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  1. #681
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    Jan 2005
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    souris, manitoba, canada
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    746

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    What is 80 mm plus buckwheat selling for? There are ways of darkening it , by blending and heating.I hear a bamboo floral source is a good blender for darkening, and a little heat doesn't do much to the taste

  2. #682
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Manitoba Canada
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    5,503

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    I dont know much about that, but he was more concerned about the taste and smell than the colour. I suppose if the taste is there he will not have any trouble in darkening it??
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  3. #683

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    Packer called looking for some loads of honey. He offered $1.65-$1.70 LOL. I asked which is it $1.65 or $1.70. I'm glad I had to tell him I was sold out. Those are the prices I sold two years ago. This is early for packers to be calling the producers. Just tells you there isn't the honey being put out on the market. At those prices you have to hold, or find a better market.

  4. #684
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Garland, Bladen County, NC, USA
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    2,766

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    We sold our fall honey ( the dark stuff) for $2 a pound in the barrel and $2.50 in the bucket (60lb). It went to several small bottlers... it is all gone... did we sell too cheap?

  5. #685
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Hubert,North Carolina, USA
    Posts
    38

    Thumbs Up Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    Herb for dark fall honey I think you did good! Wholesale for amber in the Mideast is $1.40-$1.75 per pound as stated in the new ABJ.

  6. #686
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Sudbury,Ontario,Canada
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    127

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    I've always wondered about this supply and demand stuff. It's my opinion that the
    big players in any industry try to cripple the little guy with their flooding of the market
    with their products. At least, it's always seems that way Then the commercial buyers
    say that it's a supply and demand thing. Isn't it the same product?

    The best example I can think of is the petroleum industry. Ever notice that the prices
    for gasoline at the pumps jumps up at the threat of war, instabilty, etc. While it takes
    like forever, if never for the prices to lower at their normal prices when all is ok.

    The suppliers will say that they have to now pay higher to get gasoline so you
    now have to pay more. But wasn't the gas in the pumps now paid ata lower price.
    This price gouging is a sad and everyone buys it.

    But the gasoline presently in the pumps was bought at cheaper prices.
    Sorry for talking about gas, I'm sure it's easier for you to understand
    this example since it affect almost everyone on the planet. Food prices
    are sure to be the same.

    I'm not kocking the big producers they are out to make money.
    It's the big buyers that are the culprits, with their stockhoders.
    I just wish the little guy could make equal money for his product
    that's all. I know that will probably never happen.

  7. #687
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Herrick, SD USA
    Posts
    4,035

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    I really dont think your comparisons of the oil business to the honey industry stand up to closer scrutiny. Most of the major players in honey marketing are family owned companies or member owned cooperatives. The honey industry, I presume, is a bit too small for the Krafts, Proctor and Gambles and the like to show much interest in. The great thing about our industry, and what you have missed in your post is that the smaller guy who takes the time and effort to market his or her product as a unique local product can command a far higher price than the larger producers who end up having to sell their honey to the major packers in trailer load quantities.
    "People will generally accept facts as truth only if the facts agree with what they already believe."- Andy Rooney

  8. #688
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Sudbury,Ontario,Canada
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    127

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    What a about these guys? Scrutiny this Jim:

    http://www.aolnews.com/2010/09/02/11...e-honey-sting/

    Here's the full indictment:

    http://www.justice.gov/usao/iln/pr/c...pr0901_01a.pdf

    I learned a new thing in that story. Honey Laundering

    I'm sure they ain't alone.

    Oh look, some more, Jim:

    http://www.disinfo.com/2011/01/the-d...ey-laundering/

    It ain't over:

    http://foodwhistleblower.org/blog/22/211

    Quoted from the above link:

    Schneider reports that four or five of the 12 major honey packers in the U.S. knowingly
    buy this illegal honey so they can sell it cheaper and make more money. According to Richard Adee,
    the Washington Legislative Chairman of the American Honey Producers Association, "we know who
    they are" and "everyone in the industry knows." But no names were revealed in the article.


    Honey importer sentenced to 30 months for conspiring to evade US import duties:

    http://www.ice.gov/news/releases/1011/101105chicago.htm

    What you missed Jim is that I never mentioned anything against the producers large and small.
    They are ok in my books. It's the big business corporate types that are the problem.

    You show many any industry today and I'll show you some corruption in it!
    Last edited by honeyman46408; 10-27-2011 at 04:15 PM. Reason: UNQuote

  9. #689
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
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    Herrick, SD USA
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    4,035

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    Lost Bee: First off I have re-read your post and my reply to try to understand the biting tone of your post. If you are implying that all the major American honey packers are involved in deals like this then I simply say that I dont believe there is a body of evidence to support this contention. I have sold to most of the larger packers and would generally categorize them as shrewd but honest businessmen and yes most of these are privately owned businesses, some of them owned by the same family for generations. These links you have posted (and in this "Google age" I don't really care for link posting wars) are all about a well documented case of criminals who got caught doing a lot of unseemly stuff and no one cheered louder when they were indicted than I. Here is a recent initiative that many of the big players in the American honey packing industry are signed onto (and for brevity I will keep it to just one link). http://truesourcehoney.com/ Do you disagree with my statement that the smaller producer/packer has a distinct advantage in the market place by being able to ask a premium price for a quality locally produced product? I see these products all the time in grocery stores of all sizes (including Wal-Mart) asking premium prices, they wouldnt be on the shelf long if they werent selling.
    "People will generally accept facts as truth only if the facts agree with what they already believe."- Andy Rooney

  10. #690
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Sudbury,Ontario,Canada
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    127

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    I never implicated any American honey packers. Actually, I just posted stuff from the Internet for
    all to read for themselves, with the links so people would know I ain't making anything up. I also
    never mentioned any country for that matter in either posts. What other writers say is, what they
    say. I just provided the links that's all. I don't know why your indicating that I'm knocking on
    producers cause neither of post say anything against any producers.

