Has anyone used frames in a TBH?

**AuntBee** · 09-17-2011, 02:31 PM

I am new to beekeeping this year and have one hive-a TBH. Anyone who has read my posts this summer knows that I have struggled with a hot hive all summer. One thing that always makes my girls furious is when I use the knife to cut the comb from the sides of the hive so I can take it out to check it. I try to be extremely careful not to squash anybody and to draw the knife up gently and without sawing, but it still makes them swarm out at me and then they stay mad.

(Yes, I smoke them through the entrance and through the vents and wait a few seconds before beginning. They are not being robbed. I've requeened, fed them, and even told them I love them--they're still not cooperating.)

As I was looking through the viewing window today noticing that most of the combs are attached (again) to the sides, and dreading the attack bees--not just a few, more like a cloud of them--that are sure to come after me (again) each time I cut them loose, I thought there must be some type of frames to use in a TBH.

Does anyone else have this problem? Have you tried TBH frames? Do they work? Where would one purchase them? Next spring as I add hives, I plan to use Langstroths, but I like my TBH except for this problem, which, as I have said, makes my bees seriously angry and difficult.

**Oldtimer** · 09-17-2011, 03:26 PM

Yes it's been done in various forms, from making frames for the TBH, to adding supers with frames. Check this thread
http://www.beesource.com/forums/show...-Top-Bar-Hives

However, making frames for a TBH is quite difficult, as the bee space needs to be maintained fairly accurately all around the frame, or the bees will just gum it up.

Even though you have requeend, I am a bit suspicious you have a nasty bee. Was the queen from a reputable breeder? I think you should leave them as they are through winter, then next spring order in a queen, tell the breeder you want a docile strain, any decent breeder will be able to do that for you. Make sure it is introduced properly, not just killed and the bees breed their own replacement bad tempered one.

**AuntBee** · 09-17-2011, 04:03 PM

My queen came from my brother and all of his 8-9 hives are really calm. She's been in the hive for about a month. I had planned to go in after a few weeks and destroy any queen cells that the bees might have made, just in case they were thinking of superceding her with a bad-blood queen. But the hive has been so hot that I wasn't able to do a thorough inspection. I have just left them alone for a couple of weeks, but they are building a new comb on the end and it is curving. After my first post, I thought I would try today to move it in between some other combs, but they came out by the hundreds (literally) and made me put the hive back together in a big hurry. Long story short--I guess I'll take your advice and let them do whatever they darn well please until next spring.

**Oldtimer** · 09-17-2011, 04:12 PM

Oh, only a month. Well if she was in the cage for a couple of days, then took another couple of days to start laying, her first bees will only just have started to hatch less than a week ago. Too soon to know how her bees will turn out, you'll get a better indication in another month or two. If the old bees are REALLY nasty, just a few of them left in the hive will still attack you and it can take a long time for the last ones to die.

**sqkcrk** · 09-18-2011, 05:25 AM

It just seems to me to be counterintuitive to use frames in a system designed to not need them. Seems like you would be asking for problems.

I'm gonna take a chance and say, No, no one manufactures frames for TBHs. Very few TBHs are manufactured, though you will find adds on the side of this page.

Good luck. Use smoke more often while manipulating combs.

**Michael Bush** · 09-18-2011, 06:51 AM

If you make the hive the same dimensions as a Langstroth you can put frames in when you like from the Langstroth hives. I have several of these.

http://www.bushfarms.com/beestopbarhives.htm#ttbh

I keep meaning to make some frames for my KTBH, but haven't needed them bad enough to do so. I think it would be good to have some in case of comb that is really out of line so you can tie it in a frame. I can't seem making a full set of frames, you may as well just make a long Langstroth hive.

http://www.bushfarms.com/beeshorizontalhives.htm

**AuntBee** · 09-18-2011, 08:34 AM

Oldtimer, I was thinking that, too. I may just have to leave them alone until all of the old queen's descendents die out.

Michael, thanks for your suggestion and photos. It seems like a very good idea to build the TBH with the dimensions of a Lang.

**Adam Foster Collins** · 09-18-2011, 06:32 PM

You're always going to get a bit of attachment on the upper edges of some of the combs in a top bar this time of year, as the added weight of honey makes the bees feel the need to add some strength here and there. I think it'll be interesting to see what the new brood is like from the new queen.

As a side note, where are your bees located? Are they near a lot of activity? Or are they isolated in a quiet place?

Adam

**FordPrefect** · 09-18-2011, 08:15 PM

Just make a frame like this one...

**deejaycee** · 09-18-2011, 08:34 PM

AuntBee - if you would message me an email address, I can email you an article I wrote recently on framing TBHs.

I don't have a TBH, but do run natural comb in a few of my Langs, and the frames work very well in that respect.

**Adam Foster Collins** · 09-18-2011, 08:41 PM

Fordprefect,

If I were to make frames for the tbh, that's exactly how I'd do it. Thin strips of wood, bent and attached to either end of the comb guide, or set into grooves.

Adam

**AuntBee** · 09-18-2011, 09:28 PM

My hive is in a very quiet place. Our backyard. Just two of us, our dog (who has learned to keep a good distance from the hive), 5 chickens, lots of birds, and one hive. It is set up in a flower bed that I water everyday, and I do check on the bees everyday, but I don't open the hive very often (I'd like to, but they don't appreciate it, so I leave them alone)

**Adam Foster Collins** · 09-19-2011, 07:41 PM

The reason I asked is a change I observed with my father's bees, and what I see in my own. My bees are in the city. They are within thirty feet of a city street. There is a lot of traffic around, and the bees are not defensive at all. My kids can walk right up to the hives and stand in the fly-way and not get stung.

I went to visit my father's hives in Vermont. At the time, his were located alone in the edge of the woods next to a farm field - quite isolated. You couldn't get anywhere near that hive without being harassed and/or stung. But when a bear got to the hives, my father decided to relocate them to his yard, next to his house. He was worried about this, but I told him to make his presence felt with them from day one, which he did. Right from the beginning he would go out and near the hives with his coffee and watch them, not pestering, them but always plainly in view and nearby.

He has seen a drastic behavioral change in the bees since the move. They are no where near as defensive.

Now your bees may already have plenty of action around, but I asked the question, because I thought they might be in a quiet spot which makes them especially defensive about any intrusion.

Adam