Results 1 to 10 of 10

Hybrid View

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Saint-Denis de La Réunion (France Indian Ocean)
    Posts
    41

    Default Frame Spacing in Warre (or TBH)

    I noticed on this forum that the spacing between the frames/bars is quite variable in topbar hives, tbh, warré..., from 1.25 inch or 3.175 cm wide for brood bars and 1.5 inches (3.81 cm) or more (5cm) for honey frames

    Some Warre-ists install 7 frames (4.85 cm ; 1"9) for honey and 8 (3.75 cm ; 1"47) (for the brood ?) could be thought to nine frames for the cluster (3.33 cm ; 1"31) or even 10 according to TBH-ists dimensions
    I saw the same, with the additional variation of the building (hot / cold), on the Voirnot 4X4 beehive

    In short, is there a real advantage to choose different gauges other then standard trade racks? closer for the brood or queen rearing? or even prevention of swarming? or conversely ?
    and there would be an advantage or a disadvantage to cross the frames example building on 8 or 9 (hot) and cross a 7 frame super?

    tropically yours

  2. #2

    Default Re: Frame Spacing in Warre (or TBH)

    one thing I have noticed about beekeepers is that most of us, to some extent, are incorrigible experimentalists.

    Warre himself was an experimentalist having tried and used over 300 hives in his own time before creating his "peoples hive"

    I build every one of my warre boxes to fit exactly 8 bars with 3/8" bee space separating them. no variations.

    but, I can see the interest in experimenting with 7 bars to get them to draw out the honey bars wider.

    Big Bear
    No, I am NOT a bee "Keeper". Anything I post is just my opinion. Take it easy and think for yourself.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Frame Spacing in Warre (or TBH)

    The same spacing variations exist in framed hives. Voirnot recommended different spacing than Hoffman (which is the current standard North American frame-space) which is different from Manley (common in UK) which is different from...

    They all fit within the 32-38mm span (center-to-center), though, so it's probably okay to settle anywhere in that range that your whimsy takes you.
    The World Beehive Project - I build one of every popular beehive in the world!

  4. #4

    Default Re: Frame Spacing in Warre (or TBH)

    In fact, most TBH's are run a bit different than those measurements, because the hive is designed for the convenience of the beekeeper,
    now, don't take this personal, but, I am going to disagree with you on this.

    A tbh is designed to allow the bees more control of the comb and cells. The tbh is designed to give the bees a 'next best thing' experience to being in a log or tree limb or even porch roof, some type of horizontal location, etc...

    The only "convenience" a tbh offers the beekeeper is that the beekeeper doesn't have to lift heavy boxes.

    the removable frames and box management style of the lang is where the beek conveniences are and Mr Langstroth has acknowledged that much in his writings.

    the bees determine the comb width and cell sizes in a top bar system pretty much as they would in a feral hive seeing as the top bars form a solid ceiling over them. we beekeepers try to manipulate the combs being drawn straight with the top bars by using comb guides underneath the top bars.

    In some ways, top bar beekeepers experience less convenience in terms of management as tbh's require more attention in watching for cross comb and preventing the hive becoming honey bound.

    Warre hives with consistent spacing measurements will allow the bees to determine how wide to make comb as they build each comb, as you said, to accommodate for cell sizes and purpose. Some combs will be wider and expand perhaps beyond the width of the bar. Others may be not as wide as the top bar, all in the same box.

    just my 2 cent.

    Big Bear
    No, I am NOT a bee "Keeper". Anything I post is just my opinion. Take it easy and think for yourself.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Santa Clara, CA
    Posts
    38

    Default Re: Frame Spacing in Warre (or TBH)

    my current 10 frame hive came with 9 frames in the brood nest (which i am trying to remedy), but what are the problems that this sort of spacing causes in there?

    Sorry to hijack the thread :)

    -tmk

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Santa Clara, CA
    Posts
    38

    Default Re: Frame Spacing in Warre (or TBH)

    sorry, forgot this was the TBH area. It's a standard 10-frame lang setup. I noticed 3 weeks after i got it (bought as a complete hive) that the full-deep hive body only had 9 frames in it.

    doh.

    The frames were more or less spaced evenly given the available space. I have since pushed them together as much as possible, leaving the extra space at the outside. There was enough burr comb and bulging honey cells to make it so some of the frames did not go all the way together.

    -tmk

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  
Ads