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  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    East Liverpool, Ohio, USA
    Posts
    162

    Default Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    At our last bee meeting we had a guest speaker and during his talk he mentioned that wax moths will not go into honey supers as long as they have never had brood in them.

    He suggested that you should use excluders and never allow brood to be laid into your honey supers and wax moths will not bother these frames.

    He gave an explanation as to why, but I am curious as to other thoughts and opinions on this.

    Does anyone have any experience either way with this?

    Thanks in advance,
    Joe
    Last edited by jhs494; 11-03-2009 at 11:11 AM.
    Joe and Heidi S.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Leetonia, Ohio
    Posts
    389

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    I am about 20 minutes north of you by the way. I have found that wax moth do indeed grow in honey supers that have never been laid in or had brood in at all. The reason they say they won't go into brood supers is because the larvae are after the cocoons and left over bee bread for food. In honey supers that have never been used as brood frames, will not have either of these food sources to attract the wax moth larvae. Which makes sense in the fact that no food no reason to go there line of thinking. My wax moths just don't follow the rules the way they should I guess lol. Which bee meeting were you at?

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Madison, Alabama
    Posts
    356

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    I've had wax moths invade honey supers that have never had brood in them also. I have alsoheard the same thing as you that they won't do this, but reality is different in my experience.
    Rohe Bee Ranch "Free Range Bees"
    http://www.rohebeeranch.com

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    East Liverpool, Ohio, USA
    Posts
    162

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    Quote Originally Posted by jdpro5010 View Post
    Which bee meeting were you at?
    We are members of the Columbiana-Mohaning County Beekeepers Association.
    The speaker gave an outstanding talk and this is one point that he had mentioned and I wasn't sure if anyone had experiences that was different than this.
    This being our first year I hadn't came across anything that could say otherwise.
    Last edited by jhs494; 11-03-2009 at 03:55 PM.
    Joe and Heidi S.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Murfreesboro, TN, USA
    Posts
    1,398

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    SHBs larva will devastate honey supers....
    De Colores,
    Ken

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    San Mateo, CA
    Posts
    4,795

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    My honey supers are 30-40 years old and never attacked by wax moths. I use excluders. I store them in a shop unprotected.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Camas, WA
    Posts
    1,917

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    I have never (well, see below) had them in my honey supers either and I use excluders. This last August I had a stack of supers in my garage after extracting with a lid on the top. I had a small piece of brood wax with the remains of two queen cells that I had cut out of a frame and placed in another hive earlier.

    The piece of wax was about 1" square. One day I noticed a worm and found 3 wax moth larva had hatched out on the thing. I looked through my honey supers which were right next to the counter with the piece of wax but didn't find anything. I checked every few days for a while but never found any wax worms. They have since been moved to my shop for the winter.

    I tried not using excluders quite a few years ago and I did have a problem back then. I still have wooden frames with wax moth marks all over them from that time. I don't know if I have a big wax moth though. I never really see them in my hives. I was surprised to see the three worms on the piece of wax. So I won't go so far to say that they never are a problem in honey supers that have not had brood in them, but so far so good for me.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Huntsville, Alabama
    Posts
    675

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    If given the choice, WM's will always choose the frames that have had brood in them first. But they will get into supers that haven't had brood. I've had it happen. Luckily, I caught it early and they met their maker(Satan) in the freezer!

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Leetonia, Ohio
    Posts
    389

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    I too was at the meeting lol. I was the one elected to the board of directors. I thought Lee's talk was good, but please bear in mind that if you have 100 speakers at a bee meeting giving an answer to the same question you will inevitably get 100 different answers. I would agree that given a chance wax moths will go to brood frames first but believe me they will get into your honey supers also.

    Don't worry a whole lot about SHB as they have not found our area yet .

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Land O Lakes, FL
    Posts
    264

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    I hate the moths....

    I have found the following in 3 years of learning this stuff.
    -the moths will definately go after wax that has had brood over without.
    -the next thing they like is pollen. So if there are cells of pollen in the supers, cut them out. Beetles like this too.
    -The Xentari does work but be sure to spray it well at the right consistency and don't use any that is old.
    -leaving the tops open may help but not that much. I find moths in there with tops on or not.
    -the moths will even use fully drawn plastic that has a little wax on top. As me how I know.....
    -beetles will desomate supers if they have any pollen or honey residue. Be sure they are 100% clean
    -I am going to start using the moth crystals. I am having too many problems with the wax moth year round her in FL.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Evansville, IN, USA
    Posts
    2,837

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    Textbooks claim that wax moths cant survive on beeswax or honey. Do they get "into" honey supers? Yes. Do they do harm? They never have in mine!

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    New Cumberland, PA
    Posts
    1,380

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    I too was under the misconception that wax moths won't go into supers containing honey. But it happened to me in September. I had pulled my supers off and they were built mostly from new foundation and the wax moths did alot of damage on some of the frames as they burrowed into the honey.

    I had to learn the hard way and never again, will I pull Supers and wait until it is convenient for me to extract. The girls kept the wax moth out of their hives. If I can't extract right away, then my plans are to leave the super on.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Snowmass, Colorado, USA
    Posts
    2,497

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave W View Post
    Textbooks claim that wax moths cant survive on beeswax or honey. Do they get "into" honey supers? Yes. Do they do harm? They never have in mine!
    Wax moths will destroy your honey supers and the honey if you don't stay on top of them and extract. They can and do survive in the honey.
    Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid. John Wayne

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Evansville, IN, USA
    Posts
    2,837

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    Wax moths can and do "sometimes" damage comb honey. Thats why we are advised to freeze it soon after harvest.

    Wax moths do not "prefer" to overwinter in honey supers.

    Honey supers AND brood chambers can be stored overwinter WITHOUT fear of damage, IF the frames are exposed to light (and air helps). When "winter" temps are at or below about 40 F, wax moth damage is not a problem.

    I have brood chambers and honey supers that have been stores for years w/o treatment of any kind; w/o damage.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Land O Lakes, FL
    Posts
    264

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dave W View Post
    Honey supers AND brood chambers can be stored overwinter WITHOUT fear of damage, IF the frames are exposed to light (and air helps). When "winter" temps are at or below about 40 F, wax moth damage is not a problem.
    In FL, I have experienced wax moth in frames that had plenty of light. Maybe is reduces the infestation but it definately does not stop it.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Evansville, IN, USA
    Posts
    2,837

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    >In FL, I have experienced wax moth in frames that had plenty of light . . .
    Adult moths? or some larva?

    Adult Wax moths only lay eggs in darkness.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Land O Lakes, FL
    Posts
    264

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    I think I just had a revelation that makes me look stupid. I had a criss cross stacked with no lid set outside so that it would have light. But... it gets dark at night.

    So the revelation is that they need to be lit 24hrs a day.
    Last edited by Barry; 11-09-2009 at 04:05 PM.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Evansville, IN, USA
    Posts
    2,837

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    >the revelation is that they need to be lit 24hrs a day . . .
    BINGO!

    While you are on a roll (w/ revelations), I have some other problems I would like your help in solving

    And remember, in Fla the temp does not get cold enough to "stop" Wax moth activity.

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Land O Lakes, FL
    Posts
    264

    Default Re: Wax moths in Honey Supers.

    Fire away.
    Last edited by Barry; 11-09-2009 at 04:06 PM.

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