help me harvest

[terri lynn]

Ok, the good news is I'm going to get some honey this year. Bad news, I don't have extracting equipment and moved away from the bee club that had it for members' use (new club doesn't).

I'm needing to keep costs down as much as possible since I was on a medical leave for 2 yrs after surgeries, and am now back working, but it will be a while before I'm really having income again. At the sByame time, I believe in getting the best quailty possible and not having to "rebuy" later.

So, just for instance, say I had $1000 for equipment. Is it best to put everything I can into a nice extractor with a larger capacity? Or to get less capacity and buy an electric knife, uncapping tank, etc. What all do I actually need? Has anyone rigged their own uncapping tank? I looked at the plans here on BeeSource, but that tank may be beyond me at the moment. I've never extracted before, so it's hard for me to know how to make a temporary version for this year of that type of thing, when I've never seen a version period of it and so don't know how they're put together or even what components you really need. I've heard I could make do with a bread knife for a year. Feasible? By next year I'll be able to buy the rest. I also thought about getting a hand crank that would later convert and give me flexibility on power or not, but the best deals seem to be on power units for the more quality machines. I'm hoping to get a Maxant. Brushy has a special on a 9 frame hand crank with all the rest of the gear, that I could later convert, but it's an Italian model and lacks features, so long term probably wouldn't be as good a deal. I thought of the Mann Lake 18/9, that gives a lot of frame capacity and doesn't cost much to convert, but have pretty much ruled that out now, because I read about people having issues with it not having enough power, and they didn't seem to stand behind it like I know Maxant does.

So, those of you who have been there, could I get away with not buying the uncapping stuff for now and get the Maxant 20 frame? Or get the 9 frame and a few of the other tools? Which tools are most important? Also, how hard are the units to move around by yourself? Is there a big difference in size (weight is not as big an issue)? Anything else I should keep in mind?

Thanks!!!!

[bnatural]

How many supers/frames are you going to be extracting now and down the road? I think that's a big driver in how much you want to do manually and powered.

I bought the Brushy Mountain 9-frame Italian model years ago, first as a hand crank, and then I bought the motor conversion unit. It is a nice extractor, and I still use it. For me, the motorized extractor was MUCH nicer to use.

As for an uncapping tank, I'll bet you could rig one up with one of those plastic tubs from Wally World and some wood. I have an older Brushy Mountain plastic one, and all it is is a tub with an insert and a piece of wood going across with a nail in it to hold the frame in place. Simple.

As for the knife, while I have never used a bread knife, many have posted that it works.

For my money, I would invest in the extractor, since that is your big ticket item, at least initially. Get one that can grow with your yard.

Bill

[NasalSponge]

Funny thing I just went thru this.....had 1000 bucks to spend so what I decided to do is purchase the Maxant 3100 but I went with the hand crank for two reasons...1. with the $300 I saved I bought all the other stuff I needed like a hot knife, uncapping tank, sieve....stuff like that and 2. I figured with the hand crank (I intend to purchase the motor kit for it next year) if something negative should happen to the country and the infrastructure collapses I can still extract.

[Fuzzy]

So, it appears that you do belong to a new bee club. If so, then there are certainly members in the club that possess an extractor. See if you cannot rent or borrow one from one of the members. They may not want to let you take it somewhere else but might be willing to let you use it at their place. If not, it doesn't say much for the club members.

If you are strapped for cash and can't find an extractor to use, then scrape off the comb and do crush and strain. The bees can and will rebuild the comb next year. You will just get a bit less honey.

And yes, I do assist my club members for extraction. But I do not loan out the equipment because of the value. I may take it to them and wait while they work.

Fuzzy

[terri lynn]

I figured with the hand crank (I intend to purchase the motor kit for it next year) if something negative should happen to the country and the infrastructure collapses I can still extract.

That's a hoot! I have to admit, I keep thinking roughly the same thing! When I try to reason it (because I can get better deals overall on the power units) I think if that were to happen I'd have bigger things to worry about! And if it temporarily went out, I could just wait. But isn't it funny how you get used to being self-reliant as much as possible!

Bill- Thanks for that info. That's what I was wondering. For the uncapper, it looks like they have a screen, but that's easy enough as well. I just wasn't sure if there was something I couldn't see from the photos. Might not be as easy to work with, but I think I can make do for a year.

I meant to put in the post - I have 15 hives (up and down with swarms, combining, etc). I would be happy to get 20-30, but am not going to belabor it, since I'm liking the new job so well.

[terri lynn]

Fuzzy- unfortunately, I don't know many of the members very well. The president hasn't been very welcoming with newcomers and it makes it kinda hard. I tried to ask questions at the meeting, but that wasn't encouraged either. Then I found Beesource. I must admit, it would be easier if I had been to meetings lately. I went at first, even when discouraged, but they are just once a month and the day they have them became very difficult to make it on, so haven't been in 4 months or so. When I asked around before the only extractor I heard about was a 2 frame plastic I think. It's an hour away, also.

