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Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

32K views 57 replies 27 participants last post by  mathesonequip 
#1 ·
Do you have to stop at the scales with an empty 24' flatbed rated under 26K (with air brakes)? What about a load that is obviously under 26K total weight?
 
#2 ·
Yes.

California's "Commercial Vehicle Enforcement Facilities" are commonly called weigh stations or truck scales. These facilities are operated by the California Highway Patrol (CHP), not by Caltrans. However, Caltrans receives many inquiries about weigh stations. This page is designed to answer some of those questions.

California Vehicle Code Section 2813 outlines who must stop at weigh stations and inspection stations:

2813. Every driver of a commercial vehicle shall stop and submit the vehicle to an inspection of the size, weight, equipment, and smoke emissions of the vehicle at any location where members of the California Highway Patrol are conducting tests and inspections of commercial vehicles and when signs are displayed requiring the stop. Every driver who fails or refuses to stop and submit the vehicle to an inspection when signs are displayed requiring that stop is guilty of a misdemeanor.

California Vehicle Code Section 260 defines "commercial vehicle" (bolding and underlining added):

260. (a) A "commercial vehicle" is a motor vehicle of a type required to be registered under this code used or maintained for the transportation of persons for hire, compensation, or profit or designed, used, or maintained primarily for the transportation of property.
 
#3 ·
Thanks - that's what I was afraid of. So my truck is considered commercial even though I use a 'C' license.
If empty, however, I am not transporting any property or making any money so I still wonder if an empty truck can be considered commercial since it doesn't meet those criteria when empty.
Yes - I know - it is supposed to make us all safe $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
 
#4 ·
So my truck is considered commercial even though I use a 'C' license.
Yes.

If empty, however, I am not transporting any property or making any money so I still wonder if an empty truck can be considered commercial since it doesn't meet those criteria when empty.
Yes - I know - it is supposed to make us all safe $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
Why are driving the truck in Ca? Just taking it to the beach for a family vacation?:D

You are still required to stop. Now, can you go by the scale without being stopped, sure. Can they come after you to investigate your situation and cite you for failing to stop at the scale, sure. I did commercial enforcement for the CHP for five years. You meet the definition.

Do you have your company name on the side of your truck?
 
#6 ·
Scale/Inspection station requirements and enforcement vary even within the same state. If it looks like they can get a fine out of you for not stopping, and even a brand new truck has a ticket waiting somewhere, and they are not pre-occupied - take a moment to pull through and they will wave you on.

Florida has not been a good place to bypass stations. I was born and raised here and enforcement is easy revenue. Even a 10,001 pickup is "commercial" in several states now. There are a few pulling 30,000 behind a 1/2 ton pickup, original tires and brakes from 1969 that have never been stopped. The stricter rules are because of those experts. By the way, if you pull a 1 pound trailer behind a truck with a 26000 GVWR you are in for a commercial/overweight violation.

My daughter and son-in-law are cops in Va. They have to stop vehicles to raise revenue to pay their salaries. If there is anything that they can impound the vehicle, they will! Overweight, GVWR, GCVWR, GAWR, tire and wheel load ratings, worn or cut tire, slack adjusters out of range, lights out, modified suspension, even excessive rust! North Carolina has started going after the "recreational" vehicles now too.
 
#7 ·
In Cali even a pickup must stop if it has been converted to a flatbed. The scales often have a sign saying "No Pickups".
 
#9 ·
"Not for Hire" will get you off with the uninformed cops. It means you are hauling your own products. To DOT and state troopers it means you have a business that is hauling your own products engaged in commerce. Beekeepers have an exemption, med card, HOS, vary bay state, CDL is same everywhere
TITLE 49 - TRANSPORTATION

SUBTITLE B - OTHER REGULATIONS RELATING TO TRANSPORTATION

CHAPTER III - FEDERAL MOTOR CARRIER SAFETY ADMINISTRATION, DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION

SUBCHAPTER B - FEDERAL MOTOR CARRIER SAFETY REGULATIONS

PART 391 - QUALIFICATIONS OF DRIVERS AND LONGER COMBINATION VEHICLE (LCV) DRIVER INSTRUCTORS

subpart a - GENERAL

391.2 - General exemptions.

(a) Farm custom operation. The rules in this part do not apply to a driver who drives a commercial motor vehicle controlled and operated by a person engaged in custom-harvesting operations, if the commercial motor vehicle is used to (1) Transport farm machinery, supplies, or both, to or from a farm for custom-harvesting operations on a farm; or (2) Transport custom-harvested crops to storage or market.

