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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Reno, NV USA
    Posts
    2,310

    Default Causality - CCD?

    After IAPV was found to be correlated with CCD, researchers indicated the need to infect bees with IAPV to show a causal relationship. Does anyone know the status of this work? Has anyone infected with Nosema Cerana to show causality?

    I understand that it is much more complicated than it appears on the surface, but I would be interested in any kind of progress report.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Manitoba Canada
    Posts
    6,191

    Default

    I second that post!
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    New York City
    Posts
    3,401

    Default

    IAPV was quickly found to not be anywhere near as "correlated" with CCD
    as was claimed in the paper published in Science. You can read about it
    here:
    http://bee-quick.com/reprints/claims_collapse.pdf

    Needless to say, I had to bite my tounge so as to avoid saying
    "I told you so", even though I had, and in detail:
    http://bee-quick.com/reprints/fourth.pdf


    The Evans/Chen paper itself can be read in full here:
    http://www.dadant.com/documents/ChenandEvansarticlefromDec07ABJ.pdf


    Note well that the initial claims were made in the very prestigious journal
    "Science", while the retraction was published in the "American Bee Journal",
    and there has yet to be any admission that this was a retraction, a
    complete refutation of the claims made in "Science".

    Whole lotta hand-waving goin' on, dontcha know.

    So, infecting bees with IAPV alone appears to be a non-goal, as the current
    consensus, based upon a much wider set of samples, is that CCD colonies
    are found to simultaneously have all of the following:
    1. Nosema apis
    2. Nosema ceranae
    3. Kashmir Bee Virus
    4. IAPV of one variant or another
    Just to confuse matters further, researchers in Spain are saying that
    they can reproduce all the symptoms of CCD with nothing more than
    Nosema ceranae.

    Just in case someone wants to argue about this, please understand
    that none of the above is my opinion. It is the current consensus.

    What do I make of all this? Well, I'm going to wait for Joe DeRisi of UCSF
    to write up what he recently found. If you go back to the paper in Science,
    you will find that what he said a year ago was ignored and then
    ridiculed. I hope he is not again ignored, as I feel we ignore people like
    Joe and Evan Skowronski (who runs one of the labs at Aberdeen Proving
    Ground) at our peril. They have no need to seek "fame and fortune",
    as they are already well-funded, famous in their fields, and happy.
    They don't want "bee research money", as they have budgets, staff,
    and resources sufficient to approach CCD as an "interesting problem".

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Reno, NV USA
    Posts
    2,310

    Default

    Thanks Jim for your post - I will follow your links.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Windham, Maine
    Posts
    75

    Default cell phones

    pardon my ignorance. I'm new to this but last year I've heard a report from England claiming that cellular signals to be the cause of CCD. Was that proven false?

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
    Posts
    46,297

    Default

    Actually the problem is cell phones. You should never let the bees have them. They get distracted talking and never get any work done.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Windham, Maine
    Posts
    75

    Default You're right

    Imagine the calling plan you'd need to have.


    Here is the article I was referring to:
    http://www.independent.co.uk/environ...es-444768.html

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jan 2001
    Location
    New York City
    Posts
    3,401

    Default

    > 'm new to this but last year I've heard a report from England
    > claiming that cellular signals to be the cause of CCD.
    > Was that proven false?

    Yes. Completely false.

    Here's the original scare story:
    http://www.independent.co.uk/environ...es-444768.html

    Here's one of many debunkings of the scare story:
    http://www.spiegel.de/international/...477804,00.html

    So, there is no problem with bees near cellphone towers, beekeepers with
    cellphones and so on.

    Mike's concerns are also mostly baseless, as they really don't have much
    to say to each other, and as they are all bothers and sisters, all their
    minutes are covered by one family plan.

    The whole idea was a joke anyway, as most beeyards are beyond the
    range of cellphone signals, as beekeepers grumble.

    Strange. Back in the 1990s, I was the only beekeeper who went outside
    at breaks to check my voicemail on my cellphone. Everyone else was
    coming outside for a smoke. As time went on, more beekeepers got
    cellphones, and despite a complete lack of any line for any payphones
    at any prior meetings, suddenly everyone had calls to make during
    breaks.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Davis,South Dakota,USA
    Posts
    401

    Default honeymooners

    To the moon Alice

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Manitoba Canada
    Posts
    6,191

    Default

    >>as most beeyards are beyond the
    range of cellphone signals, as beekeepers grumble.


    Ha, no doubt!
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Merrimac, Massachusetts, USA
    Posts
    65

    Big Grin

    Quote Originally Posted by Medovina View Post
    Imagine the calling plan you'd need to have.
    I've got you in my 50,000.
    Tai
    ECBA Essex County Beekeeping Association #;~)

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