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Thread: Swarm lures

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Murfreesboro, TN, USA
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    1,398

    Default Re: Swarm lures

    Talked with IPM today (via email).

    Ask them the difference between bee-scent and their bee lure. Bee-scent is not as concentrated as the bee lure and will not last very long when applied as directed. (See Grant above) The bee lure is pure nasecerov (sp?) comes in 2 oz setup that you just open and put in the trap. Lure is good for the entire season.

    Going to purchase a pint of the scent and 2 lures to test out this spring. Called and no one answered the phone. Tried to fax in my order and
    "this number is not valid or is out of service".
    De Colores,
    Ken

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Jackson, MO
    Posts
    1,858

    Default Re: Swarm lures

    Quote Originally Posted by bk21701 View Post
    After reading the description from the company's website, its explained as a foraging attractant not so much a swarm lure.

    Has anyone gotten a reply from the company as to its use as a swarm lure?
    This is like a lot of products that work for something other than what they are "registered" for, kind of like powdered sugar is not sold for varroa control and any sugar company might freak out if you told them what you are doing.

    This product is not listed nor registered as a swarm lure, but it works as such. I'd be interested to hear what they say, but whatever they say sure won't diminish my results!

    Grant
    Jackson, MO
    Beekeeping With Twenty-five Hives: https://www.createspace.com/4152725

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Murfreesboro, TN, USA
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    Default Re: Swarm lures

    Here is the reply I got back from the company:

    The honey bee lure is the concentrated nasonov pheromone. This is also put in the bee scent in a diluted amount. The bee scent will attract the bees into the crop so I guess it will also work in the swarm trap, or so some bee keepers have told me this week. The bee lure will last a full swarm period and the bee scent once applied in the field lasts 3-5 days. I would guess if left in the conc. as it comes from the bottle it will work in a swarm trap but I have no research to document how long this work compared to the actual honey bee lure.
    Jim
    De Colores,
    Ken

  4. #24
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Whitla Ab. Canada
    Posts
    473

    Default Re: Swarm lures

    Hello Grant:
    Do you seal the zip lock bag and the Bees detect it through the bag or do you leave it open?
    Thanks

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Walters, MN USA
    Posts
    20

    Default Re: Swarm lures

    Quote Originally Posted by Colino View Post
    Do you seal the zip lock bag and the Bees detect it through the bag or do you leave it open?
    I understand "assuming" is dangerous, but here is a situation where believing it is sealed makes sense. For it to last the amount of time described by Grant, the fact that he mentions a zip-lock bag vs. a non-sealing bag, etc... I plan on zipping my version shut.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    KC, MO, USA
    Posts
    1,238

    Default Re: Swarm lures

    MB said they use to use lemon pledge to attract swarms before they change recipe.

    If Grant can still smell it than it's still there, a zip-lock will keep most of it contained and release it slowly just like others are doing it with LGO.

    Grant what percent traps caught swarms for the last few years using bee sent, how many traps do you have out.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Walters, MN USA
    Posts
    20

    Default Re: Swarm lures

    Quote Originally Posted by FlowerPlanter View Post
    ... release it slowly just like others are doing it with LGO...
    Are you saying that others are putting LGO on an absorbent (like a paper towel) and then zipping it closed in a zip-lock bag to extend the effectiveness of LGO?

    Or do you know how people are extending the time the LGO is effective as a lure?

    Thank you.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    sydney,NSW, Australia
    Posts
    11

    Default Re: Swarm lures

    Beeks - if you are into swarm collecting, sign up into the new site www.swarmpatrol.com and lets make it work for us.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    KC, MO, USA
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    1,238

    Default Re: Swarm lures

    >Are you saying that others are putting LGO on an absorbent (like a paper towel) and then zipping it closed in a zip-lock bag to extend the effectiveness of LGO?
    Yes

    >Or do you know how people are extending the time the LGO is effective as a lure?
    LGO evaporates very quickly and I believe the pheromones do too. When you buy swarm lures they come in small plastic containers that slowly release the lure, just like a zip lock.

