The Last Beekeeper

[Tom G. Laury]

Thanks, Mike and Mark. It helps to know I'm not the only one struggling to keep numbers. If I double my existing count I may stay even by the time 12 months pass.

[EastSideBuzz]

I watched the movie and the main message I got was that taking my girls to CA would put them in jeopardy like the people in the show. Maybe the stress or the diseases on the blooms etc is causing it. It was very interesting and thought provoking. Even the guy that was successful from the south starting having losses after he returned home from CA. So CA might be place to stay away from. They have the terminator as the Governor so maybe it is a sign. I think it is a greater problem then the show portrays.

Losing 70% of 2000 hives would be devastating and I think she had already suffered 30% losses before she left taking her down to the 2k number.

They did not address the bee keeper that does not take there hives anywhere. Does CCD still happen to them also. Reading the posts I would say it does wish they had gone into that a bit. Is it global or just more of a US thing.?

Is there places that we can get our politicians to donate money to help. Write letters to help publicize that fact that we need more research.?

[suttonbeeman]

JBG
I disagree with you that moving bees to almonds is causing big loses and the problem. Beeks have moved bees for decades without this happening. When I lost 50% of my operation I had never been to Ca. Its true moving bees is stressful, both to the beek and bees. Whats killing the bees is a weakoned immune system (pesticides?)! THen the stress of droughts, moving, other weather related causes and mites(virusus) is the straw that broke the camels back....but the ultimate cause is a weak immune system! Read my post I made in bee diseases urban beekeeping vs country beekeeping. A beek I know lost 2000 of 2500 colonies last fall, MOST before he moved them to FL. He has NOT USED ANY pesticides legal or illegal for years(6-7). He sells nucs(until last yr) so all his comb is 5 yrs of less old with no exposure to miteicides. He raises his own queens, DOES NOT GO TO CA, never has and only makes one move a year....honey producing yards in north to fl to raise bees(nucs) and queens. Produces little orange honey and makes his honey up north. His area up north is cropland with a high concentration of vegs and other crops with lots of pesticide use(neonictinoids). He now has many hives that are going downhill fast..CCD symptoms. He bascially is a nonmiteicide use beek using thymol and other natural controls and has a LOW mite count!!! So its not Ca almonds as the cause!!

[Brandy]

The most disturbing thing to me watching the show, was installing the new packages directly into the dead out hives. At least that was the impression I got. If they did remove all the old frames and wax it wasn't shown. To me, if the hive died out, putting the new packages right back into that dead out was foolish in my mind. Maybe that's all he could do to get the contract fufilled fast but I'm curious if those packages made it to fall or spring.

[pcelar]

If the biz of almond pollination is contributing to CCD then I say boycott almonds.

[EastSideBuzz]

Maybe that's all he could do to get the contract fufilled fast but I'm curious if those packages made it to fall or spring.

I pay $70 a package and they are not shipped. Can you imagine what he spent to have them sent in from Australia over night.? He could not have made much money filling the contract. But, maybe he kept his reputation with the farmers.

[JBG]

JBG
I disagree with you that moving bees to almonds is causing big loses and the problem. Beeks have moved bees for decades without this happening. So its not Ca almonds as the cause!!

Here is my thinking on this Suttonbeeman. What I did learn from watching the program was just how rapidly they have expanded the size of the CA almond crop and what a big success it has been globally. We just did not have a single 100% bee dependent crop in the US of this size 40 years ago. Sure bees were moved around but nothing like it is now both in the concentration in that area of CA and numbers of bee colonies. Many of the beeks in the program mention this. I don't think there is anyplace else on Earth that has this kind of bee Ag. going on now and it has never happened on this scale historically either I don't think.

[JBG]

Don't understand your point?
I don't find any Beek practices that contribute to a serious thing like CCD to be a laughing matter that's for sure. I would certainly give up eating almonds if the cultivation practice is shown to contribute to CCD as the program suggests. I saw boycotting almonds as a clear sub-message of this program.
However, more reasonable would just be to modify the commercial beek practices that may be contributing and keep everybody happy with as many almonds as they want to eat.

[Skinner Apiaries]

You guys do know that CCD is probably just the result of the israeli paralysis virus right? Google USDA research on CCD, theyre saying 96% of CCD cases involved IPV, and that other 4 percent is probably the pesticides. They also said healthy hives had NO IPV present. Why they wont call these obvious statistics teh "cause" of CCD is beyond me. I'm in college studying Biology sciences, and I can defintiely say, 96% is NOT coincidental levels. I've simply concluded that I won't be pollinating if any other commercial interest has bees at the same location. I defintiely won't be going to Hellifornia. If I do go, for the prices they pay, they can just keep the gear and all. All those australian bees they fly in that are comingling with US bees, some of them carry the disease, which we all know is transmitted by varroa. So everyone can cry out that its stress and pesticide, but its really just too many bees in one spot, sick bees getting robbed, resulting in, alot of sick bees. If someone has the time to find the link to the USDA thing before I get time, do post it.

