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  1. #61
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    Cookeville, TN, USA
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Joseph - I have 2 questions.

    How many grafts were in that batch?

    Do you give a water source directly to your starter finisher - like a sponge or something - or do you just let the foragers bring it in from outside the hive?

    As usual I have cell envy from your pictures.

  2. #62
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    Jul 2008
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    Philadelphia, MS, USA
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    624

    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    "I am required by state law to treat every colony that produces a package or nuc... so I test every single one and only treat at thresholds that are bit below the minimal accepted threshold or more, which are very very few"

    Robert, where is that law? I have seen nothing that says you must treat every hive, only that you can't sell diseased hives.

    Johnny
    "Suppose you were an idiot and suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." - Mark Twain

  3. #63
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Brandon, MS USA
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Rules of MS Dept of Ag and Commerce.... Chapter 06- Bee Disease Regulations, 101, 101.05, 103 (b).

  4. #64
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    Feb 2005
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    Tucson, Arizona, USA
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    That one was from a JZsBZs 15 cell bar, but there were three ripe ones (the oldest three - started from a different mother queen) with another ten a day away from being capped, and another bar of 15 was just started on the opposite side of the cell builder. So, cells of several different ages are in there all at the same time, and from different mother queens. I've marked each MQ colony with a particular color thumbtack, and I use the same colors to track the daughters throughout their production. I place a colored thumbtack on the cell bars, and then on each mating nuc where the cells are planted.

    No, I don't use an internal water source. I don't ever confine the bees in my cell builders. I keep lots of water sources nearby -- koi pond, evaporative cooler, micro-sprinkler timed automatic irrigation system, and several plastic buckets of water with sticks floating in them. And, of course, when there isn't a moderate-strong flow on, I keep a quart of 1:1 sugar syrup in there, inverted, and with a few small holes in its lid.

    Here is a photo of the remainder of those cells on that bar. I placed all that were ready yesterday and these were recently sealed, so will be ready to place in a few more days -->

    Last edited by Joseph Clemens; 08-20-2011 at 09:24 PM. Reason: Updated
    48 years - 50 hives - TF
    Joseph Clemens -- Website Under Constructioni

  5. #65
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Sacramento,California,USA
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    3,560

    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Yes Joseph Clemens, I remember your posting.
    I've noticed in past years that the second round always seemed to come out better. I seem to remember reading somewhere about setting up the cell builders before hand with a frame of eggs/larva that were removed as the grafts put in, but can't remember where. Then I read your posting and so started doing it this way this year. I've liked the results so far. Thank you!

  6. #66
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    Jan 2009
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    Cookeville, TN, USA
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Joseph Clemens- this is still 5 medium frames in a deep hive body, correct?

  7. #67
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    Cookeville, TN, USA
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Quote Originally Posted by rrussell6870 View Post
    Rules of MS Dept of Ag and Commerce.... Chapter 06- Bee Disease Regulations, 101, 101.05, 103 (b).
    Just curious - taking into account that all producers aren't in the same class of experise, do you agree with the spirit of those requirements?

  8. #68
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    Feb 2005
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    Tucson, Arizona, USA
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Yes, deep, 5-frame nuc box. Actually, three frames of honey/pollen/sealed-emerging brood, one foundationless frame. I need to leave the fifth frame out to make space for my narrow cell bars. Sometimes I'll use a two-level cell bar frame. But I usually only use them when I need a lot more cells than I do right now. There's room for thirty cells in the two-level cell bar frames.
    48 years - 50 hives - TF
    Joseph Clemens -- Website Under Constructioni

  9. #69
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Rules of MS Dept of Ag and Commerce.... Chapter 06- Bee Disease Regulations, 101, 101.05, 103 (b)

    According to that document, a commercial beekeeper is defined as having fifty or more managed colonies. Apparently non-commercial beekeepers are not required to register their apiaries, but may choose to do so. I wonder if these rules are intended to apply to both commercial and non-commercial beekeepers, alike? I don't see any specifics regarding that idea.
    48 years - 50 hives - TF
    Joseph Clemens -- Website Under Constructioni

  10. #70
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    Sep 2005
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    Greensboro, North Carolina
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Joe, yet again you have some very nice cells going on there. Kudos.

    I'm feeling a bit under the weather today, so I'm taking the day off. Tomorrow afternoon I'll be moving two of my parent hives back to my back yard. Having your grafts in a yard an hour away doesn't really work out when you want to add new grafts daily. Hopefully, on Tuesday I'll be able to do my last set of grafting for the season. Russell's royal jelly is sitting in the fridge just waiting

  11. #71
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Gilmer,TX USA
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Quote Originally Posted by Broke-T View Post
    "I am required by state law to treat every colony that produces a package or nuc... so I test every single one and only treat at thresholds that are bit below the minimal accepted threshold or more, which are very very few"

    Robert, where is that law? I have seen nothing that says you must treat every hive, only that you can't sell diseased hives.