    Oh well good luck.

  11. #691
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    souris, manitoba, canada
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    746

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    "These big packers are still using imported honey of uncertain safety that they know is illegal because they know their chances of getting caught are slim," Adee said.

    Read more: http://healthland.time.com/2011/08/2...#ixzz1c2IhkuhT
    I would say there is almost a conspiracy among the largest US packers to import cheap Chinese honey, if only to remain competitive in some markets.
    As far as True Source honey , i think its sorta of a bad joke on North American producers, all honey produced in the western hemisphere can be traced,its what comes from China is the problem

  12. #692
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    May 2009
    Location
    Garland, Bladen County, NC, USA
    Posts
    2,766

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    We buy used honey buckets from a Turkey Co. They all say Argentina, India. Do you think that means China -> India-> Argentina -> USA? Makes me wonder.

  13. #693
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    Oct 2011
    Location
    Sudbury,Ontario,Canada
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    127

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    Oh boy, Irwin don't speak the truth or they'll get mad.

    hpm08161947, get the honey tested for those insecticides mentioned
    in links of my post #688. If they are positive you know you've been
    duped. I hope not.
    Last edited by Lost Bee; 10-27-2011 at 08:23 PM.
    There's 10 chefs in a kitchen and still not one will tell you how to boil water unless there's something in it for them.

  14. #694
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    May 2009
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    Garland, Bladen County, NC, USA
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    2,766

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    Quote Originally Posted by Lost Bee View Post
    Oh boy, Irwin don't speak the truth or they'll get mad.

    hpm08161947, get the honey tested for those insecticides mentioned
    i
    They are just empty buckets when I get them. Still got the labels though.Guess GROEB FARMS was the packer - least that is what is on the label.

  15. #695
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    Oct 2011
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    Sudbury,Ontario,Canada
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    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    Groeb Farms is mentioned in this in blending their honey,etc.

    http://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/Pre_96...95/47.txt.html

    I guess the truth hurts, sorry hpm08161947.

    I've never knew anything about Honey Laundering till today.

    I'm glad I buy honey direct from a small producer.
    There's 10 chefs in a kitchen and still not one will tell you how to boil water unless there's something in it for them.

  16. #696
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    Jan 2005
    Location
    souris, manitoba, canada
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    746

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    Must be a nice to grow your packing buisness, selling Cheap foreign honey, lets see plants in Michigan, florida, texas and California, where next, the north west USA, and you get every other large packer who is forced to join in the meelee to hold some market share
    208 MILLION LBS OF IMPORTED HONEY in the last 18 months, ( 50 % of one years consumption }45 million from India alone ( Adee says there ain't enough bees in India TO produce that amt)Honey market is hot and according to Ron Phipps its going to get a lot hotter

  17. #697
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    May 2009
    Location
    Garland, Bladen County, NC, USA
    Posts
    2,766

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    Quote Originally Posted by Lost Bee View Post
    Groeb Farms is mentioned in this in blending their honey,etc.


    I'm glad I buy honey direct from a small producer.
    Interesting read.

    Don't worry we clean the empty buckets out very well. Then we put the good stuff in them. Pretty hard to turn down used buckets for .05 a piece.

  18. #698
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Sudbury,Ontario,Canada
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    127

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    I guess Honey Laundering isn't as serious as Money Laundering.
    It's only the food people eat right?
    There's 10 chefs in a kitchen and still not one will tell you how to boil water unless there's something in it for them.

  19. #699
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    Feb 2006
    Location
    Herrick, SD USA
    Posts
    4,035

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    If you are going to post links then maybe not have them be from 1995. Not sure where anyone got the idea that I would defend illegal importation of unhealthy honey. Wouldnt it be nice if our government was actually vigilant about inspecting the purity of the products that come across our borders, no argument there at all. I only have a problem when you start painting all honey packers with the same broad brush, yeah there are a few bad ones out there no question about it. My understanding of the original intent of Lost Bee's post was that the "little guy dosent have an opportunity to make equal money for his product". I pointed out the fact that it is quite common for a smaller guy to get a higher return than a larger guy and I felt I did so in a non-confrontational way. Now if I might politely excuse myself until things settle down here a bit.
    "People will generally accept facts as truth only if the facts agree with what they already believe."- Andy Rooney

  20. #700
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    Oct 2011
    Location
    Sudbury,Ontario,Canada
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    127

    Default Re: Bulk honey prices and market outlook

    I wonder what would happen if local honey producers would sell clean unadulterated honey
    to China? Wouldn't it be sold at a premium vs their medicated residue honey? It's too bad
    production isn't that strong in the Americas.
    Last edited by Barry; 10-28-2011 at 07:32 AM. Reason: language
    There's 10 chefs in a kitchen and still not one will tell you how to boil water unless there's something in it for them.

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