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  1. #21
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    Mar 2008
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    Ennis, TX USA
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zane View Post
    Thx DF I will start using the stronger recipe now.
    Add 8-12 drops of thyme oil to that formula too.
    Chuck Norris once roundhouse kicked Hulk in the face. Now he hides in the forest and changed his name to Shrek

  2. #22
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    Jun 2002
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    parker county, tx
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    Quote Originally Posted by Derek View Post
    Add 8-12 drops of thyme oil to that formula too.
    The only thing about thyme that makes me a little wary is that is reportedly makes the bees more irritable and agressive, but lots of people use thymol, so I suppose it doesn't matter if you don't mind putting up with it. My bees are irritable regardless.
    So many weeds.......so little time.

  3. #23
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    Mar 2008
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    Ennis, TX USA
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    I have read that about the thyme oil too. I have mixed it by itself before. I can understand why it would make them irritable. But, when I mix it with the other 2, I can’t even hardly smell the thyme oil. And I have not noticed any attitude difference when I mix all 3 together.
    Chuck Norris once roundhouse kicked Hulk in the face. Now he hides in the forest and changed his name to Shrek

  4. #24
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    May 2008
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    Snowmass, Colorado, USA
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    I am a big fan of thymol in my feeds, both the patties and syrup. As Derek pointed out with the lemongrass and spearmint oils added you can hardly notice the thymol in the mixes.

    Since starting to use my mixes, in a year now, my hives are now mite free and very healthy. Just coming back from Calf. I expected to see a heavy mite infestation like others getting theirs and was surprised to find none. Additionally, no nosema either. One year is not a long time for a study and I am still working out the exact measurements for my feeds, but so far the results have been better and more productive then I could have hoped.

    I have both a pattie and a syrup feed if anyone is interested let me know.
    Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid.” John Wayne

  5. #25
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    Dec 2007
    Location
    LA Co, Calif, USA
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    alpha6 - I'm interested in both patty and syrup mixture. Thanks.

  6. #26
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    Dec 2007
    Location
    Hughson, CA
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    155

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    alpha6 - I'm interested in both patty and syrup mixture. Thanks.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    souris, manitoba, canada
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    744

    Default alpha6

    how much thymol are you putting in your syrup,crystals or oil?

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Central Point, Oregon
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    76

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    Here is another one, alpha6, who would be interested in the recipe.

    Thank you.

    Larry

  9. #29
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Snowmass, Colorado, USA
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    Sorry for the delay. Below are posted my recipes. Irwin, I use oil and not crystals. It is easier for me. I also recommend using an eye dropper instead of just trying to flick out drops from the bottles. The patties are meant as a feed primarily and a treatment second. From the lack of mites in my hives after returning from Calf. where they should have been infested or at least some sign of them my theory is as follows. Thymol is deadly on contact to mites. I suspect that as the bees stored the patties in the comb as they were packing out the combs for winter feed storage, as mites moved across the comb and contacted the thymol they died. So by having it in the comb it basicly made the comb a mine field for the mites and they died out. That coupled with any that was fed to the larvae would also contact the mites and kill them in this manner.

    The liquid feed is meant as a strong treatment for spring or if you are infested with mites and/or your bees have nosema. It will treat both in my experience. You can also use the liquid as a mist over your frames for a quick knock down of mites. The formula is strong, but it has been used effectively by myself with no bee kill.

    Alpha6 Feed Recipes

    Patties – 5 gallon bucket mixture
    2 Cups of Yeast
    7 lbs of Sugar
    8 drops of thyme
    15 drops lemongrass
    15 drops spearmint

    Measure out the brewer’s yeast into a large container. Add your essential oils as measured above. I recommend using an eye dropper for precise measurements. Pour liquid brewer’s yeast into 5 gallon bucket. Add sugar slowly with mixing with an electric drill equipped with a “mud” paddle. Mix until the consistency is that of a thick mushy mashed potatoes. Add sugar or small amount of yeast to get consistency right. In feeding lots of hives I find you can then pour/spoon this mixture out of the 5 gallon mixing bucket into one used for feeding and then continue to mix a new batch in your mixing bucket. If you try and mix too much, you will burn out your drill which is why I recommend mixing in the above measurements.

    Patties – Cement Mixer

    2 Quarts of yeast
    30 lbs of sugar
    32 drops of thyme
    60 drops of lemongrass
    60 drops of spearmint
    In a large mixing bowl measure out 2 quarts of liquid brewer’s yeast and then add your essential oils. In a clean cement mixer pour the yeast/EO mixture. Turn on the mixture and begin to add the sugar. Continue to mix until well mixed and with a consistency of thick mushy mashed potatoes.