[JBG]

Some data from a biased source but still of interest for your 96% number.

http://www.beeologics.com/CCD.asp

[Skinner Apiaries]

hey, its communicable. And while I suppose it could be biased in presentation, the data is quantitative.

[sqkcrk]

..but there sure are a lot of explanations of what it isn't.

I do wish you luck...keep up the good work on your bees.

To you second line, thanks, I'm trying.

To the first line, a friend of mine has spent part of the last six months or so going to Doctor after doctor and PT to PT only to find someone who now tells him that he has arthritis. He sure knows what he doesn't have too. No HIV/AIDS or lyme disease or lung cancer, etc., etc. It's probably the same thing w/ bees.

[sqkcrk]

Mark,I had 1016 pretty good looking hives in the summer of 2008. Did a lot of Fall feeding because of the drought,both syrup and pollen sub. By Jan 09 I only had 532 rentable hives for almonds.Lots of feed in the hives with a tiny cluster and queen. And a mountain of deadouts stacked up. CCD? PPB? Nosema C.?Kashmir BV?etc.? Who knows ,likely some of each.
Everything has been restocked,at great expense.I've kept bees most of my life but my confidence as a beekeeper is the lowest its ever been...
Good luck to all of us trying to keep our bees alive.

Back at ya loggermike. And don't let those who haven't walked in your shoes get you down. Look back at all of the stuff you have lived through. Some years from now this will be one of those things too, hopefully. If it doesn't kill ya, it'll make ya stronger.

[sqkcrk]

Thanks, Mike and Mark. It helps to know I'm not the only one struggling to keep numbers. If I double my existing count I may stay even by the time 12 months pass.

Gonna do it all at once or spread it out over a couple of seasons?

[sqkcrk]

I watched the movie and the main message I got was that taking my girls to CA would put them in jeopardy like the people in the show.

Losing 70% of 2000 hives would be devastating and I think she had already suffered 30% losses before she left taking her down to the 2k number.

They did not address the bee keeper that does not take there hives anywhere. Does CCD still happen to them also.

Is there places that we can get our politicians to donate money to help. Write letters to help publicize that fact that we need more research.?

A. It ain't necassarily taking them to the groves that is killing them.
B. How many of her hives were dead before they were taken out of the wearhouse and loaded on the semi? They didn't show them being looked at before going to CA.
C. Stationary bees have been hit too. Yes, it is happening in Europe too. From Poland to Spain.
D. I think that we are getting pretty good media attention and we have gotten research dollars just a couple of years ago.

[sqkcrk]

To me, if the hive died out, putting the new packages right back into that dead out was foolish in my mind. Maybe that's all he could do to get the contract fufilled fast but I'm curious if those packages made it to fall or spring.

A calculated risk on his part. I'd be more concerned about explaining it to his wife when he got home. He could loose more than just his bees making unilateral descisions that way.

And why the heck did he run back to the truck when he didn't want to talk to her anyway? He left that phone in the truck for a reason in the first place.

[sqkcrk]

I pay $70 a package and they are not shipped. Can you imagine what he spent to have them sent in from Australia over night.? He could not have made much money filling the contract. But, maybe he kept his reputation with the farmers.

I heard that they cost about $120.00 each. So, maybe he took in $20 or $30 on each colony. Or broke even on each package. Either way, he lost, but maybe not as badly as he otherwise would have.

[JohnK and Sheri]

Either way, he lost, but maybe not as badly as he otherwise would have.

I have heard of $140 for the package, then $140 pollination fee so breaking even on the almonds. BUT, if he had waited til spring to try to replace those bees, he would have gotten no pollination check plus had a big cost for replacement bees. Basically, his replacement bees are paid for. Or would have been if he could have rented them all. Sounds like only 400 still made the grade.
Making that kind of decision without his wife's knowledge, after the talk they had prior to the losses isn't the way to a harmonious marriage. I would imagine she hit the roof, then had to hunker down with the books to figure how to make ends meet.

As for the bees on that show dying from CCD or going to California or whatever, I didn't see ANY in depth analysis of what was wrong with those bees. Could have been garden variety mites or starvation for all they told us.

Sheri

[pcelar]

Don't understand your point?

I was laughing at your comment.

[EastSideBuzz]

A calculated risk on his part. I'd be more concerned about explaining it to his wife when he got home. He could loose more than just his bees making unilateral descisions that way.

And why the heck did he run back to the truck when he didn't want to talk to her anyway? He left that phone in the truck for a reason in the first place.

He does not have to explain it. She probably has watched the show. So I think it would have to be more then just explaining he needed to do. I am sensing allot of flowers and jewelry.