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Thread: 1rst Round

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Terrell, Texas, USA
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    281

    Default Magnifier Glasses

    Tecumseh, Fly fisherman are notoriously old and can't see. There are a lot of aids to both fly tying and tying a fly on the line that can be had at a good fly fishing store. Orvis comes to mind, but they are expensive. Bass Pro Shops has a goose neck 4x magnifier for about $20. They also have "natural light" lamps that illuminate with cool light. These are more expensive...about $80. Fly shops also have mag glasses and even little magnifying discs that stick on real glasses in power from 1.5 to 4.0.

    Happy grafting,

    Tom

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Boone County, West Virginia, USA
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    908

    Default

    Well the grafts didn't take at all. The bees decided to remove the larvae and polish the cups. I'm not giving up so I'll be trying again in a few day.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Knoxville, Tennessee,USA
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    207

    Default

    I must be the exception to the old flyfisherman/fly-tyer who can't see rule. I am 17 years old and have 20/10 vision. I utilize my flytying aids when grafting. I think I like natural cells that the bees draw this time of the year to put in queen rearing nucs.

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    St. Albans, Vermont
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    5,596

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by berkshire bee View Post
    Michael, We're still hoping to get you down to tell us about your queen rearing methods. Another alternative might be a few of us coming up and giving you a days work in exchange for some OJT. berkshire
    Am I still on for the 19th? Wasn't that the plan?

    As far as coming up for OJT, what did you want to see. The schedule is an 8 day rotation. Something different each day. Cell builder set up day, grafting day, queen catching day(s), cell spreading. Most time probably spent catching queens.

    Better let me know if there has been a change in plans for the 19th.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    berkshire county MA
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    1,472

    Default

    Michael, I wasn't sure if you were definite, but yes we are on for the 19th. I PM'd you just to see what time and what you need for a setup. We'll fill in the other details from there.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Boone County, West Virginia, USA
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    908

    Default

    I tried again today. Tell me if this larva is the right age.

    http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u.../100_02711.jpg

    I have desk mounted a magnifying lens with a light but it got in the way. All the larvae I transferred were about this size. I split a colony and the queenless half started drawing queen cells so I harvested the royal jelly to prime my cups with. I ended up with 1cc of jelly and used almost all of it priming 27 cups. I used my grafting tool to get the larvae out of the queen cells so they would not be pulled into the syringe with the jelly.

    http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...1/100_0258.jpg

    I hope it goes better this time seeing how my last attempt was a dismal failure.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Troupsburg, NY
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    4,072

    Default

    Well, there're better, but I think your still alittle too big. These might take though. You want to find the ones that haven't formed a C shape yet, they can have some curl to'em, but not into the full C shape.
    "I reject your reality, and substitute my own." Adam Savage

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Seattle, Washington State
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    4,398

    Default

    They say that if you can see them, they are too big!
    Chef Isaac..Culinary Arts and Honey are a sweet mix! http://www.sweetascanbeehoneyfarm.com & http://www.adoptahive.info

  9. #29
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    Mar 2005
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    Troupsburg, NY
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    "They say that if you can see them, they are too big!"

    Then I guess you would need to be blind to graft. Blanket statements like that give people the wrong impression. I know guys who couldn't see 5 day old larva, so I guess they could say they were good for grafting?
    "I reject your reality, and substitute my own." Adam Savage

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Boone County, West Virginia, USA
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    Default

    I had to hold the end of my grafting tool under the magnifying lens to make sure that I had them on the tool. After I put them in the queen cups I could barely see them. I was trying to follow tecumseh's advice about dividing the cell into sixths and made sure that none of the larvae were bigger than this. That magnifying lens was very difficult to work with. I guess I'll be ordering some of those glasses I found.
    http://www.tasco-safety.com/sglasses...y-glasses.html

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
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    Troupsburg, NY
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    Default

    "That magnifying lens was very difficult to work with."

    I bought one at a yard sale, couldn't use it either. Found out I had too many left hands.
    "I reject your reality, and substitute my own." Adam Savage

  12. #32
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    Jun 2007
    Location
    Boone County, West Virginia, USA
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    Default

    Let me ask a question. Seeing how the small larvae I transferred were still in royal jelly, why would they be inferior if there is never an interruption of them feeding on royal jelly? Is the type of jelly fed to newly hatched larvae which is to be worker bees different than what is fed to newly hatched larvae that the bees plan on making into a queen?

  13. #33
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    Mar 2005
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    Troupsburg, NY
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    "Is the type of jelly fed to newly hatched larvae which is to be worker bees different than what is fed to newly hatched larvae that the bees plan on making into a queen?"

