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  1. #1
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    Default @ what temp does heat hurt nutrition of honey?



    Crushing & Straining honey seems to be a painfully slow. Seems like you could get more honey. I thought I would heat the comb & attempt to separate wax & honey. Is that possible without hurting the good stuff in the honey?
    Rmns 1:16/Prv.3:5,6/ Beegan BK May 09/ Zone 5b
    I have NOT failed. I have only found many many ways that do not work!

  2. #2
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    Depends.

    Heating honey to 160 degrees for minutes will start the caramelization process, the burning of sugars. 150 degrees, not so much. 140 degrees even less. And so on. Many people point to 110 degrees as the point which honey starts to loose some of its' properties. Some even say 100 degrees.

    Personally, I have no problem heating honey to 150 degrees to clear the crystals. and then 110 to 140 for bottling. I get no complaints from my customers. Though the RAW Honey has been selling pretty well too.

    What good stuff are you concerned about hurting?
    Mark Berninghausen #youmatter

  3. #3
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    One of the states recently put not over 115F to be defined as raw honey, in their definition of honey.
    I try not to take mine over 110F.
    Dan

  4. #4
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    I'd say on a hot day honey probably gets to 110 F in a super but the wax is pretty soft and could give way at that temp.

    But as far as damage, any heat seems to hurt the flavor and anything over 120 F I'm sure is breaking down enzymes.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  5. #5
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    Carlton,WA,USA
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    I am wondering what the maximum temperature the bees will tolerate in the super stack (as opposed to the brood nest). Seems like we should respect their judgement. Does anyone know?

  6. #6
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    We had temps in supers in hives placed in full sun reaching 119f this August... the brood chambers from those same hives were reaching 118f... these are air temps, not the temps of the solids or liquids of course...

    I have been working on some studies on the effects of full sun placement, since it has been recommended so heavily by so many... the stress levels are tremendous on a colony that is fighting to keep hive temps below 120f... shb and mites may not care for temps that high, but the bees sure don't either, and only time will tell just what vulnerabilities stresses like that will create... and like MB pointed out, what enzymes could be lost that could contribute to poorer health...

  7. #7
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    Quote Originally Posted by MethowKraig View Post
    Seems like we should respect their judgement.
    Huh? In what way and on what? What temperature to heat honey to make it useable for human consumption? We don't do that w/ milk or steak or vegetables. Unless, I guess, one is into a Raw Foods Diet.
    Mark Berninghausen #youmatter

  8. #8
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    Quote Originally Posted by rrussell6870 View Post
    what enzymes could be lost that could contribute to poorer health...
    "poorer health" of bees, right? The Thread is about heating honey before HUMAN consumption, isn't it? On a meaningful level, the nutritional qualities of honey are of little value(?) to human nutrition. We do not NEED or DEPEND on Honey to meet our nutritional needs, do we? So, what meaningful qualities are lost by heating honey, besides taste and color.

    Doesn't the meer act of uncapping loose some of the properties of honey associated w/ flavor? Or is it the taste of the wax which makes comb honey taste different from extracted honey from the exact same floral source, botanically and grographically?
    Mark Berninghausen #youmatter

  9. #9
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    Many of the health benefits of honey have to do with enzymes. Enzymes that break down sugars such as diatase and invertase, enzymes that slow bacteria such as inhibine, enzymes that give off H2O2 (which kills bacteria) such as Glucose Oxidase etc. Enzymes are very heat sensitive. That's one of the reasons a high fever makes your brain not work right. It breaks down enzymes that are used in your brain at temperatures as low as 110 F.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  10. #10
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    Quote Originally Posted by sqkcrk View Post
    On a meaningful level, the nutritional qualities of honey are of little value(?) to human nutrition.
    That may or may not be true. The jury is still out on pollen content in honey and alergies
    Quote Originally Posted by sqkcrk View Post
    We do not NEED or DEPEND on Honey to meet our nutritional needs, do we?
    . Not sure about what ya mean by that statement since we don't need meat, milk eggs or cheese to meet our nutritional needs ether.
    Quote Originally Posted by sqkcrk View Post
    So, what meaningful qualities are lost by heating honey, besides taste and color.
    See above.

    Quote Originally Posted by sqkcrk View Post
    Doesn't the meer act of uncapping loose some of the properties of honey associated w/ flavor?
    No
    Quote Originally Posted by sqkcrk View Post
    Or is it the taste of the wax which makes comb honey taste different from extracted honey from the exact same floral source, botanically and grographically?
    Wax has no taste. I never noticed a different taste between comb and RAW honey. Must be the heat thing.
    Im really not that serious

  11. #11
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Bush View Post
    Many of the health benefits of honey have to do with enzymes. Enzymes that break down sugars such as diatase and invertase, enzymes that slow bacteria such as inhibine, enzymes that give off H2O2 (which kills bacteria) such as Glucose Oxidase etc. Enzymes are very heat sensitive. That's one of the reasons a high fever makes your brain not work right. It breaks down enzymes that are used in your brain at temperatures as low as 110 F.
    So why isn't this ever presented on Labels on Honey Jars? "Contains such and such enzymes which promote etc., etc."?
    Mark Berninghausen #youmatter

  12. #12
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    Give the regulators time
    Im really not that serious

