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  1. #1
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    Default Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    Do you have to stop at the scales with an empty 24' flatbed rated under 26K (with air brakes)? What about a load that is obviously under 26K total weight?

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    Yes.

    California's "Commercial Vehicle Enforcement Facilities" are commonly called weigh stations or truck scales. These facilities are operated by the California Highway Patrol (CHP), not by Caltrans. However, Caltrans receives many inquiries about weigh stations. This page is designed to answer some of those questions.

    California Vehicle Code Section 2813 outlines who must stop at weigh stations and inspection stations:

    2813. Every driver of a commercial vehicle shall stop and submit the vehicle to an inspection of the size, weight, equipment, and smoke emissions of the vehicle at any location where members of the California Highway Patrol are conducting tests and inspections of commercial vehicles and when signs are displayed requiring the stop. Every driver who fails or refuses to stop and submit the vehicle to an inspection when signs are displayed requiring that stop is guilty of a misdemeanor.

    California Vehicle Code Section 260 defines "commercial vehicle" (bolding and underlining added):

    260. (a) A "commercial vehicle" is a motor vehicle of a type required to be registered under this code used or maintained for the transportation of persons for hire, compensation, or profit or designed, used, or maintained primarily for the transportation of property.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    Thanks - that's what I was afraid of. So my truck is considered commercial even though I use a 'C' license.
    If empty, however, I am not transporting any property or making any money so I still wonder if an empty truck can be considered commercial since it doesn't meet those criteria when empty.
    Yes - I know - it is supposed to make us all safe $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

  4. #4
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    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    Quote Originally Posted by HVH View Post
    So my truck is considered commercial even though I use a 'C' license.
    Yes.

    Quote Originally Posted by HVH View Post
    If empty, however, I am not transporting any property or making any money so I still wonder if an empty truck can be considered commercial since it doesn't meet those criteria when empty.
    Yes - I know - it is supposed to make us all safe $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
    Why are driving the truck in Ca? Just taking it to the beach for a family vacation?

    You are still required to stop. Now, can you go by the scale without being stopped, sure. Can they come after you to investigate your situation and cite you for failing to stop at the scale, sure. I did commercial enforcement for the CHP for five years. You meet the definition.

    Do you have your company name on the side of your truck?

  5. #5
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    Feb 2008
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    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    No company name yet - only Penske
    Maybe I should put a sign on it "Family Vacation Car". "Yes officer - I take my bees on all our vacations".

  6. #6
    Join Date
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    Alachua County, FL, USA
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    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    Scale/Inspection station requirements and enforcement vary even within the same state. If it looks like they can get a fine out of you for not stopping, and even a brand new truck has a ticket waiting somewhere, and they are not pre-occupied - take a moment to pull through and they will wave you on.

    Florida has not been a good place to bypass stations. I was born and raised here and enforcement is easy revenue. Even a 10,001 pickup is "commercial" in several states now. There are a few pulling 30,000 behind a 1/2 ton pickup, original tires and brakes from 1969 that have never been stopped. The stricter rules are because of those experts. By the way, if you pull a 1 pound trailer behind a truck with a 26000 GVWR you are in for a commercial/overweight violation.

    My daughter and son-in-law are cops in Va. They have to stop vehicles to raise revenue to pay their salaries. If there is anything that they can impound the vehicle, they will! Overweight, GVWR, GCVWR, GAWR, tire and wheel load ratings, worn or cut tire, slack adjusters out of range, lights out, modified suspension, even excessive rust! North Carolina has started going after the "recreational" vehicles now too.
    americasbeekeeper.com
    beekeeper@americasbeekeeper.com

  7. #7
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    San Mateo, CA
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    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    In Cali even a pickup must stop if it has been converted to a flatbed. The scales often have a sign saying "No Pickups".

  8. #8
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    Nov 2008
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    Farmington, NM
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    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    AmericasBeekeeper and Odfrank are correct. Now, if you were to put "Not For Hire" on the side of the vehicle, that would be of some help. But, if they prove you are for hire...and that means a whole lot of things, then you will subject to the all regs and will be cited.

  9. #9
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    Alachua County, FL, USA
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    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    "Not for Hire" will get you off with the uninformed cops. It means you are hauling your own products. To DOT and state troopers it means you have a business that is hauling your own products engaged in commerce. Beekeepers have an exemption, med card, HOS, vary bay state, CDL is same everywhere
    TITLE 49 - TRANSPORTATION

    SUBTITLE B - OTHER REGULATIONS RELATING TO TRANSPORTATION

    CHAPTER III - FEDERAL MOTOR CARRIER SAFETY ADMINISTRATION, DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION

    SUBCHAPTER B - FEDERAL MOTOR CARRIER SAFETY REGULATIONS

    PART 391 - QUALIFICATIONS OF DRIVERS AND LONGER COMBINATION VEHICLE (LCV) DRIVER INSTRUCTORS

    subpart a - GENERAL

    391.2 - General exemptions.