I did make friends with one from the club who has been great, but he doesn't have one either. He is planning to get one next year - doesn't think he's going to have much if any surplus this year.

So I thought, I'd just go ahead and get my own. I don't mind except I want more than I need to spend! I wish I was in your area! Then I'd wait a few months.

[bnatural]

That's a hoot! I have to admit, I keep thinking roughly the same thing! When I try to reason it (because I can get better deals overall on the power units) I think if that were to happen I'd have bigger things to worry about! And if it temporarily went out, I could just wait. But isn't it funny how you get used to being self-reliant as much as possible!

When I bought mine, the motor was a conversion kit. You should check to see if the motorized unit includes the hand crank assembly. If it does, then you have the best of both worlds. Personally, if the grid collapses, I'm going solar.

For the uncapper, it looks like they have a screen, but that's easy enough as well. I just wasn't sure if there was something I couldn't see from the photos. Might not be as easy to work with, but I think I can make do for a year.

That's what I meant by the tray; it's just a cappings catcher so they can drain. Screening would work fine.

NS, if you ever read Lucifer's Hammer by Larry Niven and Jerry Pournelle (1971 - so I'm dating myself), you'll be glad you have a marketable post-apocalyptic survivor skill.

Bill

[fish_stix]

Terri; How to rig an uncapping tank. Got to home depot and buy 2 large storage boxes; the black ones are the best. Drill a pattern of 1/16" holes in one pretty much covering the bottom. Place the drilled tank inside the other and use some 1x2" cleats screwed to the inside of the bottom tank to hold the top tank up about 8-12". Take a 1x4" board long enough to reach across the width of the top tank and drive a 12 penny nail through the exact center or use a long wood screw. Attach this board with drywall screws down through the rim of the top tank. To use it line the whole upper tank with fiberglass window screen and uncap directly into it. The honey will settle through the screen and out of the top tank into the bottom tank and the screen will catch the cappings, bee body parts, wax moth worms and other assorted undesirable flotsam. If you want to "Cadillac" it buy a honey gate and install it in the bottom tank. Melt the cappings in a solar wax melter. Will easily and cheaply handle 15 hives until you have the funds to get "professional" equipment.

[slickbrightspear]

you can buy one of the utility tub sinks from lowes they work pretty good for an uncapping tank and have legs built in. just put a screen to catch the cappings and let the honey drain out the bottom into a bucket works well for me.

[honeyshack]

When we first started out, hubby built a counter top from 2x4 and 2x6's painted and inserted 2 plasitc sinks. Cost for the total unit...$50.00. He put a shelf underneath for catching the honey that went through the drain. I added in 2 queen excluders on top of small blocks of wood that the capping fell on to while uncapping. Cost for hand held uncapper...$80 or so. Couple of wash bins from Walmart, $3.00, some rectangle expandable strainers from walmart, 4...total $15.00.
Total cost was under $300, i think. Add in some 5 gallon food grade pails for $5.00 a piece, and needed about 50...We did this with 30 hives. Then we borrowed a fellows used 12 frame extractor. He was willing to let us borrow it since he was hoping we would by it.
bought a very used 4 frame extractor that now sits in the barn loft for 100.00. Worked great. There are good used ones, just got to find them.
Then
Think outside the box, the counter with the sinks works great and I should see i i have some pics
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/h...e/114_1448.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/h...e/114_1451.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/h...e/114_1452.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/h...e/114_1449.jpg
Hope these pics help to give you ideas that are cheap and good for near about 50 hives. Will take some time to extract but...
mods feel free to fix if i messed it up.

[KQ6AR]

My MannLake decapping tank uses a queen excluder for a screen.
A member on our club uses the plastic laundry sink on legs, it works well.

[NasalSponge]

bnatural....No never read it. When we lived in a small town when the kids where little we where very self sufficient...bees, garden, heated the whole house with wood I cut from our acreage stuff like that. These days I ponder things because right now the future is not so bright looking. So to have a hand crank extractor and a few extra rounds of ammo around I consider prudent.

[StevenG]

Terri, the key is, how many hives do you have, and how many do you plan to end up with? That is the key! Now, to answer your question about extractors, many have bought hand cranked models, then converted to motorized when funds became available. The advantage of going that route is if your motor ever gives out (and they do! I experienced that last year while extracting) you can convert back to hand and finish the job.

I started off years ago with a simple two frame non-reversible extractor. When I got to 16 hives, harvesting an average of 1500 pounds of honey a year, I quickly gave that up, and bought Kelley's two frame reversible extractor. You can spin a minute or two to take much of the honey out of one side of the frames, stop it, reverse the frames, then spin the honey out of the other side, stop, reverse, and finish the first side. That reduces, if not eliminates, blow outs.

