the spring. That would take place in late winter before they have burned through those stores in the early buildup period before the first nectar flow. Now I'm not saying checkerboarding will or wont' work in a particular climate. I have not had the time to spend on resolving my problem which is that the bees are in the top box and I would have to rearrange the whole hive to do it..., I hope to sometime work on figuring out if I can apply it... But Dennis Murrel is certainly in a "Northern" climate and he seems sold on it.
 
#38 ·
>There seems to be a lot of misunderstanding of the "when". You would not be checkerboarding in the spring. That would take place in late winter before they have burned through those stores in the early buildup period before the first nectar flow.
I am too new at this to consider tearing apart the brood nest in late winter up here. Doing major surgery on the brood nest is something I feel uncomfortable with anyway. So I may never try it. Besides, a bumper honey crop is of no concern to me. My only concern would be swarm prevention and it appears that what technique you use has to be adjusted based on where the bees end up, and what the conditions of the hive is when you first open it up.

With this statement:
You should never have that much honey left in the spring to work with
It implies what you did in the fall when you put them to bed for the winter is also going to make a difference. So it looks like if either of my hives or both survive the winter I will have another whack and killing them next spring.
 
#39 ·
mb,

>I have not had the time to spend on resolving my problem which is that the bees are in the top box and I would have to rearrange the whole hive to do it...,

if someone were running all mediums, could they rearrange in the fall so as to put all the brood in the bottom and all of the honey on top? i guess that would still mean rearranging, but in the fall instead of late winter.
 
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