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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
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    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
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    26,761

    Default Diesel fumes and CCD

    On Bee-L, Bob Harrison asks if the new diesel fuel formulation might be causing truck loads of bees to die? He and another beekeeper noticed that often there were truck loads of colonies that died after the bees were loaded onto semis and then left to sit at truck stops for hours. So he is asking if anyone has looked into the fumes as a poison to the bees.
    Mark Berninghausen "That which works, persists."

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
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    FRASER VALLEY, BRITISH COLUMBIA
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    1,307

    Default Diesel

    How are the diesel formulations different? When were these changes made. I know of low sulfur diesel but that has been on the market for at least 10 years that I know of. If there are other newer formulations how long have they been on the market/

    Jean-Marc

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Phelps Co. Missouri USA
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    856

    Default

    The low sulpher formula was changed or made mandatory last year,or the year before, I believe { thank California } it increased the price of diesel fuel about 25 - 35 cents a gal.

    They claim it increased the cost of production for the oil companies that much
    :mad: :mad:

    PCM

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Central CA.
    Posts
    489

    Default

    PCM
    It was a fed thing Ca was one of then first states to mandate l s fuel, so we have been paying the higher price longer.
    Jim

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Loganville, GA
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    2,172

    Default

    I'm just rambling here, I by no means know anything about fuels other than they burn and there are a plithera of additives put into all the fuels today. I certainly wouldn't discount the possibility that what you guys are talking about could be true. Whether it's the answer to ccd or not I wouldn't touch.

    If you remember, folks used to take a teaspoon of kerosene to get rid of worms back in the day when worms were common place amongst folks. Now days they say it would kill you or at least send you on a trip to the hospital to ingest the stuff because of all the garbage they put in it now.
    "Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts." Winston Churchill

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
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    Phelps Co. Missouri USA
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    856

    Default

    Bizzybee;

    You sure that wasn't " Cole Oil or Coal Oil " old name for Kerosene
    It was also good for getting rid of lice after working in the tobbaco sheds all day !

    I'm from Ky. and showing my age !

    PCM

  7. #7

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Bizzybee View Post
    Now days they say it would kill you or at least send you on a trip to the hospital to ingest the stuff because of all the garbage they put in it now.
    The stuff (kerosene) I get now is dyed red. You're right, if I would ever have thought about consuming it I wouldn't even consider it now.
    Dan www.boogerhillbee.com
    Experience is a hard teacher because she gives the test first, the lesson afterwards

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    College Station, Texas
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    6,973

    Default

    ever smoke bees with some paper or cloth contaminated with oil?

    depending on how long a bee truck lingers at a truck stop, where every trucker just lets their rigs run, I could easily see where you could encounter problems. perhaps someone just needs to take shorter coffee breaks?

    beyond that....I have been told by folks that are suppose to know that you really don't want to know what might be in the crude oil that is used to refine gasoline and diesel fuels or what may or may not be taken out. according to one source... the deeper the formation the more like the crude is likely to contain certain heavy metal plus radioactive components.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Brookhaven, PA
    Posts
    49

    Default Fumes or no fumes

    When I saw my first extraction demo there was a discussion on whether to use something like bee-go or not. One guy said that he didn't like to introduce and chemicals or fumes into the honey, as he started up his gas blower to blow off the bees. I thought it was kind of funny.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Davis,South Dakota,USA
    Posts
    401

    Default smoking cell tower

    Bees loaded 3 and 4 high in the 70's and 80's with toxic flames and smoke coming out of stacks did not kill bees why now?Newer fuels and computers are making trucks burn cleanier.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    Erin, NY /Florence SC
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    3,361

    Default

    I've gotta say, I tow my trailer behind a 1993 1 ton Ford 7.3 diesel. I load my hives facing forward. They are covered with a bee net that on some trips is quite stained from the diesel exhaust which occurs pulling the Mtns. In Pa. headed south. I've never lost a hive on a trip either way or shortly after or seen any notable impact on the bees. Might be different with a tractor trailer. Never seen a stain on hive, seems the net deflects it pretty well.

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Davis,South Dakota,USA
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    401

    Default smoking specs again

    Gotta love searching for the stars.Just real embarassing to the whole industry,with the cell towers ,diesal fumes and electromagnetic fields.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
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    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
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    Default

    The original question about the diesel fuel fumes was in regards to the colonies being taken out of the snow, loaded on the semis and then the semis sat at the truck stop for two or three days. I don't know why they do that. So, it was wondered if the prolonged exposure to the fumes was causing some of the colonies to die.
    Mark Berninghausen "That which works, persists."

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
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    Davis,South Dakota,USA
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    Default

    Sorry sqkcrk,
    just a little misleading,sounds like speculation.For all of the thousands of beekeepers that migrate everywhere in the U.S. not all of those loads sat at truck stops for 2 or 3 days and the ones that did,are they all dead think not.

    To many rumors other than the source,is the problem with the industry.
    how many loads are we talking about low sulfur diesal just didn't appear last night.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Location
    College Station, Texas
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    Default

    sqkcrk writes:
    The original question about the diesel fuel fumes was in regards to the colonies being taken out of the snow, loaded on the semis and then the semis sat at the truck stop for two or three days.

    tecumseh replies:
    well now joel has suggested he has never lost any and I would guess he also doesn't set at a truck stop for 2 or 3 days either???

    I think the time may be the critical variable here in regards to the hives coming off alive. Now I never personally drove semi but we also thought (when driving large farm trucks) that time was the largest risk factor in moving honeybees considerable distance. now we never knew this absolutely, but I do directly recall the bee's owner dwelling on us to not spend too much time languishing about the country side.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    lewisberry, Pa, usa
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    6,080

    Default

    Whether I believe, whether I agree, and whether all the dots connect in some easily obvious manner, does not matter.

    I want speculation. I want thinking outside the box. I want off the wall conversations. You never know where discussions lead. You never know what may come out of it. Whenever something goes wrong, a think tank with discussions of many possibilities, and much speculation, can help steer thought processes, set motions on the right path, and produce benefits.

    Of course my own thoughts are that much of the problems in the bee industry may need a full length mirror to hold up in front of one's self. But many are missing the reflection, and trying to see whats behind the mirror, in an attempt to find those elusive boogie-men.
    Last edited by BjornBee; 01-12-2008 at 08:48 AM.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Location
    Davis,South Dakota,USA
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    401

    Default

    Im guessing the bees came out of the east somewhere.If there was snow on the ground when the girls were loaded,tropical weather would not appear in the east or midwest overnight in travel.[meaning extreme heat]and if this did happen the driver or drivers should have not stopped at any point during the day.Our drivers go out of their way to make sure the girls arrive safe and on time.Whether watering the girls down from heat,driving a few more hours because of daylight, or using tarps over the front of the loads to prevent freezing from the windchill.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Phelps Co. Missouri USA
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    856

    Default

    Remeber the Department Of Transportation Rules for over the road drivers, what is it now 12 hrs. on 8 hrs. off ? I believe it was recently changed from 11 on 8 off, I know the accident rate has jumped.

    I'm from the old ICC days.

    PCM

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