    That's pretty much it in a nutshell. The nurse bees will remove most of the RJ that you transfer with the larva, and replace it with RJ that has a much higher protien rate. I also don't prime my cups, as I find it doesn't make alot of differance on acceptance rate. Ditto for having the cells polished by the girls before grafting.
    "I reject your reality, and substitute my own." Adam Savage

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Hanford Ca
    Posts
    146

    Default

    It looks better and I would think they would take if you took them out of queen cells already. Here is keeping my fingers crossed for you this time.

    Angi

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Santa Rosa, California
    Posts
    86

    Default Don't use honey!

    Honey is not to be used. Priming the cell with royal jelly is the only way to do the job of grafting larve. Use older larver cells to get the jelly from. Remove the older larve for access to your sorce. Just a small amount is needed in each "Q" cell. Wet only the very bottom of the cell so the grafted larve will stick in the cell when the bar of cells is put back in a Queenless starter/finisher hive and fed with a feeder frame from the top super,not from a entrance feeder which will cause robbing when there is not a honey flow going on.


    Quote Originally Posted by WVbeekeeper View Post
    I put together a cell starter the other day and grafted some larvae for the first time ever today. I started going cross eyed by the time I was finishing transferring larvae to cell cups. Hopefully I'll get a few queens out of the deal to start some nucs with in a few weeks.

    Larva on the end of the grafting tool.

    http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...e/IMG_2773.jpg

    Transferring larva to a cell cup.

    http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...e/IMG_2774.jpg

    Cell cups primed with a little honey, didn't have any royal jelly, and each contains a larva. I used the smallest larvae I could find.

    http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...e/IMG_2778.jpg

    Here's the frame from which I found larvae of appropriate age.

    http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u...e/IMG_2775.jpg

    I was looking through the colonies today and have plenty of drones. If the cells don't take I'll try again here in a few days. I'm kinda scared I used too much honey to prime the cell cups. It seemed like I only put in a very small amount with the syringe but when I floated the larvae of the grating tool it seemed like a lot more was in the cups than there should have been. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

  16. #36
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
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    Boone County, West Virginia, USA
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    Default

    I primed all the cells yesterday with royal jelly before transferring the larvae. I checked the cell starter today and all 27 cell cups are being drawn out. I'll take a picture when they get the job done. I can't wait to start making some nucs.

  17. #37
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    Jun 2007
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    Boone County, West Virginia, USA
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Angi_H View Post
    It looks better and I would think they would take if you took them out of queen cells already. Here is keeping my fingers crossed for you this time.

    Angi
    I harvested some royal jelly yesterday to prime my cell cups with. I made a half a colony, a deep hive body full of brood, queenless Friday and went into it yesterday to get the jelly. I didn't want to use this colony to breed from because it is too aggressive. I removed the larva from the would be queen cells and discarded them to get the jelly without sucking the larvae into the syringe as well. The larvae I grafted was from a feral queen I got last year. They are gentle, produced good, overwintered well, passed a hygienic test late last summer, and are currently raising a lot of brood. If I get this batch of cells off without any difficulty I'll definitely be hooked.

  18. #38
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    Mar 2005
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    Troupsburg, NY
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by WVbeekeeper View Post
    I primed all the cells yesterday with royal jelly before transferring the larvae. I checked the cell starter today and all 27 cell cups are being drawn out. I'll take a picture when they get the job done. I can't wait to start making some nucs.

    Don't make your nucs based on the number started. Wait til there're capped and then make your nucs up.
    "I reject your reality, and substitute my own." Adam Savage

  19. #39
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Santa Rosa, California
    Posts
    86

    Default Making up nucs

    Quote Originally Posted by WVbeekeeper View Post
    I primed all the cells yesterday with royal jelly before transferring the larvae. I checked the cell starter today and all 27 cell cups are being drawn out. I'll take a picture when they get the job done. I can't wait to start making some nucs.
    Cass....

    I would not make up the nuc till just before the new Queens are going to emerge. The easy way to tell this is when the bees in the finishing hive start to remove some of the wax from around the bottom of the cells. If your new nucs are made up too soon, they may draw their own Queen cells and will also destroy your new Queen cell when you add it to this nuc.

    Lee.

  20. #40
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Boone County, West Virginia, USA
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    908

    Default

    I bought a few nursery frames in which the queen cells can emerge. I also have some of those plastic queen intro cages I was planning on using. I know it would be easier to add the queen cells to a nuc but would it be better than giving them a queen which has already emerged which they have to release from the cage?

    >The easy way to tell this is when the bees in the finishing hive start to remove some of the wax from around the bottom of the cells.

    I checked out "The Complete Guide to Beekeeping" by Roger Morse and have been reading it. It had some pictures of queen cells with some of the wax removed at the tip so I know exactly what you are talking about.

    I may not be around when the queens emerge so they will most likely end up in the nursery frame. If my thinking is correct they would only be in the nursery frames for one or two days before I get back to take care of them. If I use the queen cells to make the nucs I'll have to do it next Sunday, otherwise it will be the following Friday or Saturday with queens which have emerged.

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