(b) Apiarian industries. The rules in this part do not apply to a driver who is operating a commercial motor vehicle controlled and operated by a beekeeper engaged in the seasonal transportation of bees.

(c) Certain farm vehicle drivers. The rules in this part do not apply to a farm vehicle driver except a farm vehicle driver who drives an articulated (combination) commercial motor vehicle, as defined in 390.5.

(For limited exemptions for farm vehicle drivers of articulated commercial motor vehicles, see 391.67.) [36 FR 24219, Dec. 22, 1971, as amended at 37 FR 26112, Dec. 8, 1972; 54 FR 12202, Mar. 24, 1989; 60 FR 38745, July 28, 1995; 61 FR 13346, Mar.

26, 1996; 61 FR 17253, Apr. 19, 1996]
Text
TITLE 49 - TRANSPORTATION

SUBTITLE B - OTHER REGULATIONS RELATING TO TRANSPORTATION

CHAPTER III - FEDERAL MOTOR CARRIER SAFETY ADMINISTRATION, DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION

SUBCHAPTER B - FEDERAL MOTOR CARRIER SAFETY REGULATIONS

PART 391 - QUALIFICATIONS OF DRIVERS AND LONGER COMBINATION VEHICLE (LCV) DRIVER INSTRUCTORS

subpart a - GENERAL

391.2 - General exemptions.

(a) Farm custom operation. The rules in this part do not apply to a driver who drives a commercial motor vehicle controlled and operated by a person engaged in custom-harvesting operations, if the commercial motor vehicle is used to (1) Transport farm machinery, supplies, or both, to or from a farm for custom-harvesting operations on a farm; or (2) Transport custom-harvested crops to storage or market.

(b) Apiarian industries. The rules in this part do not apply to a driver who is operating a commercial motor vehicle controlled and operated by a beekeeper engaged in the seasonal transportation of bees.

(c) Certain farm vehicle drivers. The rules in this part do not apply to a farm vehicle driver except a farm vehicle driver who drives an articulated (combination) commercial motor vehicle, as defined in 390.5.

(For limited exemptions for farm vehicle drivers of articulated commercial motor vehicles, see 391.67.) [36 FR 24219, Dec. 22, 1971, as amended at 37 FR 26112, Dec. 8, 1972; 54 FR 12202, Mar. 24, 1989; 60 FR 38745, July 28, 1995; 61 FR 13346, Mar.

26, 1996; 61 FR 17253, Apr. 19, 1996]
Read more: http://cfr.vlex.com/vid/391-2-general-exemptions-19947537#ixzz1AELDaOSq
 
#18 ·
subpart a - GENERAL

391.2 - General exemptions.

(a) Farm custom operation. The rules in this part do not apply to a driver who drives a commercial motor vehicle controlled and operated by a person engaged in custom-harvesting operations, if the commercial motor vehicle is used to (1) Transport farm machinery, supplies, or both, to or from a farm for custom-harvesting operations on a farm; or (2) Transport custom-harvested crops to storage or market.

(b) Apiarian industries. The rules in this part do not apply to a driver who is operating a commercial motor vehicle controlled and operated by a beekeeper engaged in the seasonal transportation of bees.

(c) Certain farm vehicle drivers. The rules in this part do not apply to a farm vehicle driver except a farm vehicle driver who drives an articulated (combination) commercial motor vehicle, as defined in 390.5.

(For limited exemptions for farm vehicle drivers of articulated commercial motor vehicles, see 391.67.) [36 FR 24219, Dec. 22, 1971, as amended at 37 FR 26112, Dec. 8, 1972; 54 FR 12202, Mar. 24, 1989; 60 FR 38745, July 28, 1995; 61 FR 13346, Mar.
Do the exemptions above mean beekeepers don't need a DOT number? I'm kind of getting ticked off because the whole idea of getting an under 26K truck was to avoid the rectal exams. I am really sick of all the regulations and other people telling me how to live. So now that this truck weighs over 10,001 lbs I need to apply for a DOT number and then get audited for safety? All I want to do is haul bees once a year.
 
#14 ·
No.

I know of several beekeepers that have been stopped or pulled aside for inspection in their one-tons or 450s / 550s and NONE of them has been ticketed for lack of CDL.

I have one friend that was pulled over 3 times in one year. The only thing he had wrong was his breakaway wire had fallen aside. He fixed it on the spot, recieved a warning and was on his way.

