e) Buying nuc vs. package bees

[CaBees]

There was a discussion at a meeting last night in No. Cal. of how some beekeepers ordered 75 nucs last year. Over 50% of them were africanized. So I guess that could be one more reason to not buy a nuc unless you know for certain where it came from. Probably local will always be better then out of state....

[bluegrass]

In AFB areas Local is going to be the greatest risk. Bees that are shipped from out of state have health inspections done and while not specifically looking for AFB traits, if the inspectors suspect AFB they will not issue the certificate.

[beyondthesidewalks]

Over 50% of them were africanized.

I have to ask how it was determined that the bees were africanized. It's not uncommon for bees to replace their queen. If their queen was a hybrid then her offspring may tend to get mean. It seems like everytime someone runs into hot bees, they claim they are africanized. If you don't have paper from a lab confirming that bees have AHB genetics than it is irresponsible to claim bees are AHB. Sorry, I'll step down from my soap box now. That topic does get under my skin and the bees in question may have truly been AHB. I have to ask every time because there are so many irresponsible claims that hot bees are africanized.

[CaBees]

The woman giving the presentation said they knew they were because they were not only very aggressive, but would follow people over 200 feet from the hive and not stop the attack. That is all I know....

[jim lyon]

In AFB areas Local is going to be the greatest risk. Bees that are shipped from out of state have health inspections done and while not specifically looking for AFB traits, if the inspectors suspect AFB they will not issue the certificate.

I am not aware of any states that give AHB free (I presume you mean) certifications. Texas used to but I think they quit.

[Buzzsaw2012]

should a bee keeper worry about bringing in diseases or pests when purchasing a nuc that comes from many states away and /or on dated frames?
or is there equal chance of contamination by purchasing pkg bees?

I am still learning on bees , but I do know people who always buy cattle, hogs and poultry at sale barns have a lot more problems with disease and pests.
so far I have not found any local stock pkg bees or nuc's for sale only migrating bees.

[bluegrass]

Buzz

IMO the risk of disease is less with packages. Packages only come from commercial producers, it is very easy to research what sources people have good luck with and what sources to avoid. With a nuc it is more important to get a good recommendation for a supplier... Anybody can raise a nuc and they may be full of disease.

If I wanted to purchase a nuc as somebody who was new to beekeeping I would ask on here who to go with. Buy from the members who have a long history on the forum and frequent posts. It shows that they have a reputation with the forum which they value so they are less likely to sell a bad product that word of will resurface on the forum. Members with few posts and/or a short history can just as easily sell a bad product and then resurface under a new user name.

Avoid searching for random websites when looking for nucs... you never know what you will get. I know of one person selling "Northern Survivor" stock at a premium, but on their website it states that their mother queens come from a supplier in Southern California. There are all kinds of shady deals out there... which is why I would only go with good recommendations from either this site or your local bee association.

[bluegrass]

The woman giving the presentation said they knew they were because they were not only very aggressive, but would follow people over 200 feet from the hive and not stop the attack. That is all I know....

I agree with Beyond the sidewalks. I have had bees that would follow for a lot farther than 200 ft and most certainly were not Africanized. Many hybrids are often that aggressive, 2nd and 3rd gen Buckfast are often un-manageable because they are so hot.

[jim lyon]

I have dealt with Africanized genetics in the past, they were pretty unmanageable. I have also dealt with an occasional mean hive which often mimicked AHB pretty closely. I would mark them as a hive that needed requeened but often it would not even be noticeable the next time it was opened. A number of factors can trigger mean behavior in a hive such as skunks, weather, shade, how often they were opened or even how they were opened. The only way I know for sure if a hive has AHB genetics is a lab test but a pretty good guess can be made by observing a hive for a period of time taking into consideration the likelihood that AHB could be present in your area.

[soupcan]

My thoughts also as to who conducted the tests to confirm the AHB??
And how is it that package bees can not or could not have a queen mated with AHB drones?

[SmokeEater2]

Over the years I've bought Nuc's and packages and I'm convinced a Nuc is the way to go. (just my personal opinion of course) Most of the packages I've bought have suffered a lot during shipping and are weakened coming out of the gate and have a lot to overcome just to get ready for winter.

However, I purchased a package of Carni's from CF Kohnen (sp?) and they are one of the best hives I've ever had. They built up the first year into a booming 2 deep colony and brought in plenty of stores for themselves and a little for me too. They are doing great this spring too and I'm planning a split of that hive soon.

I think one of the best bee deals is to contact the local bee keeping club. There is almost always someone in the group that sells Nucs and you get bees accustomed to your area and ready to work.

[westernbeekeeper]

Nucs are great because of fast buildup, and the good possibility of surplus honey the first year. The con(s): Possible harboring of diseases/mites, and can be a bit more expensive than a package.
Packages are great too. No brood, so little to no mites, and the likelyhood of disease is almost nothing. Lower prices than nucs most times. Con(s): Slower build up, and having to introduce the queen to these "strange" bees.

[Risky Beesness]

All I can say is, in my two years, the hives started from nucs and splits have prospered, and the ones started from packages have dwindled. That's just my experience.

[EastSideBuzz]

Thank you for saying it. I enjoyed this post. Did not know much about NUC's. I started with packages and just did some splits into NUC's. Did not really know you could buy them. Not sure if I would still. But, thanks for the info on it.

Wow this thread is back to life. I only buy Nuc's now. 3 years can change a man's opinion. I bought 100 last year and will buy another 100 this year.

[squarepeg]

i sold one nuc this year. it was a seven framer with extra comb for $125.

i will only sell nucs, and they will have to be booming.