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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    Tip of the Thumb, Michigan
    Posts
    676

    Default

    I've also heard that European honey bees prefer the 10 gallon swarm trap over the 3 gallon swarm traps that Dadant and others sell. And with the proper sized swarm trap AND with a swarm lure, it seems that you can't lose, right? (Yeah, right...)

    Seriously, I've read before that while smaller traps *can* be used, more success with European bees can be had with larger traps. (African bees, on the other hand, preferred the SMALLER traps of approximately 3 gallon size.)

    It should also be noted, the ideal height of the traps seem to be between 10' and 12' feet.

    So...

    12' feet up, 10 gallon trap AND swarm lure? It seems IMPOSSIBLE to lose a swarm to the trees, right? (Again, yeah, right...)


    This year, unless I just happen across some 10 gallon peat pots, I'm just going to use cardboard nucs, placed 10' feet up in a tree, with swarm lure, about 50' feet away from my most "swarmy" hives.

    Unless anyone has a better idea, wish me luck!

    DS

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Jackson, MO
    Posts
    1,858

    Default

    Justin O. Schmidt (I think that's how you spell his name=I'm just to lazy at the moment to double check it) developed a lot of the "technology" that we use today for swarm trapping. He did a lot of research into trapping swarms, particularly AHB.

    One thing I distinctly remember is that AHB prefer smaller cavities, which if you are trapping at the ports of entry, smaller traps are a good thing. Here in SE Missouri, not such a good thing. He said AHB like traps in the 5 gallon range.

    He was also quite found of traps measuring 31 liters (yeah, those government types love the metric system). If a liter, by volume, is equal to 1.057 quarts, then 31 liters is equal to 8.19 gallons. That's pretty close to 10 gallons.

    Compared to nucs, mediums and deeps, my six-frame nuc/swarm trap comes in at 5.68 gallons. Maybe I need bigger traps. A medium super is 6.51 gallons and a deep/brood box is 9.46 gallons.

    Still, I seem to do pretty good catching feral swarms with my nuc boxes baited with pheromone lures. I've tried the 5-frame MDA "splitter" boxes made of waxed cardboard. They caught swarms, but the cluster could not fit into the whole box.

    Try getting one of those babies home in the back of your van!

    Grant
    Jackson, MO http://www.MakingPlasticFramesWork.homestead.com
    Beekeeping With Twenty-five Hives: https://www.createspace.com/4152725

  3. #23
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Pickens, SC, USA
    Posts
    233

    Default

    Okay, how do you guys get these things up in the tree, attach them there and then get them back down ?

    You discussed height 10-12' and one person metioned about 50' from the hives. I would like to hear more about successful trapping.


    charlotte

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Chittenango,Ny (upstate)
    Posts
    309

    Default

    I try to catch feral swarms,so my traps are spread far apart. Sometimes miles apart. I try to use deer hunting stands if possible. Also easy to get into trees that I can bungee a trap in. It hasn't been that hard to find good places. The edges of fields, hedgerows or pastures work well.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    North Bend, OH, USA
    Posts
    272

    Default

    Which would be considered better? Lemongrass extract or pheromones?

    I have a couple vials of pheromone. Can you use both or does it get silly redundant?
    Richard
    Carriage House Farm, North Bend, Ohio

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Windsor,NC,USA
    Posts
    285

    Default

    So , a deep brood chamber, or CLOSE to that size, up about 10-15 feet is a great choice( avoided the word "best"). Lemmongrass oil is a GOOD attractant(avoided it again).

    Now, what is a preferred or good way to deploy the oil?
    I have read above that just a dab on the top bars and I have read elsewhere about using cotton balls inside a ziplock baggie with a few holes punched in.

    What is the average time before you need to reapply the oil?

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
    Posts
    46,142

    Default

    >what is a preferred or good way to deploy the oil?

    I put a few drops on the top bars in the bait hive.

    >What is the average time before you need to reapply the oil?