For your budget, you could buy that extractor, and depending on shipping (or take a vacation and go get it, and other items on your shopping list) you might have enough money left over to get other things you want/need.

Personally, I don't know how long the plastic parts on some of today's extractors would last. I've had my all metal extractor 32 years now. However, now that I'm going up to 40-50 hives, I do plan to get a 20-frame radial.

But, everyone has an opinion, and that's mine, fwiw. Good luck to you!
Regards,
Steven

[doc25]

Thanks for the pics Honeyshack. Good idea about the sink.

[terri lynn]

Great ideas everyone! I don't know that I'll ever need to buy an uncapping tank now, too many other good options. Thanks for the pics, too, Honeyshack - gave me ideas to use instead of legs, as well. I've got several of the items ya'll mentioned (even the sink with legs in my laundry room) so I'll look around tomorrow and see what I come up to follow one of those plans.

What do you use to store honey prior to bottling- the 5 gallon buckets? Any preferences for uncapping plane vs. electric knife (when I get to that)? Yes, I'm trying to take advantage of the innovative group here! Does anyone know roughly how much difference there is in the size of a 9 vs 20 frame? Or a great place to get bottles?

I hope the other 1st timers are seeing this. Thanks again for helping me!

[bnatural]

What do you use to store honey prior to bottling- the 5 gallon buckets?

I've gotten by with plastic buckets up to now.

Any preferences for uncapping plane vs. electric knife (when I get to that)?

I've used an electric uncapping knife up to now, but as I wrote earlier, am thinking about an uncapping machine for next year.

Does anyone know roughly how much difference there is in the size of a 9 vs 20 frame? Or a great place to get bottles?

I don't know the difference, but I remember that Brushy Mountain could send my 9-frame by UPS, which saved on shipping.

I've ordered bottles from Betterbee and Brushy Mountain. Shipping cost is probably the biggest factor.

Bill

[LenInNorCal]

http://beehuman.blogspot.com/

For those who really have no money, a few hives (that's up to you what that means) and wish to extract honey, I found this method great. No machine, no electrical things to break, not really labor intensive and cheap. Check the video on THE HONEY HARVEST.
And if you can't watch video on the computer let me know and it will be given to you. Real simple.

[honeyshack]

What do you use to store honey prior to bottling- the 5 gallon buckets? Any preferences for uncapping plane vs. electric knife (when I get to that)? Yes, I'm trying to take advantage of the innovative group here! Does anyone know roughly how much difference there is in the size of a 9 vs 20 frame? Or a great place to get bottles?

Before we went to what we have now, much bigger op, we stored in 5 gallon buckets and bought two stainless steel pots from walmart with the thickened bottoms to heat honey on the stove. Then we used 100 mesh straining cloth and strained into the barrel as we needed.
I used the uncapping plane...the heavy, you saw in the pics.
The 9 and 20....do not know. we bought a used maxant 30 frame for $1600.00 and it was 25 years old. Works fantastic. I like it better than the 20 frame dadant we borrowed from a friend. We use them both together and the maxant does a way better job of spinning the frames clean. I think it might be due to the extra space between the frames. Go to the local bee supply stores, maybe they have a bulleting board with for sale items, if you have a beekeeepers org, do they put out a magazine and does it have want ads or for sale adds...farm newspapers have a beekeepers section in the classifieds section...Lots of places to find used....as well, go on line and look for farm auctions, find the beekeepers auctions, usually in april and may, and there you will find piles of equipment at good prices.
The only thing we bought new were the uncapping plane, the storage barrel and the plastic sinks. Now that we have gotten bigger, still the things we bought were used. I should post a pic of our line now...what a change. need to take one when it is clean though

[Fuzzy]

"What do you use to store honey prior to bottling- the 5 gallon buckets?"

The real question is how many supers of honey you get. You indicated that you had 15 hives. If you only get 15 supers of honey then 5 gallon buckets are fine. If you get 60 supers of honey then you have another problem.

I have 5 hives and get 20-25 supers. 5 gallon buckets are fine BUT heavy.

Fuzzy

[Ross]

First, all you really NEED to harvest honey is a knife and something to strain through (panty hose will do). Cut the comb out, place in the hose, crush with your hands, and let it drip into a container.

Now, for a little higher tech, add an extractor. An uncapping vat is a 3 dollar plastic bin from Walmart with a board straddling the top. To uncap, use a bread knife or simply rake the cappings with a fork. You will still need the panty hose to strain the honey out of the extractor.

Next up, add a bottling bucket with a gate. It makes bottling a lot easier.

Used extractors do come alone if you are patient and keep watching. My 20 frame Dadant cost $400 and came from Denton. Yes, it will fit through a standard 3 foot door. The cheapest bottles are the ones you don't pay shipping on, canning jars from Walmart.