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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Alexandria, VA
    Posts
    371

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    I overwintered 4 nucs from Fall-started queens. Two were 10-framers in double-stacked 5-frame medium boxes, and did the best (biggest population now). One was 8 frames in a medium super, and the queen has filled 6 of the frames with brood. One was a Kenya-nuc where the top was the size of a 5-frame nuc, so probably about 3/4 the size of a 5-frame medium nuc. All are doing fantastic and packing on the pollen. I'm putting on supers for them now to expand their laying. Oh... and I fed as long as it was warm (about mid November) and didn't put any candy or sugar on after that. Also, they're no-treatment Russian-mutts, so they didn't eat everything they had in the first month.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Manitoba, Canada
    Posts
    397

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    The massive feeding we had to do last fall paid off. Now some are still so full of capped stores it might impede the queen from laying
    There's the key: Pound them full of feed. Mine are wintered indoors as singles, but they don't get feed or fly for 5 and a half months and massive feeding is the key.

    It's easier to pull a couple of frames in spring to give the queen room than to clean up a starved hive.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    St. Albans, Vermont
    Posts
    5,120

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    Quote Originally Posted by pine_ridge_farms View Post
    Thanks for giving us a follow-up. I had a lot of success overwintering nucs per Palmer's directions. Think if he had just kept his success to himself and not shared with the rest of us? Thanks to Mr. Palmer and all the others sharing valuable information!!!
    And Thank you. Thank you for trying a management scheme that seems a bit far fetched until you actually do it. Easy, isn't it. You set it up and the bees do the work. Nice having your own bees. Nice not having to buy packages, eh? Can anything in beekeeping be more fun than raising your own?

    So thanks for trying something new. I applaud your success. Well done!

    Now I have something to ask of you. Carry the enthusiasm you have and the success you have found to the rest of the members of your local and state associations. There's no reason why all beekeepers can't raise and winter a few nucs for their own use. There's no reason why beginners can't be provided with good healthy nucleus colonies in the spring, and not be stuck on the package treadmill.

    Again, thanks and well done.
    Mike

  4. #24
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Indianapolis, Indiana, USA
    Posts
    306

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Palmer View Post
    Carry the enthusiasm you have and the success you have found to the rest of the members of your local and state associations. There's no reason why all beekeepers can't raise and winter a few nucs for their own use. There's no reason why beginners can't be provided with good healthy nucleus colonies in the spring, and not be stuck on the package treadmill.
    I did just that this weekend. Since I didn't need my own overwintered nucs I was able to sell them to a new beekeeper. She was thrilled to get her nucs in March instead of May. By chance she stopped by last weekend when I made more nuc boxes based on D_Coates' design (thank you D_Coates, they were really easy to make). She was every interested and I had a chance to explain the whole overwintering process to her. I am sure she will eventually look into creating her own nucs as well, I was that convincing and excited!!! lol So far I have talked two others into trying it this year.

    Mike, thanks a million man for sharing your method with all of us. I am looking forward to meeting you one day and thanking you in person.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Posts
    723

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Palmer View Post
    Now I have something to ask of you. Carry the enthusiasm you have and the success you have found to the rest of the members of your local and state associations.

    There's no reason why all beekeepers can't raise and winter a few nucs for their own use. There's no reason why beginners can't be provided with good healthy nucleus colonies in the spring, and not be stuck on the package treadmill.
    And there is no reason this second part can't be done as well. I encourage you to try it. It will take several years to build momentum. There will be some real bumps in the road, setbacks along with the victories- a LOT of hand holding (as MP has done so graciously for many of us).. compromises using Spring made nucs with commercial queens in nucs as a start, and as back up plan B,C and sometimes D, but eventually and with reasonable expectations, folks will start to understand overwintered nucs. You will see a change of practices and a change in expectations in what club members want start to occur and take off. Build it and they will come.
    karla

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Jacksonville, Florida
    Posts
    1,486

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    I agree with Mr. Palmer. I have enjoyed making my own bees even more so than making honey. I overwintered 4 nucs and have been very impressed with them this spring.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    East Windsor, CT
    Posts
    277

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    I see many people saying that they are using Mike Palmer's method of overwintering in singles but where would this information be found? Was there an article or book that he may have wrote? Does Mike Palmer or Kirk Webster have any books published?

