Betterbee

[sqkcrk]

I wonder if any of this is getting back to Jason at Betterbee, Inc. You'd have to think yes, I guess. I'd love to see him join us and do some explaining and make some promises. I'm all for second chances.

[dronebeeman613]

i too have had problems with betterbee and will not order from them no more they lost my order, i got it about 6 1/2 weeks later , 4 sundance 2 pollen trap and other things total order was$1,200.00 when i did get my order there was no paper work telling me how to use the pollen traps , any more i place my orders with westernbee or mannlake i have had really good luck with them and Rick at westernbee really went out of his way as i drove over there and just showed up at there place and placed an order of about $1,500.00 he went out of his way and rounded up my order and got me back on the road to oregon within 1 hour so this is where i shop no more betterbee

[Aram]

... you can't really evaluate a company until there's a problem. Deal fairly and efficiently with the problem, I'm a customer for life, treat me like an annoyance and I'll never be back.

Fully agree! I have not had a problem with them the first time ordering supplies but, boy, did they blow it the last time I dealt with them! And I mean the last time. Ever!
I purchased three packages from them for a customer. My customer backed out so I had the bees installed in hives in an isolated yard. One package absconded right away. The two remaining ones failed to SHB. I had never seen SHB before so I only recognized the problem too late. I contacted BetterBee to ask them to contact their supplier and let them know the bees had carried SHB. I was not asking for a refund, or store credit, I was not even blaming anyone, I was just giving feedback, trying to improve everyone's experience. The response I received was accusatory, defensive, arrogant, and alarmingly ignorant. They had no clue, were trying to teach me that absconding is called swarming by beekeepers. Whaaat!!!!
Aaaaaarrrrgggghh!
They issue a Certificate of Health for the bees they sell. Not as a guarantee that the bees are healthy but they use it a proof of health. Aaaaarrrrgh!!!
Never again!

[Aram]

I found their response letter (I added the bold and red emphasis on the things that bothered me the most):

Dear Aram,

I assure you the apiaries we use is very repeatable[sic]. No supplier or apiaries
can control what happens to your bees once you take them and hive them.
Continued health is the beekeepers responsibility. The packages you
purchases from us were medicated and you were provided a certificate of
health

The fact that your hives became so infested with small hive beetles is not
connected to the supplier. Unfortunately as you stated you didn't recognize
the pest or the problem and failed to take any appropriate action, do not
feel alone as small hive beetles move north many seasoned beekeepers are
just learning to recognize the pest. Small hive beetles are not as big of a
problem in the north as they are in the south because the larva is born and
lives in the ground. They tend to die off in larger numbers in the northern
winter than they do in the southern winter. I recommend the use of the small
hive beetle trap in your hives during the summer. They are very effective
and easy to use.

As for your bees absconding, which in beekeeping is referred to as swarming,
is also typically caused by the beekeeper. Again, this activity has nothing
to do with the supplier or apiary. Bees understand the idea of supply and
demand. When a hive feels that the room they have to live in is two small
they divide into two colonies and one moves out and finds a new home. This
is how bees survive and spread through out the country naturally. It is our
responsibility as beekeepers, who are trying to make the bees do what we
want not what they want, to manipulate their space by adding additional
levels on the hive. If a beekeeper fails to do this in time(as many do) the
bees will swarm if they feel crowded. I recommend the 75% rule. When a hive
body or super is 75% full(of honey, pollen or brood) it is time to add an
empty hive body or super to the hive. We like to use the frames with comb
drawn out from a previous year if possible to provide the bees with a head
start to producing honey.

Another job the beekeeper is responsible for is cutting out all queen cells
from the hive. This prevents the bees from producing a new queen once the
old queen has left, so it also helps prevent the hive from swarming.

We recommend that a beekeeper check the health and productivity of his hive
once a week. It is important for you to be cleaning out any burr comb or
queen cells as they appear as well as checking for diseases, mites, hive
beetles, wax moths and even mice.

I am sorry to hear that you had this trouble with your hives this year, good
luck with them through the winter.

Best Regards,

Meghan

Customer Service Department
Betterbee, Inc.
8 Meader Road
Greenwich, NY 12834
Toll Free: 1-800-632-3379
24 Hour Fax: 518-692-9802

[sqkcrk]

Customer Service Department? I don't see any customer service going on here. Instead of telling you what you did wrong, they should have explained, if that at all, how they handle the purchasing of nucs.

Were I running Betterbee, and this is easy to say since I'm not, I would have handled things much differently. I would have asked for more clarification after issuing an apology or sympathy for things not going as well as they should have and saying that this would be taken up w/ the package producer.

Aram, were these packages, like 3 lb packages or were they nucs? I know you said packages. I just wanted to know that we are talking about the same things. I know the guy who produces the nucs for Betterbee. But not who produces the packages.

How long between installation and absconding and installation and death by SHB? Thanks.

[Aram]

Sqkcrk, no sympathy needed, I've been farming most of my life and I know we are at the mercy of nature. You can't win all the time. I was not blaming anyone so no apology needed either. All I asked is who their supplier was or that they contact the package supplier to let them know the bees possibly carried SHB. I received the 3 lb. packages late June, after being postponed a couple of times (again: nature, not anybody's fault.) One absconded within a couple of days, as soon as the queen was released I suppose. I found them trying to set home under some green house frames, and I hived them in a different location. That one hive exploded over the summer, survived the winter and produced three nucs this spring so, I'm really happy with the genetics (whoever the supplier is.) The other two hives remained on location and failed in September of the year. I should have seen signs earlier but had never seen SHB before so, tough lesson. Yyyyuuuuuck!
None of this relates to the issues I have with betterBee. What upset me is:
1) Their refusal to pass on my feedback to their "repeatable" supplier.
2) The ignorance: Absconding = swarming?!?!? Cutting out qcells to prevent swarming... after the hive swarmed...?!??! Whaaaat?
I might not agree with their recommended hive management: once a week inspections, cutting of q cells, etc., but absconding is not swarming. Would I have been a beginner I'd be now convinced it is so because betterbee said so. I buy as local as I possibly can, too bad betterBee is the one major supplier in NY. I'll never shop with them again.
My Customer Service response letter to my input would have been:
"Aram,
Thank you for your feedback. Along with our suppliers we do everything we can to provide healthy productive bees to our customers so your input is much appreciated. We'll forward your letter to our supplier.
Regards,
Customer Service"

[sqkcrk]

Dadant has a supply outlet in Waverly, NY. Or maybe you knew that already. What they don't have on hand they can get, just like Betterbee should be doing. Carl and his crew are real friendly, they remember your name and ser4vice is customer oriented, not excuse oriented. Give them a try, please.

Mann Lake doesn't have an outlet in NY, but they ship me whatever I want in a timely fashion.

Jerry, at Wixsons Honey,Inc, Dundee, NY is the best supplier of jars and lids, as well as nucs. You have to get your nuc order in before Dec. 31. Real friendly, very accomodating, real clean outfit. You'll think that you have arrived at a park when you drive in the driveway at Wixsons.

These are all good folks to deal w/. And if you find differently, let me know.

[Aram]

Good info, thank you.