    (a) Farm custom operation. The rules in this part do not apply to a driver who drives a commercial motor vehicle controlled and operated by a person engaged in custom-harvesting operations, if the commercial motor vehicle is used to (1) Transport farm machinery, supplies, or both, to or from a farm for custom-harvesting operations on a farm; or (2) Transport custom-harvested crops to storage or market.

    (b) Apiarian industries. The rules in this part do not apply to a driver who is operating a commercial motor vehicle controlled and operated by a beekeeper engaged in the seasonal transportation of bees.

    (c) Certain farm vehicle drivers. The rules in this part do not apply to a farm vehicle driver except a farm vehicle driver who drives an articulated (combination) commercial motor vehicle, as defined in 390.5.

    (For limited exemptions for farm vehicle drivers of articulated commercial motor vehicles, see 391.67.) [36 FR 24219, Dec. 22, 1971, as amended at 37 FR 26112, Dec. 8, 1972; 54 FR 12202, Mar. 24, 1989; 60 FR 38745, July 28, 1995; 61 FR 13346, Mar.

    26, 1996; 61 FR 17253, Apr. 19, 1996]
    Text
    TITLE 49 - TRANSPORTATION

    SUBTITLE B - OTHER REGULATIONS RELATING TO TRANSPORTATION

    CHAPTER III - FEDERAL MOTOR CARRIER SAFETY ADMINISTRATION, DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION

    SUBCHAPTER B - FEDERAL MOTOR CARRIER SAFETY REGULATIONS

    PART 391 - QUALIFICATIONS OF DRIVERS AND LONGER COMBINATION VEHICLE (LCV) DRIVER INSTRUCTORS

    subpart a - GENERAL

    391.2 - General exemptions.

    (a) Farm custom operation. The rules in this part do not apply to a driver who drives a commercial motor vehicle controlled and operated by a person engaged in custom-harvesting operations, if the commercial motor vehicle is used to (1) Transport farm machinery, supplies, or both, to or from a farm for custom-harvesting operations on a farm; or (2) Transport custom-harvested crops to storage or market.

    (b) Apiarian industries. The rules in this part do not apply to a driver who is operating a commercial motor vehicle controlled and operated by a beekeeper engaged in the seasonal transportation of bees.

    (c) Certain farm vehicle drivers. The rules in this part do not apply to a farm vehicle driver except a farm vehicle driver who drives an articulated (combination) commercial motor vehicle, as defined in 390.5.

    (For limited exemptions for farm vehicle drivers of articulated commercial motor vehicles, see 391.67.) [36 FR 24219, Dec. 22, 1971, as amended at 37 FR 26112, Dec. 8, 1972; 54 FR 12202, Mar. 24, 1989; 60 FR 38745, July 28, 1995; 61 FR 13346, Mar.

    26, 1996; 61 FR 17253, Apr. 19, 1996]
    Read more: http://cfr.vlex.com/vid/391-2-genera...#ixzz1AELDaOSq
    americasbeekeeper.com
    beekeeper@americasbeekeeper.com

  10. #10
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    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    Are you scared yet

  11. #11
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    Jul 2000
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    NE Calif.
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    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    You should be scared ,This is CALIFORNIA.

    Just stop at the scales and don't worry. Likely when they see all the bees they will be happy to wave you on through.If not, well all the CHP I have dealt with were very professional (as they wrote me fix it tickets).

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Ojai, California
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    1,014

    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    HVH - Better check if you need a class "B" license with those air brakes. Make sure those slack adjusters are within specs, and maintain those brakes! I check my brakes every month. I wouldn't want to be in an multicar pile-up with 1.2 million very upset bees. Sounds like a good movie scene in a movie from hell. (Apologies to Henry Winkler, twice!)

    The DOT caught my buddy hauling a trailer rated over 10,000 lbs and he had to go to school for a class "A" license, which he had to pass and get the license, or pay a huge fine (he passed). The test is not that difficult if you study, but you need to verbalize every thought during the walk-around inspection. Also need a driver with a current class "A" or "B" license to drive the test vehicle to the DMV for the test.

    Also check that your insurance knows what you are doing. If they find that you are doing commercial work and aren't paying commercial truck insurance, guess what? They won't pay for the accident. Make it clear to them if you are a hobbyist or are in business. Inform them if your status changes.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Reno, NV USA
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    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    So much for "We the people...". Thanks comrades for your help. I could easily go on a rant but it wouldn't change anything. Stopping is not that big of a deal other than it makes me feel like I am in a different country where I must show my papers. And to think - I haven't even been to an airport to experience the new face of Americas
    I really long for the good old days.

