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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Gilmer,TX USA
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    1,830

    Default Determining if queens in nucs are purebred

    I made up some nucs on the 16th and added cells on the 18th. I have one nuc that has tons of eggs in it, but when I poped open a capped queen cell (the one I put in the nuc) there was a fully grown queen that looked like she was about to hatch. Was this the original queen from the original cell or something else? How can one determine if the queen that is heading up the nuc is from the cell that you put in or from a egg/larvae in the nuc?

    mike
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  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
    Posts
    26,788

    Default Re: Determining if queens in nucs are purebred

    Mike,
    I would say that if you had a queen cell in a nuc and then before that cell hatched or emerged, that there was already a queen laying in that nuc. No way was there enuf time for the cell to have hatched, gotten mated, layed in the queen cell and grown a mature queen. From the way you described what you have seen.

    When I make splits w/ queen cells, I am mostly concerned whether there is a laying queen doing her job than I am about whether it is the cell I installed or not. Most likely it is, unless when I made the nuc, I accidently took the queen from the original/parent colony.

    I'm not as concerned about genetic as lots of people are. I just want a queen that can do her job. But I do start out w/ cells of known lineage.
    Mark Berninghausen "That which works, persists."

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Gilmer,TX USA
    Posts
    1,830

    Default Re: Determining if queens in nucs are purebred

    Well...here is the deal. I know for a fact that there was not a queen in the nuc as I have all the marked queens from nuc shakers accounted for (unless there was a misterious 2nd queen in the hive, but there would be much more brood in there). So what is going on? There is the same amount of brood in this nuc as the 15 other ones that the cell took. Anybody want to take a shot at this?

    mike
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  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Tucson, Arizona, USA
    Posts
    5,325

    Default Re: Determining if queens in nucs are purebred

    The way I can tell, which is best for me: If the queen in a nuc is from the queen cell I placed in the nuc or, at least, a queen that I want in the nuc.

    My mother queens are homozygous for the Cordovan trait, and they are also Italian. Part of my MQ (Mother Queen) selection process is for most of the female progeny of my MQs to also be homozygous for the Cordovan trait. This has produced, for me, 50% or more of my daughter queens as Cordovan Italian. Though they are then open mated, it is rare for a queen to mother a colony with exceptionally undesirable traits.

    If the daughter queens are homozygous for Cordovan coloration, they are as purebred as I need them to be.
    48 years - 50 hives - TF
    Joseph Clemens -- Website Under Constructioni

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Tucson, Arizona, USA
    Posts
    5,325

    Default Re: Determining if queens in nucs are purebred

    Sometimes virgins return from mating flights and enter the wrong nuc/hive. I've seen it happen several times and I only raise a few dozen queens each season.
    48 years - 50 hives - TF
    Joseph Clemens -- Website Under Constructioni

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Gilmer,TX USA
    Posts
    1,830

    Default Re: Determining if queens in nucs are purebred

    Well...there was a no take next to it...the reason I care so much is that these are the ones that I am selling...and the ones that got nucs shaken from them are not the best of hives....so should we call it a queen that lost her way?

    mike
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  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Tucson, Arizona, USA
    Posts
    5,325

    Default Re: Determining if queens in nucs are purebred

    It certainly sounds like one of those times where a queen found her way home, to the wrong home. At least she was accepted, mated queens rarely kill queen cells, you caught it before the virgin emerged, that could have been bad, the virgin might have killed the mated queen, then that nuc would still be waiting for a mated laying queen.
    48 years - 50 hives - TF
    Joseph Clemens -- Website Under Constructioni

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