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Millbury, MA, USA
    Posts
    1,659

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep


  9. #29
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Nelson, South Island, New Zealand
    Posts
    501

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    It's not really a "Mike Palmer" method as in he didn't invent it.
    Over wintering in singles and over wintering nucs is a common practice all over the world as far as I'm aware.

    we have over wintered nucs for over 40 years even our queen mating nucs that have only 4 small frames are over wintered.
    Like someone said before the key is to winter them heavy.

    Over wintering in a single box means you dont get mice problems, you dont get starvation if there's still honey in the frames and you dont get critters setting up camp in the empty bottom box on a double deep.



    frazz

  10. #30
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Bloomington In
    Posts
    797

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    For what it worth now after winter is over. I'm just south of you I have over wintered in one deep with out any problem.

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    St. Albans, Vermont
    Posts
    5,120

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    Quote Originally Posted by frazzledfozzle View Post
    It's not really a "Mike Palmer" method as in he didn't invent it.
    frazz
    I agree, as I'm only the messenger. Wintering nucleus colonies is something new to most beekeepers in North America, probably because of the abundance of packaged bees and queens over the decades. As the package bee industry struggles to restore the quality of their product, beekeepers raising their own replacement bees are beginning to fill in the gaps. As more beekeepers figure out how to grow their own bees in their own apiaries, the industry can only benefit. That's the most important thing, not what tag someone hangs on the method.

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    East Windsor, CT
    Posts
    277

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    Hi Mike, is there a list of your articles you have written that I could find online? I have enjoyed the works you have written so far. Thanks!

  13. #33
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Coatesville, Pa, USA
    Posts
    797

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    Quote Originally Posted by Allen Martens View Post
    There's the key: Pound them full of feed.
    It's easier to pull a couple of frames in spring to give the queen room than to clean up a starved hive.
    I totally understand this logic, however it doesn't seem to be working for me. I've been giving my nucs about a gallon per week, they're taking it and there's not much that they're putting in the frames. The queens are laying up a storm and just looking last night they've only put some in the corners of the frames. There's about 6 deep frames drawn in a 10 frame deep. How / when do they start stockpiling in in the frames and is there something I'm doing wrong? I've been using 1-1 w/ HBH. I've been seeing them 2x per week to fill their feeders up. Last time I was there they hadn't even taken all of it. Should I not be using HBH? (I had some sugar go bad earlier w/o HBH)

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Millbury, MA, USA
    Posts
    1,659

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    You have another 2 months for them to put up stores. They are starting to raise the winter bees now, so the laying is good. They will slow down pretty soon and then you can pound the feed to them...

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Seneca, sc
    Posts
    832

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    I have wintered hives in one deep, fed 2-1 as long as I could in an empty super on top. November 1st in my area is about as late as I will feed 2-1, because of the moisture. After that I remove the empty and feed a patty that is made up using dry sugar, soy flour, brewer's yeast, and my honey. I have adapted and built inner covers that have a rim to give the patty room to set on the frames. Do not put this deep side down untill the bees have quit drawing comb. I use two inches of foam insulation on top of the inner cover. Honey will cause the patty to stay soft and the bees will eat it all winter. I place it on wax paper directly on top of the frames and the brood. We will have temps in winter that will drop in the low teens but we will also have a day or two out of ten that will get above 50 degrees. I will go in these hives to check the patty anytime the temps are above 50 and the wind is not blowing. I have included pics of the cover and a hive wintered in a single that was taken in early Jan. Good luck. Ventilation is the key to wintering bees, especially bees that are being fed as they will generate more heat. The heat is what keeps them alive and it is also what kills them without ventilation.

    http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h1...s/100_1504.jpg

    http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h1...s/100_1506.jpg

    http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h1...s/100_1528.jpg

  16. #36
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    moravia,ny
    Posts
    1,165

    Default Re: Overwintering in one deep

    I probably would push them together . stacking would not be good as if you get the usual winter break you need to do a quick inspection for food. getting enough honey into them is the biggest concern. good luck

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