I enjoy my annual trip to almonds and none of the negitive hype will change that.

Hope you all have a good trip!
:)
 
#12 ·
HVH - Better check if you need a class "B" license with those air brakes. Make sure those slack adjusters are within specs, and maintain those brakes! I check my brakes every month. I wouldn't want to be in an multicar pile-up with 1.2 million very upset bees. Sounds like a good movie scene in a movie from hell. (Apologies to Henry Winkler, twice!)

The DOT caught my buddy hauling a trailer rated over 10,000 lbs and he had to go to school for a class "A" license, which he had to pass and get the license, or pay a huge fine (he passed). The test is not that difficult if you study, but you need to verbalize every thought during the walk-around inspection. Also need a driver with a current class "A" or "B" license to drive the test vehicle to the DMV for the test.

Also check that your insurance knows what you are doing. If they find that you are doing commercial work and aren't paying commercial truck insurance, guess what? They won't pay for the accident. Make it clear to them if you are a hobbyist or are in business. Inform them if your status changes.
 
#13 ·
So much for "We the people...". Thanks comrades for your help. I could easily go on a rant but it wouldn't change anything. Stopping is not that big of a deal other than it makes me feel like I am in a different country where I must show my papers. And to think - I haven't even been to an airport to experience the new face of America:ws
I really long for the good old days.

Kilocharlie - I was trying to avoid all the commercial red tape. If I get a trailer, I will make sure it is rated under 10K and will definitely keep the brakes in working order.
 
#15 · (Edited)
On any truck over 10,001 lbs and up GVWR you will need a DOT number, or on CA registered trucks a Motor Carrier Permit #. They will ticket you if you dont have one. They wrote me one for my 77 F350 .Because it was 10,000GVWR I was able to get it dismissed.

But like you, I need bigger trucks:) so will have to do it this year. If you aren't hiring drivers, its not that big of a deal and you will not be sucked into all the additional requirements like drug testing,worker comp proof, and the BIT inspection. It does require a certain level of liability insurance.

Air brakes require something besides a regular drivers license in CA. Not sure about what. But if you are legal in Nevada, it should be good here??

Also, the requirement for a CDL is over 26000 lbs and if I remember correctly, over 40 feet. Also there are trailer limits as was pointed out. So 450s and 550s don't need a CDL.

I don't worry about the CHP as much as the morons who will pass your truck on a blind corner.California has a LOT of really bad drivers.
 
#19 ·
#20 ·
And don't forget to keep a log book... They require those you report for your exam. We were told that any truck over 10,000 GVW must keep a log book and stop at the scales. We also have farm plates with and a door magnet with dot # and business name. Cali is very hard up for $$ so they will be looking. And to think we are actually helping make more Californian nuts!
 
#23 ·
Remember the IFTA and IRP regulation

If your 26,000lb rated truck is load and gets stopped at a weigh station if you are over the registered weight you will get fined not only for the over-weight but also ifta and irp will kick in and thats where the fines will tack up.
ifta fines can cost $1,000.
if you haul a trailer that will put your registered weight over 26,000lb get ifta decals and complie. we run farm plates on our trucks and trailers, should have cdl's but the scales are looking at the weights and ifta decals, will generally get you thru.
 
#24 ·
I've got a lot of mixed info on 26k GVW but the DMV showed me in writing that I can load my truck to 26k and still pull a trailer under 10K. I also found a site where an FMCRA rep stated the same. I have almost zero confidence in anything at this point and hope if I make any minor errors that it will be a warning and not a ticket. Everyone appears to have a different opinion on this stuff with tickets to prove they're right. I will get "not for hire" stickers and all the safety stuff, and temp permit, and hope for the best driving the truck back to Nevada from CA. I hate being at the bottom of a learning curve.
 
#28 · (Edited)
I just finished up this whole gig for my truck. It's a f550. 16 ft flatbed
Law: must have us dot # and name on truck
must keep time log for when I'm in the 150 radius keep three months in office last 30 days in truck preferred
When traveling out side 150 k or State to State must keep log book
Must do annual inspection on truck and trailers
Proper insurance and registration
Copy of regestration with proper tire size on that paper(you can hand that over instead of the original.)
And well that's most of it. You need to keep on file service records. Good idea any way

I'm sure I missed stuff but I was pulled over three week ago. Not pretty. But if you look like your trying to abide the just might take it easier on you.

