Kelley wired wax foundation with ears...bent correctly?...no bowing out to the side?

[Intheswamp]

I'm trying to figure out which foundation to order. I'm looking at wired wax medium foundation. If you have used Kelley wired foundation with ears what has been your experience with it? They state in their item description that the ears are bent correctly and will lay down flat in the frame. I've been cautioned and have read where folks in the past have had trouble getting wired foundation with ears to lay down flat. It's actually been recommended to me locally to buy the foundation "without ears". I'm putting in my first order and don't won't to end up with added problem foundation bowing out on me.

I'm looking at using frames with grooved bottom boards and wedge top boards.

Thanks for the help!
Ed

While I'm asking... For those of you running vertical wired foundation, do you install horizontal wires in your medium frames? Thanks again.

[fish_stix]

We use all crimp wired foundation with no hooks, grooved top and bottom bars. We wire the deep frames because we extract them after they are drawn out. No need to wire the medium frames; with the crimp wires they withstand extractor use just fine unless you have a gorilla touch on the speed control.

[Intheswamp]

Thanks fish stix. Does the foundation with no hooks that you use simply snap into the grooves? Are they rigid enough to stay vertical without needing any nailing or whatever? I'm trying to figure out how it works.

Ed

[Roland]

WE run only deeps, with 4 horizontal wires. We found, with proper pressure on the top wedge when stapling, that Kelley's crimped wire with hooks works the best for us.

Crazy Roland

[StevenG]

For my deeps I've used Kelley crimp wired foundation for a long time. Got a "special" deal on some other foundation, big mistake! Kelley's is great. The wire hooks work fine - just be sure the wedge is nailed down tight, and you cross wire. I've used 4 wires, also 3, and don't see much difference. Don't forget to install the brass eyelets in the end bars, so the wire stays tight. You'd be wise to build or buy the "foundation device for deep and shallow frames." It makes melting in the wire much easier. Don't waste your money on the "Deluxe eyelet insertion tool", never worked for me. Use the one eyelet at a time, and do it while watching football... (did 12,000 that way last year....sigh....occupational therapy, I call it.) And to melt the wire in to the foundation, you can either build or buy the electric embedder and the transformer. I bought them, melting in the wires goes quickly.

Oh, and some folks are tempted to use the support pins as an easier way. Tried that, waste of time and money. Do it right the first time.
Regards,
Steven

[Intheswamp]

Thanks everybody for the comments. First thing, let me correct my newbie self...I should be saying "hooks" instead of "ears"...and you all were kind enough to let that slide.

My mentor (I'm not even sure if he realizes that he is my mentor ) has cautioned against the crimped wire with hooks. In the past he apparently had trouble with them not being bent to 90-degree angles and having trouble getting the foundation to lay flat. I talked with him again this afternoon about it and he said he was moving from crimped wire foundation to plain wax foundation. He stated something to the effect that cleaning up the old combs with the vertical wires was too much trouble. Now I'm wondering what I really need to go with...crimped wire with hooks, no hooks, or plain wax.

It seems the most solid setup is the crimped wire with hooks. If I go with the crimped wire foundation I think I may just go with hooks and ask forgiveness of my mentor...or run into a problem and let him do a "told you so".<grin>

If it makes any difference I'm planning on extracting and saving the comb for the bees to reuse. I'm not sure yet about an extractor, but I'd bet my mentor and me can work something out with using his when the time comes.

I really want to get this order in to Kelleys pretty soon....lock in my place on the truck!!!

Thanks for the feedback. If anybody's got anything else to add by all means PLEASE do!!!
Ed

[clgs]

I've liked the Kelley hooked foundation and I've used the slide in pins instead of wiring. But yes, when you want to clean out the wax from a frame it adds time. I've this year used the new Kelley frame where you just slip the foundation in a slot on the top bar. Super fast to make up, no need to break off the wedge and nail it back on. Still used a wire foundation, but not hooked. Love these new frames.

[Intheswamp]

I've liked the Kelley hooked foundation and I've used the slide in pins instead of wiring. But yes, when you want to clean out the wax from a frame it adds time. I've this year used the new Kelley frame where you just slip the foundation in a slot on the top bar. Super fast to make up, no need to break off the wedge and nail it back on. Still used a wire foundation, but not hooked. Love these new frames.

clgs, do the slotted top bars seem as strong as the solid top bars? These won't sag down in the heat? This is all new to me and I can't understand what holds it up...or is the wax that stiff??? It would certainly be nice to simply dropp the foundation in the slot and put it in the super!

Ed

Ed