    Kilocharlie - I was trying to avoid all the commercial red tape. If I get a trailer, I will make sure it is rated under 10K and will definitely keep the brakes in working order.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    Salem, Oregon
    Posts
    984

    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    Quote Originally Posted by bhfury View Post
    Are you scared yet
    No.

    I know of several beekeepers that have been stopped or pulled aside for inspection in their one-tons or 450s / 550s and NONE of them has been ticketed for lack of CDL.

    I have one friend that was pulled over 3 times in one year. The only thing he had wrong was his breakaway wire had fallen aside. He fixed it on the spot, recieved a warning and was on his way.

    I enjoy my annual trip to almonds and none of the negitive hype will change that.

    Hope you all have a good trip!
    I have exactly ONE hive more than you.
    That makes my opinion beyond question.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jul 2000
    Location
    NE Calif.
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    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    On any truck over 10,001 lbs and up GVWR you will need a DOT number, or on CA registered trucks a Motor Carrier Permit #. They will ticket you if you dont have one. They wrote me one for my 77 F350 .Because it was 10,000GVWR I was able to get it dismissed.

    But like you, I need bigger trucks so will have to do it this year. If you aren't hiring drivers, its not that big of a deal and you will not be sucked into all the additional requirements like drug testing,worker comp proof, and the BIT inspection. It does require a certain level of liability insurance.

    Air brakes require something besides a regular drivers license in CA. Not sure about what. But if you are legal in Nevada, it should be good here??

    Also, the requirement for a CDL is over 26000 lbs and if I remember correctly, over 40 feet. Also there are trailer limits as was pointed out. So 450s and 550s don't need a CDL.

    I don't worry about the CHP as much as the morons who will pass your truck on a blind corner.California has a LOT of really bad drivers.
    Last edited by loggermike; 01-24-2011 at 07:43 AM.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Location
    Farmington, NM
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    736

    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    If you have any questions about licensing, size/weight, special permits, commercial vehicle requirements. You can call the CHP's Commercial Vehicle Unit in Sacramento. They will answer all your questions. This is a public phone number (916) 445-1865.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
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    Shoshone County, Idaho
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    567

    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    Isn't Caly its own Country???

    Must be, because my lawnmower states that it can't be used in CA but it can be used legally in the rest of the states!

    s

  18. #18
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    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    Quote Originally Posted by AmericasBeekeeper View Post
    subpart a - GENERAL

    391.2 - General exemptions.

    (a) Farm custom operation. The rules in this part do not apply to a driver who drives a commercial motor vehicle controlled and operated by a person engaged in custom-harvesting operations, if the commercial motor vehicle is used to (1) Transport farm machinery, supplies, or both, to or from a farm for custom-harvesting operations on a farm; or (2) Transport custom-harvested crops to storage or market.

    (b) Apiarian industries. The rules in this part do not apply to a driver who is operating a commercial motor vehicle controlled and operated by a beekeeper engaged in the seasonal transportation of bees.

    (c) Certain farm vehicle drivers. The rules in this part do not apply to a farm vehicle driver except a farm vehicle driver who drives an articulated (combination) commercial motor vehicle, as defined in 390.5.

    (For limited exemptions for farm vehicle drivers of articulated commercial motor vehicles, see 391.67.) [36 FR 24219, Dec. 22, 1971, as amended at 37 FR 26112, Dec. 8, 1972; 54 FR 12202, Mar. 24, 1989; 60 FR 38745, July 28, 1995; 61 FR 13346, Mar.
    Do the exemptions above mean beekeepers don't need a DOT number? I'm kind of getting ticked off because the whole idea of getting an under 26K truck was to avoid the rectal exams. I am really sick of all the regulations and other people telling me how to live. So now that this truck weighs over 10,001 lbs I need to apply for a DOT number and then get audited for safety? All I want to do is haul bees once a year.

  19. #19
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    Apr 2005
    Location
    Salem, Oregon
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    984

    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    >>> Do the exemptions above mean beekeepers don't need a DOT number? <<<

    The exemtions are from the standard that that they apply to ONLY. 391

    391 is "Driver Qualifications" ie; medical card, drug test, etc........

    It does not mean you can drive on bald tires, drink and drive, speed, .....

    We still have to go by the rules.

    Sec 391:

    http://www.fmcsa.dot.gov/rules-regul...px?menukey=391
    I have exactly ONE hive more than you.
    That makes my opinion beyond question.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Southern Oregon
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    1,165

    Default Re: Truck Scales - under 26K GVWR

    And don't forget to keep a log book... They require those you report for your exam. We were told that any truck over 10,000 GVW must keep a log book and stop at the scales. We also have farm plates with and a door magnet with dot # and business name. Cali is very hard up for $$ so they will be looking. And to think we are actually helping make more Californian nuts!
    John B Jacob www.oldsolbees.com

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