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  1. #1
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    Default Is SC business plan, small sell?

    Oldtimer makes some good points and they are points I have carefully avoided because I respect the attempts that many are making to be treatment free but since it's out there I do think the issue of whether there is actually any successful business model out there of a profitable self sustaining treatment free operation for those actually wanting to make a living at it. I'm talking about someone who is earning a living by selling honey, bees or pollination income and not the side businesses of writing, teaching or lecturing about being treatment free. I don't mean this in any way as a criticism of those folks and their passion for keeping bees as they see fit, I just think the question of economic viability is a fair one to be addressed on this forum if perhaps not in this particular thread.
    "People will generally accept facts as truth only if the facts agree with what they already believe."- Andy Rooney

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    You wiley devil Barry. Oh well what can I say? The words are mine. Incoming!!!!!!
    Actually in re-reading the SC exchange I missed your question to me, no matter hope it turns out to be a constructive thread.
    Last edited by jim lyon; 12-07-2011 at 09:16 PM. Reason: correction
    "People will generally accept facts as truth only if the facts agree with what they already believe."- Andy Rooney

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    I believe it is possible for a FEW individuals to make a profit of adequate size to support themselves solely from treatment free beekeeping. Unfortunately, with CCD, it will be quite difficult for those that are not adept at epidemic control and sterilization techniques. "We ain't in Kansas any more". Mites alone are not that big a deal, it is getting past CCD and being treatment free, that is the tough nut to crack.

    It will help if that individual can bring allot of family history, and family experience, to help with the sell. Of course, the target clientele will not be blue collar, but rather the "carriage trade" , and the honey priced accordingly.

    I see no future in treatment free pollination. No one would pay extra for it, that I am aware of.

    Did that sound too much like "Mein Kampf"?

    Crazy Roland

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    Quote Originally Posted by Roland View Post
    I see no future in treatment free pollination. No one would pay extra for it, that I am aware of.
    I'm reading a possible assumption here, why must one pay extra? Is not one's extra payment the lack of treating required?
    Solomon Parker, Parker Farms, ParkerFarms.biz
    11 Years Treatment-Free, ~25 Colony Baseline

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    Regarding Dee, she may receive revenue from side ventures (speaking, etc.), but selling her honey has been the main source when I last talked with her. Who knows if there are other side business interests (rental income, family monies, etc.). Then to get a real handle on things, one would have to know if that income is suitable for someone else's lifestyle. Lots of variables.
    Regards, Barry

  6. #6
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    Garland, Bladen County, NC, USA
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    Quote Originally Posted by Barry View Post
    Regarding Dee, she may receive revenue from side ventures (speaking, etc.), but selling her honey has been the main source when I last talked with her.
    So if you take away the honey... she goes bankrupt? That would tell me she has real skin in the game, and therefore a fully qualified commercial SC operation.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    Roland, I was addressing Jim's post.
    Regards, Barry

  8. #8
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    Thank you.

    Roland

  9. #9
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    VENTURA, California, USA
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    Re;
    Mites alone are not that big a deal.
    Can you explain the above statement.
    Thanks,
    Ernie
    My websitehttp://bees4u.com/

  10. #10
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    Dec 1999
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    Well, I've often had the same question. I don't get my income from bees, so this isn't something I have to be concerned about. But you and other's certainly do. Dee is the only one I know of actually making their living off of SC beekeeping. What are the real numbers? I don't know. Not sure how one in your situation could realistically convert over.
    Regards, Barry

  11. #11
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    I'm looking forward to Seeing Michael Bush go full time. I will certainly be supporting his business.
    Solomon Parker, Parker Farms, ParkerFarms.biz
    11 Years Treatment-Free, ~25 Colony Baseline

  12. #12
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    BArry wrote:

    Not sure how one in your situation could realistically convert over.


    To whom was that addressed?

    Crazy Roland

  13. #13
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    Garland, Bladen County, NC, USA
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    Is this the place... where it would not be too negative - to ask about the nature of the Lusby operation? Is her primary source of income Honey... Bees... or is she mainly involved with lecturing, writing, or something else we might not define as typical of a commercial operation. I am not asking this with any kind of agenda... just that if there is an SC commercial operation of some type out there... then there is something to be learned.

  14. #14
    Join Date
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    Stillwell, KS
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    649

    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    Quote Originally Posted by jim lyon View Post
    Oldtimer makes some good points and they are points I have carefully avoided because I respect the attempts that many are making to be treatment free but since it's out there I do think the issue of whether there is actually any successful business model out there of a profitable self sustaining treatment free operation for those actually wanting to make a living at it. I'm talking about someone who is earning a living by selling honey, bees or pollination income and not the side businesses of writing, teaching or lecturing about being treatment free. I don't mean this in any way as a criticism of those folks and their passion for keeping bees as they see fit, I just think the question of economic viability is a fair one to be addressed on this forum if perhaps not in this particular thread.

    Paradigm is wrong.


    Small Cell / Treatment free / Natural beekeeping and maximizing profits are completely different goals and in direct opposition to each other.


    Jeez, I sound like a tree hugger, somebody shoot me.

    Don

  15. #15
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    Jan 2005
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    Hamilton, Alabama
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    Small Cell / Treatment free / Natural beekeeping and maximizing profits are completely different goals and in direct opposition to each other.
    I would not put them in direct opposition. I would consider them to not be aligned but not opposed. The reason is that maximizing profits inherently involves doing things that just don't happen in a natural colony. For example, it is not natural for a colony to be packed up on a truck and moved 500 miles four times in a year to get pollination rental. It is also not natural for bees to work a single floral source for several weeks because that is the only food available. These are what commercial beekeepers do to make a profit. It is not what bees do under natural conditions.

    Said another way, I make enough honey to consider my bees to be profitable. I just don't try to maximize profits to the detriment of the bees.

    DarJones
    DarJones - 45 years, 10 colonies (max 40), sideliner, treatment free since 2005, 11 frame broodnest, small cell

  16. #16
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    Location
    KC, MO, USA
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    Ok let’s look at this for a minute

    If a commercial beek rotates old comb as needed and switch to SC in the process. And does everything else the same like treatments...

    This should not cost the commercial beek any more money or work. Five years down the road the beek will have all small cell and the option to skip a treatment if they want or continue treatment. I would think just to have the option would be a bonus. Maybe skip treatment on 1/4 of the hive each year. Or just continue to treat and have the possibility of allot less mites during a flow and during non treatment times.

    Why would a Commercial Beek not want to do that???

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
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    DuPage County, Illinois USA
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    Because treatments contaminate combs. Also, You can't just stick a couple of frames of SC foundation into a LC hive and expect the comb to be drawn out to match the sc.
    Regards, Barry

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
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    Hamilton, Alabama
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    Default Re: Is SC business plan, small sell?

    You can't just stick a couple of frames of SC foundation into a LC hive and expect the comb to be drawn out to match the sc.
    Why not?

    Yes, I'm asking this somewhat facetiously.

    What if you had a source of queens that were from adapted small cell colonies and you requeened 100 colonies that are on large cell combs with the small cell queens. Could the resulting workers properly draw out small cell?

    I am looking for an answer to this question and should have enough information to draw some conclusions early next spring.

    DarJones
    DarJones - 45 years, 10 colonies (max 40), sideliner, treatment free since 2005, 11 frame broodnest, small cell

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