    Some just dip a q-tip and put it and refresh it every two weeks.

    I have both, some commercial plastic vile with nasonov pheromone and some with LGO in a small snack size zip lock with a small piece paper towel. I break q-tips in half dip it in LGO grab it with a 1" x 1" paper towel and drop it in the zip lock, and never refresh it.

    I have caught the same percentage swarms with the homemade lure as commercial ones that are very expensive. Will not buy more. But I had to try to know for sure.

    The biggest difference I have found is used brood comb even pieces glued in to a frame. And the funny thing is that some swarms did not even use the empty brood comb, they just built on the foundationless frames.

    I think there is a slight increase with the location you pick, find one that stands out even just a little. Like the tree by itself, one at the end of the fence row, a high point on a hill or ridge.

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Location
    Morro Bay, California, USA
    Posts
    960

    Default Re: Swarm lures

    I catch lots of swarms. I find "old comb" is the most effective lure, followed by slum-gum soaked onto burlap.

    LGO is nice-smelling, attracts both scouts and foragers. In most cases, LGO alone won't induce a swarm to colonize a sterile, new box or pot, when a "old" comb alternative exists in the scout range. In a semi-natural woodland, the bees are going colonize the treeholes before entering a recently manufactured box. You need to make the trap resemble an old hive location. You are competing against better real-estate.

    I read recently someone speculated that Wax Moth has a odor, and the bees find that attractive. Don't have data to support that -- as they are induced by the slum-gum -- but there is a definite preference for re-colonizing old colony spots. ((Survivor hives, touted endlessly by the TF guru's, are simply re-colonized nests in a meta-population of swarms and mite-induced extinctions -- at least in my 'neighborhood'). Wax moths are certainly part of the "sterizilation" crew that removes old, diseased comb and prepares a colony site for re-occupation.

    I pull black brood comb (about 4 years of use) and reuse the spent comb as swarm lure. I cut much of it off the frame -- new swarms can build comb at a prodigious rate. Cutting it off generates more flight and cluster space in the trap -- the video's of scouts show them measuring volume, and having open space (in my logical extension) allows them to overestimate the volume offered.

    I stack nucs to generate volume, with only frames in the upper half. The new swarms build from the top, and the lower (open) nuc does not get wild comb between my swarm checks. You can use medium depth frames for the same reason.

    I reserve the Queen Juice (dead queens in alchohol) for settling a split or collected swarm.

  11. #31
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Whitla Ab. Canada
    Posts
    473

    Default Re: Swarm lures

    FlowerPlanter:
    >I think there is a slight increase with the location you pick, find one that stands out even just a little. Like the tree by itself, one at the end of the fence row, a high point on a hill or ridge.<

    Its no problem for me to pick out something that stands out a little. Here on the bald prairie a tree is a tourist attraction. Both of my hives were caught in isolated patches of Caragana (also called Siberian Peashrub) shelter belt with a few trees sprinkled in.

  12. #32
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Whitla Ab. Canada
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    473

    Default Re: Swarm lures

    JW:
    I'm new to this, what is slum-gum? Also how do you tell old honey comb from old brood comb? It all looks the same to me. Thank you.

  13. #33
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Rader, Greene County, Tennessee, USA
    Posts
    6,564

    Default Re: Swarm lures

    This page has an interesting photo of a frame with both "old" and "new" brood comb, along with an explanation of why the different appearance.
    http://www.honeybeesuite.com/tag/cocoons/

    Note that brood comb will accumulate cocoons, but honey comb has no cocoons.


    And from the same site, an explanation of slumgum:
    http://www.honeybeesuite.com/tag/slumgum/
    Graham
    USDA Zone 7A Elevation 1400 ft

  14. #34
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Location
    Whitla Ab. Canada
    Posts
    473

    Default Re: Swarm lures

    Thanks Rader I'm on it you're so kind and your knowledge is greatly appreciated.

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Location
    Denham Springs, LA, USA
    Posts
    1

    Default Re: Swarm lures

    How do you apply it ? A cue tip ? How long does it last in the hive? 2 weeks?
    Thanks, Charlie

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