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Swarm trap: What do you load/or not load your trap with?

19K views 56 replies 17 participants last post by  Michael Bush 
#1 ·
If you were to use a trap the same size of a 10 frame deep, would you load the trap up with undrawn frames of foundation? Maybe foundationless frames with starter strips? Maybe a couple of frames with drawn comb (a premium for a new bee keeper like me!!)?

My whole thing is I dont want to have to transfer wild comb to frames unless I have to, unless im doing a cut out or something. Is it possible to have a swarm take up residency in a swarm trap and then build out frames?

Question for Charlie and ODFrank since we are in the same area..............when do you start seeing your first swarms in the bay area?

Take care and thanks for any and all replies!!..................Jason
 
#2 ·
I use two frames of drawn comb, one on each side next to the walls to give it an open appearance. I then fill the rest of the box in with foundationless frames with wax coated starter strips keeping with the roomy appearance. That way, they just start filling in the frames after they roost. I also use lemongrass oil as a lure. They love it.

Swarms here usually start late March early April and run clear through to September.

Spring will be here before you know it. Happy hunting!! :thumbsup:
 
#5 ·
I have had so many deadouts the last few years I have been able to fill mine with almost all old black comb and a few drops of LGO. The 8 frame wineboxes I set out last year with mostly broken yellow extracting combs and LGO had only 33 % success.
Down by the bay the swarms start beginning of March and the dates get later moving west up the hill to 280 just a few miles. I got a call as early as 2/15 last year.
I am always cautious setting out boxes with foundation unless it will soon get drawn out, the foundation can warp in an unventilated box. Charlie and Michael's layout sounds like a good plan. I have had no moth problems until later in the summer.
I am making 8 framers now but have had good luck with 5 framers, which are easier for a old decrepit fart like me to carry.
 
#6 ·
Placing foundationless frames is a good idea if its a while in between checks to see if you have caught anything, but make sure that your traps are nice and level (from side to side) or else its going to be one heckuva mess. I place an old drawn frame with LGO and fill the rest with plastic frames that werent drawn out the summer prior. Its kina like fishing, the more lines in the water, the better your success rate.
 
#7 ·
I have used 1 or 2 brood frames and the rest foundation in the past, but foundationless instead of foundation now sounds like a better idea. I've only used commercially avialable swarm bait thus far, though I'd like to graduate to Mr. Bush's swarm lure. I'm gonna have to bring myself to kill a few queens.
 
#8 ·
Thanks to everyone for their input!! I have plenty of plastic/waxed foundation and also have some chunks of black comb from a couple removals that I could stick in the boxes, and LGO. I may stagger plastic foundation and foundationless frames and see what happens..............a fishing I will go come spring, well, actually i'll set some traps out in February so they are established before the swarms start!!

Again, thank you to everyone for your ideas!!.................Jason
 
#9 ·
Jason,

Don't do the plastic foundation stagger thing, I tried it and they don't like it. They like the look of plenty of room and foundationless works well to that end.

Keep us posted. I plan to beat odfranks record of 50 swarms next year. :D We'll see how it goes.

Good hunting!
 
#11 ·
J I plan to beat odfranks record of 50 swarms next year. :D We'll see how it goes. Good hunting!
I think my record is higher, I lost track this year. This is what I set out Spring 2011, I think there was another pile, some caught more than one, the wineboxes only caught 33%:

 
#10 ·
Holy crap Charlie, I dont think you and I together could top odfranks 50 swarms!! Thats incredible!!

Looks like I wont try the staggering thing, just a chunk of black comb, LGO and foundationless frames!! Thanks for the heads up!!........Jason
 
#19 ·
#23 ·
do you not like the plastic ones because of a shorter life span?
I have not tried the plastic ones, and I don't plan to. Why buy something in plastic when you can get something in metal. The metal is galvanized and will last decades without a doubt. I don't know of anything plastic that is positively known to hold up that long in direct sunlight, including the bed of my pickup. :pinch:


Frank you seem to be the master at baiting swarms, but let's be honest, your climate has just a little to do with it.:shhhh:
 
#22 ·
I found that if you hang those metal entrance disks with the hole at the bottom, and the bolt is loose, they will swing themselves shut because the hole side is lighter and it revolves to the top. I lost a huge swarm this summer because of one self closing. But, I prefer the entrance at the bottom for better drainage and cleaning.

Also, I have for years just sprinkled a few drops of LGO on a comb and at the entrance, no baggies no nothing. It soaks into the wood and wax and several of my boxes catch more than one swarm a year without a second baiting.
 
#24 ·
Solomon Parker;733405The metal is galvanized and will last decades without a doubt. I don't know of anything plastic that is positively known to hold up that long in direct sunlight said:
I have had the plastic ones break within two years, but are still functional. You can see a broken blue one in the picture. I switched to metal.