    Liquid Feed –

    1 Quart of Water
    1 Quart of Sugar
    16 drops of thyme oil
    30 drops of lemongrass oil
    30 drops of spearmint oil
    2 teaspoons of Soy Lecithin Granules

    In a mixing bowl or similar item add one quart of hot but not boiling water. Mix in 2 teaspoons of Lecithin granules. Mix with a beater or till all of the granules are dissolved. Add your thyme, lemongrass and spearmint oils and again mix with the beater. Measure out one quart of sugar and pour it in your hot water/oil mix and stir well.
    I mix this up two quarts at a time and double the amounts. I then pour it in a 5 gallon bucket and repeat until I have four gallons of liquid feed in the 5 gallon bucket. (At this point you will have mixed 2 gallons of water to 2 gallons of sugar) I then use a “mud” mixer on an electric drill and mix it all very well in the 5 gallon bucket. Put a lid on and it’s ready to go out to your hives. I have a bucket with a small spigot on it that I pour the contents into in the field and then I can control filling my feeders. You can also dip, but if your bees are out they will find it (and you).
    Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid.” John Wayne

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Hughson, CA
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    155

    Default liquid brewer’s yeast?

    "liquid brewer’s yeast"

    You have lost me. Are you using spent yeast from a brewery? In your cement mixer formula, how many total pounds of patties mix do you get? I think if I get this number I can reformulate the recipe. Thanks for your help! I appreciate the info.

  11. #31
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    May 2008
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    Snowmass, Colorado, USA
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    Matt. Yes I get my brewers yeast from a local pub. You have to de-activate the yeast, so if you go this route give me a call. You can also use dry brewers yeast and add water but since I have a good source of "wet" brewers yeast I have yet to try it, though I suspect the liquid measurements would be between two and three quarts, adding the water once all the dry mix is is mixed really well.

    I haven't measured the weight of the finished product, but I can usually get around 60 patties from the mix. I figure my cost per pattie to be around .36 ea.
    Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid.” John Wayne

  12. #32
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    Dec 2007
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    Hughson, CA
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    155

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    Quote Originally Posted by alpha6 View Post
    I haven't measured the weight of the finished product, but I can usually get around 60 patties from the mix.
    Each patty is about a pound?

  13. #33
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    May 2008
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    Snowmass, Colorado, USA
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    Probably right around it. I haven't weighed it out. I usually just dish it out with one of those big army serving spoons out of the 5 gallon buckets onto the top bars, but I figure its around a pound. I can tell you this it is more then those girlie Calf. patties I pulled out of my hives.

    The next time I make them up (this weekend) I will take pics and post them on my flicker account.
    Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid.” John Wayne

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Arundel, Maine USA
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    Alpha6

    thanks for your recipes! I only have 4 hives to work with so I don't think I need such a big recipe, but I'll figure out the numbers to make it more manageable.

    As far as using the brewers yeast, I'll probably get the dry. How much water do I add to it to make it liquid?

    Also, do you have problems with the Essentials oils not mixing well with the liquid brewers yeast? I would think you'd need to use the lecethin in the patty recipe as well as the syrup recipe?

    Thanks!
    Let's BEE friends

  15. #35
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    chilliwack, bc
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    626

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    After reading the research results from the WVU on mite control with EO's, I noticed the date, that from the time that had been updated in 1996, that it wasn't long after that when I had started using EO's in my hives (1998). I first hear about Anise oil being used as an appetite stimulant in pollen substitute patties, so tried this and the results were pretty good. for several years before we used anise oil the bees would take the patties down rather slowly (1lb every 1 1/2 - 2 weeks) but with the anise oil added they would consume it with in the week.

    During this time I was already studying EO's as alternative health care and learning about the properties of the various EO's and at some point it dawned on me that I might be able to use some of these oils to control mites. Some of my own conclusions at the time, are overwelmingly similar to that concluded by WVU.

    I have administered EO's in almost any way that you could administer them to a hive but have come to use a sugar syrup spray and a feed consisting of pollen dissolved in syrup for adminstering EO's to my hives. I have used Neem, tea tree, cedar, patcholi, lemon, lemon grass, spearmint, peppermint, rosemary, eucalyptus, winter green, thyme, anise, and fennel oils, by them selves or in different combinations for the treatment that was appropriate at the time.

