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  1. #1
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    Default can CCD equiptment be reused?

    Sort of a newbe question.
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  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
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    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
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    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    Not to answer a question w/ a question, but, how do you know it was a case of CCD?

    I have heard that it isn't a good idea.
    Mark Berninghausen "That which works, persists."

  3. #3
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    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    Not sure what happened, need to do some more homework
    but a seems to fit the description:

    Know the Symptoms

    Some early signs of CCD in cases where the colony appears to be actively collapsing:
    There is an insufficient workforce to maintain the brood that is present.
    The workforce seems to be made up of young adult bees.
    The queen is present, appears healthy and is usually still laying eggs.
    The cluster is reluctant to consume food provided by the beekeeper, such as sugar syrup and protein supplements.
    Foraging populations are greatly reduced or non-existent.

    Colonies that have been affected by CCD have the following characteristics:
    The complete absence of adult bees in colonies, (in some cases the queen and a small number of survivor bees are present in the brood nest) with no or little build-up of dead bees in the colonies or at the hive entrances.
    The presence of capped brood.
    The presence of food stores, both honey and bee bread, which is not immediately robbed by other bees. Invasion of common hive pests such as wax moth and small hive beetle is noticeably delayed.
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  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
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    syracuse n.y.
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    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    way back when, if I remember correctly, they did research and did everything including irradiating the hives, put new bees in the hives and they all eventually died. If i suspect that a hive had ccd, I mark the boxes with the year and ccd ie. 8ccd in permanent marker, put nucs in them and keep all the so marked boxes together on hives. So far haven't had any die again with the same symptoms but will have a better idea in the spring.

    take the part about all dying with a grain of salt, I know I read it some where with Hackenberg's bees but can't find where I read it.
    Last edited by wildbranch2007; 02-01-2011 at 06:50 AM. Reason: added hackenbergs line
    mike syracuse ny
    I went to bed mean, and woke up meaner. Marshal Dillon

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Lindsay Ontario
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    47

    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    can CCD equiptment be reused?

    It depends
    Does it matter unless the bees are "clean" and in a new yard?
    Remember the bees can be a reservoir of infection

    In my experience contamination of equipment can be a minor factor
    Most contaminated: brood at time of sealing, -1, +2 days
    less contaminated: dead emergants
    least: empty comb

    You can get empty comb if the ccd abscond happens late in the season,
    but probably not in florida, I am at the other end of the warm-cold continuum

    I suspect strong sunlight, or UV, is a reasonably effective method of sterilization,
    but you won't get it all.

    So southeastflorida maybe you can do me (and the world) a favour:

    Observe the bees left, say on the front of the box, above the entrance
    Are they doing anything unusual? Strange behaviour or movements?
    IF yes, you can confirm by picking the most populous remenent hive,
    set up a ramp as though hiving a swarm, shake 2 frames onto ramp
    After 3/4 of bees have re-entered hive, watch laggards for unusual behavior
    If several do the same thing, well that's a symptom

    My hypothesis: bees with ccd will exhibit "rear leg symptoms"
    Please confirm or deny this hypothesis

    (See archives for rear leg symptoms, here and bee-l)

    thanx
    dave

  6. #6
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    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    No rear leg, except on one slow growth hive, queen.
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  7. #7
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Lindsay Ontario
    Posts
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    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    thanks

    >except on one slow growth hive, queen.
    Q rubbing her abdomin?
    Some hives must have survived, even done well if they are growing.

    > Not sure what happened, need to do some more homework
    > but a seems to fit the description:

    So what % ccd (absconds)?
    % good?

    dave

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2010
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    Fort Lauderdale, FL
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    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    5 out of 20 hives, abscond.
    others 15 seem good, or excellent.
    Trying to forget it and move on,
    really believe this new source of surviver genetics is the answer for me.
    Driving right now, 5 hours, to pickup 2 nucs, and 2 queens, in Oak Hill Fl.
    (will post a pic or video tomorow)
    They are good people, like all I have met in this industry.
    They have been thru it with disease, and survived.

    This yard is doing very good, thanks to jesterbee stock, white cappings high populations, mucho bees comming and going for Spanish Needle now.
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  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    Poplar Bluff, Missouri, USA
    Posts
    2,280

    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    Nice easy chair from which to watch your bees! Doesn't look all that comfortable though.
    I bought some bees from Jester a couple years back - they've done very well.
    Regards,
    Steven
    "If all you have is a hammer, the whole world is a nail." - A.H. Maslow

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Jackson, MO
    Posts
    1,858

    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    I can't really answer your question. I have not seen CCD in any of my hives. Got some bad cases of PPB, however. Results seem to be the same but symptoms and causes vastly different.