    Once a month would probably be wise. I do it once a year.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Chittenango,Ny (upstate)
    Posts
    309

    Default

    I have used both lemongrass oil and pheromone lure and both worked equally well. The lemongrass was much cheaper. Now I only use lemongrass. I use an eyedropper and drop it on the topbars and add another drop or two each week. It sounds like I don't need to use that much but it's cheap and the bees like it.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    mineral county,Montana USA
    Posts
    805

    Default

    i hope to keep my few hives from swarming this season,and i dont think we have many feral honey bees in this part of the world(i know quite a few loggers who all say they have found one or two hives in the last 15 to 20 years,and i only know of one feral hive in an old cottonwood)so i dont think i would be catching ferals,on the other hand a couple large bee keepers have 20 hive outyards on a couple ranches close by,i dont think they practice alot of swarm control so....would i be out of line to place swarm traps in these areas around mid july?i think they would be ticked if they saw me,but these swarms would be lost anyway.i know landowners close by.it must be winter and i am thinking out loud.

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Jackson, MO
    Posts
    1,858

    Default

    It was asked how you get them up to 8' to 10'

    I walk the fence rows of property where I have permission to post traps. I use an aluminum extension ladder and find a tree with a clear spot. Some people think a fork in the tree is attractive to the bee, I just find a spot I can get the ladder stable and a clear spot on the tree.

    I pound a 6" spike into tree (my apologies to those who think this is horrible). I can get these nails at my local hardware store in the section where they sell bulk nails. They run about 60 cents a piece.

    My swarm traps are wood nuc boxes with a 1x4" strip on the edge. It has a hole in the top of this strip that fits over the nail. Good physical strength, coordination and balance are required to get the trap up and down. I have set traps in ravines at shoulder heighth when a ladder was not stable due to the slope of the ground. They've caught swarms as well.

    For a very poorly, amateurish web site, click here: http://www.feralhoneybees.homestead.com

    The site still needs to be finished. Maybe some day when I have time (yeah, ha, ha, ha!)

    Grant
    Jackson, MO http://www.makingplasticframeswork.homestead.com
    Beekeeping With Twenty-five Hives: https://www.createspace.com/4152725

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Dane County, WI.
    Posts
    3,721

    Default

    Grant? It looks from most of your pictures that your wood traps are constructed of 1 inch boards at least. Can a person use 1/4 inch plywood that is reinforced with some 1 by 2's along the [some of] the edges before putting it together? This would reduce the weight. The bees can't or don't measure the thickness of the wood; can they? I mean for around here, WI., where it would get too cold [ like NOW! at 0 degrees F.] I would think in the winter for the bees to survive in a 1/4 inch box? Also, are all your traps with a bottom entrance? Have you ever used a top entrance? Another question; regarding those "flower pot" traps that are offered at bee supply places. Could a person put 2 of them together for more space etc.?
    Last edited by Oldbee; 01-19-2008 at 12:41 PM. Reason: addition

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Hampton, VA, USA
    Posts
    175

    Default nice site. great ideas...

    Grant,

    Nice site you got there. I liked the swarm traps. That was just what I was looking for.

    Thanks to everyone for the information posted on this thread. Very informative.

    Andy

  13. #33
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Ballard County, KY
    Posts
    348

    Default Great website

    Grant, nice website on trapping swarms.

    I used the carboard box method last year and was VERY skeptical but actually caught a swarm. I'm sold and plan to put out a bunch this next year.

    Tim

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Hampton, VA, USA
    Posts
    175

    Default Swarm traps

    Does color play any part in this. Light colors vs. dark colors. White or off white? How about camo? I've figured out the trap configuration and I'm finishing them now to hang them up next week.

    Andy

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Chittenango,Ny (upstate)
    Posts
    309

    Default

    I have traps that are painted white and traps that are natural wood color (plywood). Both seem to work equally well. If I make more I won't bother painting them. Unpainted ones blend into the surroundings better and that may be important in some areas.

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