Other good ideas are Dot medical card. Most offices. Charge 50$ it's a quick phyiscal
Exemptions are nice but if your running pirate it will catch up with you.
Quarterly self truck inspection kept in an inspection book in your truck.

Some states are different. The best way to really cross your T's and dot your I's is to apply for a us dot number. After one year you will typically receive an evaluation. This officer knows what's up. If he doesn't, encourage him to look up those exceptions mentioned in earlier post.

Other than that CHIPS are nailing us. It's not the scales that worry me, its the hwy patrol that think they know every law. They will cost you time and money.

This is coming from a Colorado keeper.

Good Luck and if you find major additional laws I missed feel free to pm me.
Chad

Ps. I don't intend to know everything but I'm learning as I go. See you on Cali at the beach.
 
#36 · (Edited by Moderator)
I just finished up this whole gig for my truck. It's a f550. 16 ft flatbed
Law: must have us dot # and name on truck
must keep time log for when I'm in the 150 radius keep three months in office last 30 days in truck preferred
When traveling out side 150 k or State to State must keep log book
Must do annual inspection on truck and trailers
Proper insurance and registration
Copy of regestration with proper tire size on that paper(you can hand that over instead of the original.)
And well that's most of it. You need to keep on file service records. Good idea any way

I'm sure I missed stuff but I was pulled over three week ago. Not pretty. But if you look like your trying to abide the just might take it easier on you.

Other good ideas are Dot medical card. Most offices. Charge 50$ it's a quick phyiscal
Exemptions are nice but if your running pirate it will catch up with you.
Quarterly self truck inspection kept in an inspection book in your truck.
All of the above sounds about right. The med card is a bit of a question. I don't think we need it but that doesn't mean it won't bite. I also think you have to have all the safety cones and other stuff as well.
So I guess everyone that rents a big flatbed from Penske has jumped through all these loops - :rolleyes:
 
#29 ·
Thank you Riverdog! And straight from the 2010 Californication Driver Handbook, page 5, LICENSE CLASSES: Class C License - You may drive any 2-axle vehicle with a Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR) of 26,000 lbs. or less; any 3-axle vehicle weighing 6,000 lbs. or less gross; any housecar 40 feet or less; 3-wheel motorcycle; a vanpool vehicle designed to carry more than 10, but not more than 15 persons including the driver. The driver must have a medical certification on file with the DMV and carry a valid medical card. The driver shall keep in the vanpool vehicle a statement, signed under penalty of perjury, that he/she has not been convicted of reckless driving, drunk driving, or hit-and-run in the last five years.

You may tow: a single vehicle with a GVWR of 10,000 or less including a tow dolly if used.

With a vehicle weighing 4,000 lbs. or more unladen, you may tow: a trailer coach or 5th wheel travel trailer under 10,000 lbs. GVWR when towing is not for compensation; a 5th wheel travel trailer exceeding 10,000 lbs. but under 15,000lbs GVWR, when towing is not for compensation and with endorsement.

A farmer or employee of a farmer may drive any combination of vehicles with a GVWR of 26,000 lbs. or less if used exclusively in agricultural operations and it is not for hire or compensation.

NOTE: Class C licensees may not tow more than one vehicle; a passenger vehicle, regardless of weight, may not tow more than one vehicle; no motor vehicle under 4,000 lbs. unladen weight may tow any vehicle weighing over 6,000 lbs. or more gross. (CVC 21715)

I'll get back to you with class B license info soon.
 
#30 ·
Thanks riverdog and kilocharlie,

I just got back from the DMV. The gal treated me like an idiot because I didn't thoroughly understand IRP, DOT, IFTA, etc. She said I could avoid IRP if I pay at the truck scales at Truckee (I thought otherwise for less than 26K GVWR) instead of upfront splitting between Nevada and California. I guess the DOT and a physical are required but no IFTA.
I tried to figure a way to get a temporary permit to allow me to transport my truck from California back to Reno but she indicated I would have to get some kind of paperwork from California at one of their DMV offices in person. The problem is that I purchased the truck from Penske in Washington and had them drive it to a shop in California to have a lift gate added. Once the truck is fitted with a lift gate I need to go get it and return to Nevada. You would think that Nevada could issue a temporary permit for the trip.
Now I have to fill out an affidavit for farming; registration for DOT; get a physical; and then get VIN inspection and registration. I feel like a bee covered with Varroa. I guess after this mess is over I can look forward to working on taxes for a solid week. Its no wonder our economy is in the toilet. All the time spent filling out useless paperwork could be used toward economic expansion and innovation. :cry:
 
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