My swarm trapping success is not due to my skill, knowledge, or technique, but rather my good looks. Also adding to my success is the climate, suburban flora, bee clubs that import hundreds of packages to my area, lots of beginner beekeepers who don't give their colonies enough space, numerous hollow oak trees to house feral bees, and most of all, lots of beekeeper swarm catching guys like Charlie with numerous hives in their yard pitching swarms. Yes, I do nothing more than you guys, just old combs and LGO. I am just in an area with literally thousands of swarms flying around. I think I have over 90% success. I caught 13 at one site, which must be within range of someone who buys his bees, some were clearly a commercial strain. I am trapping in dense suburban neighbor hoods.
 
#25 ·
Now that I have two yards and options on other spots, I'm going to push to catch more swarms this year. Last year, I caught 2 from three traps, but the ones within reach of my house are so tiny, a few cupfuls of bees, but they're good at winter survival. I know they're not mine, my hives are all kept much larger.

I use 5 frame nucs, because they are easier to haul up into trees. This last year, I screwed a vertical board to the side with a hole in the top to screw straight into the tree.

Unfortunately, unlike you, there are few beekeepers around here. Forage is slim most of the year and there are no commercials and few backyarders. I'm convinced these consistently small swarms are coming from small tree hollows around here somewhere.
 
#26 ·
I use 5 frame nucs, because they are easier to haul up into trees.
I never place them higher than I can reach standing on the ground. I like top of garden walls, picnic tables, over turned garbage cans, top of wood piles, hoods of abandoned cars. Woodpiles work particularly well:
 
#27 ·
That's a good plan and I'd love to do that, but most of the area I have access to is pasture. There's goodly sized trees with the lowest branches six feet or more off the ground. I plop my 8 foot ladder against the tree, climb up with the box and a screw gun and it goes pretty quick.

About what density to you scatter them about?
 
#28 ·
About what density to you scatter them about?
You might try and find 15g. nursery buckets for bait hive stands.
I put one, two or three at sites spread from San Francisco north to San Jose in the south, probably a 50 mile spread. On some Saturday nights I have picked up as many as six a week. I get a lot at my shop where I keep about 30 hives, some of my own and some fly ins. As Charlie says, apiaries seem to attract fly ins. Having a solar melter cooking helps attract them also.
 
#33 ·
What is this metal disk being discussed up-thread? It is ok to just use a bottom entrance hive or nuc with mainly open frames, and a bottom opening, bit of comb on one frame and some LGO, right? I did trap a small swarm in September with just a nuc baited with wax coated plastic frames, one with comb, and LGO, no fancy anything.
 
#34 ·
Gypsi,

Use your hive boxes you had this summer, (You need a lure box with that "lived in smell"). They will hit on a bottom entrance if you use an entrance reducer down to about 1 1/2 inches. They want to be able to protect themselves because they're vulnerable when they first get established so a smaller entrance is attractive to them. (Even robber bees want protection)

Set them out in early spring. You have nothing to lose, your boxes would just be sitting in storage anyway, right? You may get some free bees to make up for your loses over the summer.
 
#35 ·
Is smaller better? I have 2 nuks I'm going to use for lures--I wondered can I also use a shallow super and put in a frame or two of drawn comb and then foundationless frames? Instead of a deep box? I also have medium supers I could use.

My first swarm catch last year, I used LG oil, and also on a daily basis I had a popsicle stick I dipped in honey and that got them in checking it out. It took about 4-5 days to get a swarm in.

I'm placing boxes under a tree where I've seen swarms, including one that bailed on me last year and then came back when I placed it at the tree they'd swarmed to. I think they were driven out by robber bees. It was a small removal I'd done from a water meter for a co-worker. They left and I put out the box, 48 hrs they were back. I'm assuming it was the same colony.
 
#36 ·
Charlie,

Should I put the boxes at normal hive height - which I did last year, or maybe put one up on top of my shed or in my big tree. (and if I put it in the big tree I'm guessing that dial an opening is how to keep bees in when getting it down?)

Gypsi
 
#37 ·
Bevy,

Just like it was mentioned earlier, it's like fishing. I would place different sizes out and give them choices. I had a medium and a deep out in my yard in SF and they chose the medium. I had both out in Saratoga and they chose the deep. The colony that chose the deep was twice the size of the colony that chose the medium. As stated, odfrank has a great deal of success with nucs. If you know of a tree or other area that a previous swarm has landed, that's your best bet besides placing them in your apiary.

Gypsi,

I would place a box where you caught that one over the summer. Like odfrank said, I don't think you have to place them too high in a tree. Don't kill yourself trying to get height. If you bait it properly, that's what matters the most. Remember, you have to get it back down full of bees. Yes, the dial will close the entrance but still allow air in. Make sure the dial is not loose and spins open as your retrieving the box from on high. Not a good combo!!! I just duct tape window screen over the entrance. (I don't have money like odfrank does to buy luxury items like that). :rolleyes:

Happy Hunting!!
 
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