    Johnny
    I though Russell Apiaries was treatment free????
    MIke
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  12. #72
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    May 2009
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    Brandon, MS USA
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Mike, there are several different operations within my one operation... ie.. queen production, package production, nuc production, and research... each have different locations (vastly spread out) and each have different management needs of course. Yes, our queens are treatment free... packages and nucs are from hives that have either been treated or were tested and found to be well below the legal required threshold.

    Here is a thread from the treatment free forum that may help describe the differences a bit further... this link is to a later post, so read further back in the thread to get the full idea.

    http://www.beesource.com/forums/show...and-Nucs/page4

  13. #73
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    Brandon, MS USA
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    David, I think that the law and the science have not truly caught up with one another yet... the idea behind the law has good intentions in that it was imposed to keep pests and disease from being spread... however, the science for truly defeating the pests and diseases was not taken into account. In all it serves its purpose and is not really so much of a burden as one may think... I am not against the idea of addressing a problem, and readily act when one is present, so its more or less simply a formality and the wording of the law actually leaves the legal authority open to the interpretation of the particular circumstances of each case... the law doesn't actually make it clear that EVERY colony must be treated, although it does suggest that because it says that they must be treated unless they are "free from" pests, which as we all know is not very likely even after treatment... in the case of queens, we all know that its extremely unlikely that something could be passed along, but that fact is not covered by this law... what it all boils down to is the producer must have an understanding of what would be transmittable and in what methods they can be transferred... then a strict policy of testing and control must be implemented...

  14. #74
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Quote Originally Posted by Joseph Clemens View Post
    [COLOR="blue"]According to that document, a commercial beekeeper is defined as having fifty or more managed colonies. Apparently non-commercial beekeepers are not required to register their apiaries, but may choose to do so. I wonder if these rules are intended to apply to both commercial and non-commercial beekeepers, alike? I don't see any specifics regarding that idea.
    From the legal definitions...
    4. “Commercial Beekeeper” – Person or persons owning and/or managing 50 or
    more colonies of bees for the purpose of:
    a. Producing honey
    b. Producing package bees and/or queen bees for sale or use by other
    beekeepers.
    c. Providing pollination services for a fee
    d. Resale within the year.
    e. Person(s) owning and/or managing less than 50 colonies of bees for any
    purpose so described above, except for honey production alone shall
    be deemed a commercial apiarist
    .

    This is the way that MS law determines the difference between a commercial operation and a non-commercial... By these standards, a guy with one hive who sells a queen or a nuc from that hive is considered a commercial bee keeper... again its just an issue of non-spicific regulations which are usually left up to the determination of the particular case, but leave the option of enforcement of any and every individual completely up to the state officials... can be dangerous, can be helpful... it just depends on the integrity of the parties involved, both state official and bee keeper alike.

  15. #75
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    Feb 2005
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    Tucson, Arizona, USA
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Thanks Dr. Russell, apparently I overlooked paragraph 4.e. looks like my reading skills are growing weak. I think it's interesting how Mississippi has gone to the trouble of putting together guidelines/rules such as those. I'm still looking to see if there are any like that, here in Arizona -- I think I'll call Carl Hayden Bee Lab in the morning and ask them if they can point me in the right direction. I did some web searches of Dept. of Ag., etc., but haven't found anything, yet.
    48 years - 50 hives - TF
    Joseph Clemens -- Website Under Constructioni

  16. #76
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    Feb 2005
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Cultured queen cells growing nicely:


    I especially appreciate how they are becoming well-provisioned with royal jelly.
    48 years - 50 hives - TF
    Joseph Clemens -- Website Under Constructioni

  17. #77
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Danbury, CT
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    In nature, bees raise three types of queens, Emergency and Supercedure. As a general, rule many beekeeps avoid using Emergency queens to head up their colonies. But it strikes me that in order to raise queens, we simulate an emergency situation by making the starter colony queenless and there by force the bees to raise Emergency queens. A better option would be to simulate a supercedure situation and raise queens on a queen right hive, like Bro Adam did.

    I also have to concur that bigger isn't necessarily better; I officially step forward as an advocate for tiny little bantam queens.
    Last edited by bluegrass; 08-23-2011 at 08:19 AM.
    Always question Conventional Wisdom.

  18. #78
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    Greensboro, North Carolina
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Nice looking cells Joe. Two observations from that picture: 1) you are using a JZBZ cell bar holder. Do you like it? 2) you don't leave much room below the cells, or is that just for the photo?

  19. #79
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    Jan 2010
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    Gilmer,TX USA
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.

    Quote Originally Posted by Specialkayme View Post
    Nice looking cells Joe. Two observations from that picture: 1) you are using a JZBZ cell bar holder. Do you like it? 2) you don't leave much room below the cells, or is that just for the photo?
    From what it looks like he just set the frame on the top bars....
    I have used one of those bars before...work good! I need to get some !
    mike
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  20. #80
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    Jan 2009
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    Cookeville, TN, USA
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    Default Re: Moving from ok queens . . . to great queens.



    Took this yesterday - grafts from SKC queen - right at 48 hrs old. At this point they are fairly comparable to Josephs, but I bet his end up being 1/4 longer.

    Although on second look, mine look like his poorer ones.

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