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Thread: Taktic

  1. #1
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    Winston Salem , NC
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    228

    Default Taktic

    Anyone ever use or hear of TAKTIC to be used on bees for mite control?
    larry

  2. #2
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    Dec 2006
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    St. Albans, Vermont
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    The active ingredient is Amitraz. At one time, Amitraz strips were available...similar to Apistan(Fluvalinate). The strips were taken off the market because of a large bee kill, said to be caused by the strips. I believe the problem was with something in the strip, not the Amitraz.

    Taktic is used in homemade chipboard strips, sometimes rotated with Mavrik(Fluvalinate).

  3. #3
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    Default

    Anyone got a formula on how to make these and the amount of taktic?
    larry

  4. #4
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    Dec 2005
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    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Palmer View Post
    The active ingredient is Amitraz. At one time, Amitraz strips were available...similar to Apistan(Fluvalinate). The strips were taken off the market because of a large bee kill, said to be caused by the strips. I believe the problem was with something in the strip, not the Amitraz.

    Taktic is used in homemade chipboard strips, sometimes rotated with Mavrik(Fluvalinate).
    The manufacturer took them off the market because they were sued by some beekeepers and no longer wanted the exposure. I don't know if anyone actually determined if the strips were the cause of the bee mortality.

    They still make the cattle ear tags that came off of the same assembly line as the strips for bees. Or the other way around, I guess.
    Mark Berninghausen #youmatter

  5. #5
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    Dec 2005
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    Brasher Falls, NY, USA
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    Hey Mike,
    What's up w/ the OA treatments? I hear you aren't seeing the effects you'd like to anymore?
    Mark Berninghausen #youmatter

  6. #6
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    Dec 2006
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    St. Albans, Vermont
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    Default

    >Hey Mike,
    What's up w/ the OA treatments? I hear you aren't seeing the effects you'd like to anymore?<

    Pshew! News travels fast in the north country.

    No, I'm not going to vaporize OA this year. I'm not seeing good results. Did it 3 years in a row. @004, and 2005 in mid-November. 2006 three times in September, and again in Mid-November. High mite loads in the spring.

    Not sure why it doesn't work for me. Perhaps the temps are too cold, and the clusters are too tight, and the OAv can't penetrate into the cluster. Perhaps the bees aren't broodless...although I think most are broodless or mostly broodless by mid-November. Another possibility would be the depth of the bottom board. The vaporizer sits just below the bottom bars. The wooden ones burn, and the plastic ones melt. Maybe the vapors are condensing on the bottom bars, or maybe the wax melts into the pan and effects the results. Seems like a lot of vapor coming out the top entrance, though.

    Medhat is designing a new vaporizer. Uses forced air to inject the vapors into the cluster. Maybe that will work better. I'll wait for the results. Wish I could trickle OA. My bees are wrapped for winter by the time they are broodless in mid-November. And if they aren't wrapped, and it snows much, I'll never get to them to do the work.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    San Mateo, CA
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    4,880

    Default

    >>>>"All honey boxes are to be removed while treating. NOTICE I do not condone using the Tactic/Amitraz treatment for obious reasons."

    I'm glad that I produce my own drug free honey so that I don't have to eat any of your guy's. Nothing like breaking the pesticide laws and probably polluting your crop. Feel sorry for your customers.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
    Location
    Rhineland-Palatinate, Germany
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    829

    Sad

    When using Tactic there is only one treatment necessary and you kill mites for several years. What’s happen after this is not a secret …> the mites kill your colonies.

    Your combs working like a sponge and the poison will sit in the wax for years. The contamination will get lower by the years and this is the time where mites getting resistance.

    Bees store honey in combs like this and your customers don’t know it. There are so many other possibilities to treat a hive without contaminating your customers.

  9. #9
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    Aug 2003
    Location
    Lancaster, Ky. / Frostproof Fl.
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    amatraz breaks down much quicker than apistan(flavonate..sp) as its half life is short. I dont use chemicals at all unless it is a emergency. I perfer instead to use thymol and formic acid but if the temperature stays above 90 like this year you gotta do something and remember.......its all about $$$........the chemical make a killing off us.look at he cost of formic and miteaway pads. My honey was tested for all chemicals this spring including pesticides and tylan.........guess what I was CLEAN!!!!

  10. #10
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    Dec 2006
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    Amador County, Calif
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    [QUOTE=suttonbeeman;265545]amatraz breaks down much quicker than apistan(flavonate..sp) as its half life is short.

    Suttonbeeman, thats very true.

    Probably the safest non leagal chem out there.

    Safer than check-mite or apistan.

  11. #11
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    Default Amitraz Safer Than Fluvalinate?

    >Safer than check-mite or apistan.<

    Keith, are there any studies on how Fluvalinate and Amitraz effect the bees? At EAS this summer, one report compared Fluvalinate and Coumaphos and controls and their effect on honeybee reproduction.

    The chemicals were present during the entire cell building/mating period. Coumaphos...of course...killed all the queen cells. What I found interesting was that Fluvalinate and the controls were statistically identical. There was no effect on queen cells, virgins, ability to mate, or viability of semen.

  12. #12
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    Dec 2006
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    Amador County, Calif
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    Micheal,

    Both strips fowl the comb up from what I have been told.
    Taktic is a quick blast then gone,from what I've read it does not hurt the combs and leaves no traces in the combs.

