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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
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    McGraw,NY,USA
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    582

    Default Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    I have made creamed honey using the dyce method, also used flavorings in the same method. Today I took some crystalized aster honey and put it thru my grinder once. It turned out a very light color ( absorbed air) and a creamy mixture . I added a couple of drops of yellow food coloring and one drop of apricot flavoring from lorann,and run it thru the grinder again . The result is a yellow creamy tasting apricot flavor that might not recrystaize as hard as regular creamed honey. Has anyone else done a simular process ?
    Thanks Rick
    Turn stumbling blocks into stepping stones

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Oregon City, Oregon
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    985

    Default Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    It sounds good, what type of grinder do you use and what sort of quantity are you doing
    Honeydew

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
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    McGraw,NY,USA
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    582

    Default Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    I used a new electric meat grinder that I recently bought at walmart. I only did one pound
    today to see what it would look and taste like. My brother in law told me once that he used to grind it to make the crystals finer. Tomorrow afternoon I will grind some of my rasberry creamed honey that I made earlier but it gets hard to spread on toast....Rick
    Turn stumbling blocks into stepping stones

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Reno, NV USA
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    2,310

    Default Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    I don't think a meat grinder will grind the honey into smaller crystals. The holes that the meat are extruded through determine size. Remember that the crystals need to be smaller than 50 microns if you want a creamy mouth feel. I've looked all over the place to find literature describing the grinding process but have found it to be proprietary. There is a mention of using a meat grinder in some descriptions, but if you look closely, it is only used to break the creamed honey up to facilitate mixing.
    Someone on this forum uses a manual flour mill and claims it works.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Findlay, Ohio
    Posts
    324

    Smile Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    I ask one of the chemistry instructors how to power crystallized honey and why. His response was forget it. The time and expense is getting clean dry crystals like table sugar or salt. You will need the apparatus to completely dehydrate the crystallized honey. It is much easier to buy a pound of creamed honey you like and use it for the seed crystals. You only need to buy it once, just hold back a jar for the next batch. At a 9 or 10:1 ratio a pint goes a long way

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Camas, WA
    Posts
    1,861

    Default Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    Rick, how long did it take for that Raspberry creamed honey to set up? Crystal size (and hardness) is related to the speed of setup. My goal is to have it set up in two weeks so that I can set a jar on it's side and not see any movement for a couple of minutes.

    It needs good seed, mixing at 65-72 degrees (both seed and honey) and setting at 57 degrees until it sets up. Also I always use at least 10% seed honey. I don't look at it like I am wasting it because I get it right back in a couple of weeks.

    I make my first batch of 10 lbs using 1-1.5lbs of seed. Then in two weeks I make 110 lbs using 100lbs of liquid honey and 10 lbs of seed. It is never really hard. More like creamy peanut butter, but it depends on the temperature that you use it at.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    McGraw,NY,USA
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    582

    Default Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    bdt ....That could be the problem with my process. The temp that I mix the seed and pasturized honey. I make much smaller batches usually 10-13 pounds at a time. I use a presto pot to heat 10-11 pounds to 160 degrees and shut it off and wait for the temp to get down to 100 degrees before mixing rasberry and seed. Always more than 10 percent seed. Note the seed I used is from the same pail of aster honey. At about 10 days the creamed honey looks and spreads very well but continues to harden as much as the original pail " cement" . I cool mine in the cellar where it is usually in the 50`s .
    The temp at which I add the flavor and seed may have the effect to make it harder. Do you heat yours to 160 ? I have recently read on here ( another thread ) that possible 140 degrees will do the same for pasturizing the honey.
    My experiment was to take crystalized honey and grind it and add what ever flavor . The one pound that I did is still very spreadable....I will try your recomendations and let ya know how it works....Thanks Rick
    Turn stumbling blocks into stepping stones

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Dexter, Maine
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    1,053

    Default Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    Why do you feel the need to pasteurize?

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Camas, WA
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    1,861

    Default Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    The reason to pasteurize is that the moisture content gets above 18.5% as the crystals form. Yeasts in the mixture can start fermentation. Heating also removes existing large crystals in the liquid honey.

    When I started making just a few pounds of liquid honey I would not heat, but now that I am making 100lb plus, I don't want to risk it. I heat on medium heat until it gets to 140 (constantly stirring - which will get your arms strong). When it hits 140 I turn off the heat and let it sit for 15 minutes. Then put the container in the freezer or refrigerator.

    When it is pretty cool I remove and let it sit in a cool room to get into the upper 60's before mixing. 100 degrees is way too hot to add your seed. You will dissolve your fine crystals in your seed.

    I mostly heat to remove crystallization because I don't make my creamed honey until October-November and I extract in July-August so there is some crystallization already starting. The reason that I wait until October-November is that 57 degrees is our average temperature around here. So I can put the containers of creamed honey out on the porch, unheated garage or unheated basement room depending on what our temps have been. I can always find 57 degrees. I look for a forecast with the highs in the low 60's.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
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    McGraw,NY,USA
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    582

    Default Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    Thank You BDT ....I am going to make another batch this evening....Rick
    Turn stumbling blocks into stepping stones

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
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    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
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    Default Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    I grind it in a flour grinder that is made to make fine flour. That works fine.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  12. #12
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    Aug 2001
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    McGraw,NY,USA
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    Default Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    Micheal ...Does the flour grinder add air to the creamed honey ? The honey I did had air in it but settles out once in cups. It doesnt look like the same honey when I used the other method. ...Rick
    Turn stumbling blocks into stepping stones

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
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    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
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    Default Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    Yes, it gets some air in it. Yes, anything you do to creamed honey changes the outcome and the consistency. Even if you just stir it up after you get it set. But it makes it smooth.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Fergus, Montana, USA
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    12

    Default Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Bush View Post
    I grind it in a flour grinder that is made to make fine flour. That works fine.
    What kind of flour grinder? I would think that it would plug up the wife's stone grinder, so what kind do you use and how do you dry it so that it doesn't stick to everything as you're trying to grind it? BTW, I'm not a honey expert, just a person that wants to get answers to questions that occur to me when I'm reading these comments and statements

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
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    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
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    Default Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    I have misplaced it as I'm moving right now, but it was NOT a stone grinder, it was steel. I don't remember the brand name.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  16. #16
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Palm Harbor, Fl USA
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    459

    Default Re: Creamed/Ground Honey ?

    When we first started I took some course crystalized honey between two spoons to grind the crystals fine. I put this in a babyfood jar to crystalize it, then did a pound, then did a gallon, etc. Once you get your seed your set. The temp control and temp that you add the seed to the honey makes an impact on the final product.
    My wife says I have ADD, but, hey look- a chicken!

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