    I continue to reuse "gently used" old comb from dead outs with good results. I mix them into swarm traps. I'm also in the process of getting rid of the really black junk adn rotating in new foundation.

    Grant
    Jackson, MO
    Beekeeping With Twenty-five Hives: https://www.createspace.com/4152725

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Lindsay Ontario
    Posts
    47

    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    >5 out of 20 hives, abscond

    With only 25% loss, with the other hives doing well (or at least OK)
    ccd seems a bit unlikely

    Perhaps Q failure? or bad VD control? (varroa destructor)

    With ccd loss is often >50%

    dave

  12. #12
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    May 2010
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    Fort Lauderdale, FL
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    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    Jester Bee was very helpful today, took the time to hand pick the nucs, and queens, this time. THis is a short vid of one of thier outyards, with electric fence for raccon control.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y6xOH6Ve0lA
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  13. #13
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    Dec 2008
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    syracuse n.y.
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    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    Quote Originally Posted by wildbranch2007 View Post
    way back when, if I remember correctly, they did research and did everything including irradiating the hives, put new bees in the hives and they all eventually died.
    take the part about all dying with a grain of salt, I know I read it some where with Hackenberg's bees but can't find where I read it.
    I knew I had read it some where and since i got to check on my hives the last three days and now its snowing aging had time to look around.

    bee-l may 2007 week1
    http://community.lsoft.com/scripts/w...%3BMatches&z=4

    Interesting experiment is in progress in Florida by the USDA-ARS & Dave
    Hackenberg.

    400 hives.
    100 hives in each of four category.

    1. CCD dead-out untreated

    2.CCD dead out brood comb irradiated

    3. CCD dead out honey supers (no brood)

    4.CCD dead out brood boxes fumigated as I posted with acetic acid.

    All hives had new packages put in from same supplier.

    Irradiated & acetic acid doing fine. ( 2 & 4)

    problems in group 1 & 3 I have been told. I am really surprised of the
    trouble in group 3.

    A quote from Dave Hackenberg on the Bee Culture "Catch the Buzz" site

    " His initial observation was that the differences between treated and
    untreated colonies was day & night"

    I at one point remember someone saying that the irradiated hives went a long time buy still eventually failed but can't find that.
    mike syracuse ny
    I went to bed mean, and woke up meaner. Marshal Dillon

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
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    Menomonee Falls, Wis.
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    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    Our person experiments mimicked David Hackenbergs, with the substitution of new equipment for the irradiated and acetic acid groups.I find his results entirely believable. Buy sone new bees, put them in ALL NEW equipment, and see how they respond.

    Roland

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
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    syracuse n.y.
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    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    a post from randy oliver from a question on bee-l about the same subject as here started today. Personally, in California, I restocked unsterilized combs from collapsed
    colonies with no apparent problem.

    However, I am currently running a trial with the surviving colonies from
    last year's trial in which we inoculated colonies with viruses from what
    were reported as CCD hives from the year before, which then collapsed the
    new colonies with CCD-like symptoms. After the trial, I homogenized and
    split up the survivors, and restocked them on the combs from the deadouts,
    with fresh queens. Treated half with fumagillin.

    At last inspection two weeks ago, a number had died, and most of the rest
    were struggling, but look like they may make it. Clearly sick, and not
    wintering nearly as well as other late-season splits. Don't know how much I
    can blame the combs, as the hives all received combs of brood also, which
    could have transmitted an active infection of the viruses and nosema.

    So no easy answer to your question based upon my experience.

    However, my personal feeling is if the bees that I put on deadout combs
    can't make it, tough luck for them, and I will restock until I find bees
    that can! I don't accept wimpyness in my operation.

    Randy Oliver

    http://community.lsoft.com/scripts/w...F=&S=&P=176358
    Last edited by wildbranch2007; 02-20-2011 at 06:17 AM. Reason: had trouble with post
    mike syracuse ny
    I went to bed mean, and woke up meaner. Marshal Dillon

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
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    Menomonee Falls, Wis.
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    Default Re: can CCD equiptment be reused?

    What part about"none of them survived CCD" do people not understand? When you repopulate the hives, NONE will survive. OK, I may be wrong, but less than 1 in 600 will survive. that is NONE in my book. There apears to be many forms of CCD. Those that have had the lesser grade , still talk that survivors can be bred from. Their tune will change when they hit "the real stuff".

    Roland

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