  13. #13
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    Algoma dr. Ontario, Canada
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    The honey we heat to separate the cappings gets used for cooking. It is going to get heated then anyway.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    I bottle very little honey for retail sales, maybe a barrel per year. The rest goes out as wholesale in barrels, never heated. Whatever honey I bottle gets heated to about 100-105 just to go through the filters easily. At those minimum temps the honey maintains color and taste, why heat any warmer? Florida's honey law does not allow pasteurization so high temps are not legal anyway. If you're going to sell a natural product I believe it ought to be as natural as you can make it. When folks taste the real stuff they're amazed at the difference between natural honey and the junk at the supermarkets. Heating to any temp above 135 degrees changes the color and I would guess the content of enzymes also. My first job in the bees was with a commercial beek who bottled about half of his own honey. Way back then, late 50's, the local health dept required heating to 135-140 degrees; the nice light colored orange blossum honey turned medium to dark amber after heating and lost the real orange blossum taste. Heat it if you like, but you're not going to be giving people the same stuff that came out of the hive and that's what my customers want.

  15. #15
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    I was indeed referring to bee health... I was more so discussing my own findings of temps within the supers and chambers of full sun hives in the south... although the honey itself may never reach the temps that the air does, it probably does reach the 110 f point... thus destroying several beneficial enzymes that the bees would need for good health...

    Looks like someone stayed awake during microbiology class MB. Lol. I can agree that from a humans standpoint, honey is not an essential dietary need, but the enzymes that are within the honey already do help even our bodies to break down the sugars starting within our mouths... without these enzymes, stomach aches, cramping, diarrhea, head aches, and tooth decay are more likely to occur... its like the difference between eating a fresh apple and eating a baked apple... the sugars are there either way but the sugars in the fresh apple are accompanied by enzymes that help the body to break them down and sort them into proper uses, while the sugars in the baked apple are only partially digested using some as instant energy burn, some stored in fat cells, and the rest passed as waste...

    While the dietary qualities are important for bee health, I do not think that its that important for human consumption... I love honey, but I wouldn't consider it a part of my diet... the majority of honey is heated one way or another be it from the processing, cooking, adding to hot liquids when used as a sweetener, etc... sugar is a part of my diet though, so in situations where people are substituting all sweeteners for honey (god love em), I could see how they would be concerned about the enzymes remaining... at least for direct consumption...

    My focuss is of course the guttural health of the bees which equals to fewer winter losses, stronger build ups, and less diseases...

  16. #16
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    Speaking of guttural health..... LOL A few weeks ago, I was quite sick with what I thought was food poisoning. I remembered reading that raw honey helps with that and to take a spoonful every so often. I did that and it helped tremendously. I seemed to recover faster also.

    The benefits of raw honey are many and extend beyond just nutrition. It is supposed to be the sweetener of choice for diabetics also. Honey is utilized by the liver and enables the liver to pull glucose out of the blood stream to be used as needed. I read where artificial sweeteners trick the body, that the body recognizes it as sugar even though it is not, thus releasing insulin which causes the body to store it as fat.

    Two books worth reading about honey:
    The Hibernation Diet by Mike and Stuart McInnes
    The Honey Revolution by Ron Fessenden, MD, MPH and Mike McInnes, MRPS

  17. #17
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    I can relate to the recent stomach bug/food poisoning combination... long story, short... Vietnamese owned Chinese buffet + Japanese sushi + tiny ship boat village in the deep cajun bayous = THROW ME OUT OF THE BOAT AND LET THE SHARKS DO WHAT THE DO.... IF THEY EVEN WILL! There was certainly plenty of enzymes there, just not any of the good kind...

    If I would have had it, I would have downed a bottle of something stout and let my enzymes start all over from there... lol.

  18. #18
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    Honey has little or no nutritional value. Many people live their entire lives without consuming any honey whatsoever. It simply isnt needed to sustain human life.

    Enzymes? You body already produces all the enzymes that are needed to sustain life. Despite current health and nutritional fads, consuming supplemental enzymes (from honey for instance) doesnt do much, or at least it hasnt been proven to be beneficial.

    It is the degradation of the aesthetics qualities of honey (taste, color, consistancy) are affected by most by heating.
    Last edited by Nabber86; 09-22-2011 at 10:39 AM.
    Honey Badger Don't Care ಠ_ಠ ~=[,,_,,]:3

  19. #19
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    After reading back over my post, I guess I should make one sentence more clear... the bold type was added for clarity...

    honey is not an essential dietary need, but the enzymes that are within the honey already do help even our bodies to break down the sugars within the honey starting within our mouths... without these enzymes, stomach aches, cramping, diarrhea, head aches, and tooth decay are more likely to occur...

  20. #20
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    Default Re: @ what temp duz heat hurt nutrition of honey?

    Quote Originally Posted by rrussell6870 View Post
    After reading back over my post, I guess I should make one sentence more clear... the bold type was added for clarity...

    honey is not an essential dietary need, but the enzymes that are within the honey already do help even our bodies to break down the sugars within the honey starting within our mouths... without these enzymes, stomach aches, cramping, diarrhea, head aches, and tooth decay are more likely to occur...
    Yes that is true. Enzymes are absolutely essential for human health. You would die without them. However, the enzymes added by ingesting a teaspoon or two of raw honey is miniscule compared to the amount of enzymes that are already present in your mouth and gut.

    Now I suppose in extremely rare instances a person could develop an enzyme defficiency and become ill. But ff that was the case, one would be far better off by consultaing a doctor than consuming honey in order to correct the situation.
    Honey Badger Don't Care ಠ_ಠ ~=[,,_,,]:3

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