    Tea tree is anti fungal, anti septic, and anti bacteriac. I have found that this oil works good at bringing chalk brood level down in a hive to point that the bees can manage and finally recover from.

    Neem was siad to be effective against 250 different kind of mites and though there has been incoclusive research done on this in regards as a mite control I still feel that, if administered the right way, is still effective against the mites.

    I use peppermint, rosemary, eucalyptus, and winter green together in a sugar spray in the spring and in the fall and has been a staple treatment for my hives for the last 10 years.

    I have for the last 2 years been using spearmint, lemon grass, and thyme oil as my own type of version of HBH. what i like about adding this to syrup is that not only does it act like a stimulant on their appatite, but will also ack as a preserative should the bees not eat it fast enough, I've had suryp stay good for two months in weaker colonies using this.

    For my spray I use a 1:1 suryp in a 5 gallon pail, 2 pounds OF MY OWN TRUSTED HONEY as an emulsifier, and no more then 2 ounces of EO's total unless Neem oil is used, it seems that only 1 ounce of neem ever wants to become a part of the solution even with an emulsifier though i have not tried anything other then honey.

    I've used the grease patties for quite some years but noticed that unless they are used before sept (at least around these parts) that the bees seem to ignore it so it remains through the winter and seem to do more harm then good. I've noticed high incedents of nosema among hives that had a remainder of the patty in their hive still by spring. do not add neem oil to the patties and save yourself the grief, the bees just don't want anything to do with it.

    I have been using a solution of honey, pollen, syrup mix for the past 4 years which seems to make sense, my recipe has been a 2 liter scoop of pollen disolved in 4 liters of hot water, 2 liters of honey mixed with 2 liters of hot water, I then combine the 2 mixs and add 15 kilos of sugar at which point you add the EO's, I usually would add a drop for every kilo so for this recipe I add 30 drops. using a 30 kilo pail and once everything above is mixed I top it off with warm water and mix. This mix stimulates the brood food glands and and besides getting the EO's to where they will be most effective it also provides high nutrition to the bees almost immediatly. the 30 kilo solution treats roughly 100 hives with 250ML dose which I use on hives with 5 frames of bees to a full super of bees. double hives full of bees through out can be given a liter.

    These have been my own findings and methods I use but it still is just another part of my IPM. I still continue to use formic and oxalic acid in my hives along with bees that are hybrids of carni-russian-vsh. If you do decide to try the above, do so on your own volition and I will not be held responsible for any successes or failures.
    Will Gruenwald Chilliwack BC

  16. #36
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Rhineland-Palatinate, Germany
    Posts
    821

    Wink

    When you have your breakfast I bet there is a laxative, an aspirin, a sleeping and a painkiller pill in your coffee.

  17. #37
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Shawnee, Kansas
    Posts
    81

    Default Syrup

    Quote Originally Posted by alpha6 View Post
    I then pour it in a 5 gallon bucket and repeat until I have four gallons of liquid feed in the 5 gallon bucket. (At this point you will have mixed 2 gallons of water to 2 gallons of sugar) I then use a “mud” mixer on an electric drill and mix it all very well in the 5 gallon bucket. Put a lid on and it’s ready to go out to your hives. I have a bucket with a small spigot on it that I pour the contents into in the field and then I can control filling my feeders. You can also dip, but if your bees are out they will find it (and you).
    alpha- Thanks for taking time to post your recipes. My concern with the syrup recipe is it seems to make a minimal amount for commercial requirements. How much of the syrup mixture do you feed each hive? At a gallon/hive you would be spending a lot of time at the stove.

  18. #38
    Join Date
    May 2005
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    chilliwack, bc
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    626

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    wanted to delet this post but no delet button.

  19. #39
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    Dec 2008
    Location
    Troy, Illinois, Madison County
    Posts
    98

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    Alpha i was wondering where this was thanks for posting!

  20. #40
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    May 2008
    Location
    Snowmass, Colorado, USA
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    Quote Originally Posted by KSbee View Post
    alpha- Thanks for taking time to post your recipes. My concern with the syrup recipe is it seems to make a minimal amount for commercial requirements. How much of the syrup mixture do you feed each hive? At a gallon/hive you would be spending a lot of time at the stove.
    I feed a quart in the spring and one in the fall. I feed 1:1 to my nucs in the spring but without the thyme in it, as much as they will take till they get built up. With the liquid you won't need to spend anytime at the stove. The hot water from your tap should be hot enough to dissolve the sugar fine.
    Life is tough, but it's tougher when you're stupid.” John Wayne

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