    Is taktic hard on queens, I think so.

    The point I was trying to make was , just because it's legal does not mean it's safer.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Evansville, IN, USA
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    Default

    AMITRAZ

    Chemical Class - Amadine

    Description - A behavior-affecting compound in the formamidine group of chemicals. Target site is octopamine receptor, which serves as a “fight or flight” neurohormone in arthropods. Varroa do NOT respond immediately to amitraz. Mortality can be expected over several days following treatment [Ref 16, p186].

    Health Effects - Amitraz is classified by the EPA in the US as Class III – Slightly Toxic.

    Lethal Dose to kill 50% (LD50) - Rats: 523-800mg/kg (oral); >1600mg/kg (dermal)

    Residue - Amitraz is a fat-soluble compound, but unlike other such compounds used as varroacides, it is volatile and unstable in honey, degrading in 3-4 weeks. Amitraz has therefore not been found as a residue in honey. Beeswax appears to accelerate the degradation of amitraz, with the product not being detectable within hours of application. Amitraz was not detectable when added at 100ppm in beeswax foundation, although fluvalinate and coumaphos were present in levels similar to the amount added.

    Maximum residue levels (MRLs) for amitraz in honey range from 0.01ppm in Italy, Germany and Switzerland to 1ppm in the US. The EU level is 0.2ppm140. No MRL has been established for amitraz in beeswax, since the substance has never been found as a residue in beeswax.

    Resistance - To date (2001), Varroa resistant to Amitraz have not been detected [Ref 16, p187].
    Amitraz was found to be ineffective in killing mites in the former Yugoslavia, even though the product provided good mite control in the 4 previous years. The mites were believed to be resistant to amitraz. Amitraz resistance was also confirmed in a population of mites in the US that showed resistance to fluvalinate38. Amitraz resistance has been shown in laboratory assays.

  14. #14
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    Aug 2002
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    Evansville, IN, USA
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    Default

    Bernie . . .

    Sorry, I dont have any recipes.

    FWIW, I think Taktic contains only 12.5% amitraz. If you used something that contained a different amount, say 100% or ony 1%, the "recipe" would be different anyway.

    You do realize that amitraz/Taktic is NOT a legal treatment in the U.S.?

    Have you "heared" what they do to "mountain fellers" that "go against" the law

  15. #15
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    Jan 2007
    Location
    Virginia (mountains)
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    9

    Default taktic

    Dave,
    The taktic I have is in fact 12.5% amitraz. I'm tinkering with a recipe. I do realize that taktic is not approved by the "govment". The government tends to only approve those chemicals offered by the chemical companies. I don't even think the government has formally approved powdered sugar as a treatment. Nevertheless, I believe that when the day comes that beekeepers stop experimenting, innovating, and creating different ways of doing things will be the day we can all hang it up. Regarding the clear liquid in mason jars, I have an agreement with the revenue folks. I tend bees and let Jack Daniels pay alcohol taxes. Peace.
    Bernie

  16. #16
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    Aug 2002
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    Evansville, IN, USA
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    Default

    >I believe that when the day comes that beekeepers stop experimenting, innovating, and creating different ways of doing things will be the day we can all hang it up . . .

    When you first sign on to BeeSource, there is a note about Adee Honey Farms
    having to pay $14,000 for the illegal "experimenting, innovating, and creating different ways of doing things" w/ oxalic acid.

    Have you read the article?

    >I tend bees and let Jack Daniels pay alcohol taxes . . .

    You are a good man

  17. #17
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    Aug 2003
    Location
    Lancaster, Ky. / Frostproof Fl.
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    Default

    Well but bernie.......I will also disagree that taktic takes time to work.....I rolled a colony with a high mite count....70 mites to about 300 bees......rolled 2 days after treating with taktic......6 mites! yep Adee got caught.....but Ill bet with his numbers of bees he is $$$$$$$ ahead if he had bought legal strips and not paid a fine vs using same chemical and paying fine.....like Bernie said....chemicals are approved AFTER CHEMICAL companies pay $$$$ then rip us off.......just look at cost of a wquart of maverick vs strips!!

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Dec 1999
    Location
    DuPage County, Illinois USA
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    9,419

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by lake thompson honey View Post
    another guy fogs his hives with a mixture of taktic and fgmo.
    The crazy things people do . . . .

    http://www.intervet.co.in/products/t...ct_details.asp


    Precautions :

    AVOID WORKING IN SPRAY MIST


    . . . . Hello!!

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Herrick, SD USA
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    Default amitraz (tactic)

    Sometimes I feel like the only commercial guy who is not using this stuff. I have resisted using it for years because something just dosen't feel right about using something that the only real information I have on it is anecdotal evidence from beekeepers that seem to be having good results with it. I am not looking for a pat on the back or compliments or anything like that, I just wish I understood why there is not either an outcry against it and the problems it may be causing or a push to legalize it because it (supposedly) dosen't leave residues or cause any other bee issues. I suppose the knee jerk reaction from most is that you would have to be crazy to use it but could it, perhaps, be another Tylan where the beekeeper was way out front of it's approval. So what gives does anyone know of any real scientific research that has been done on its effects on a bee hive?

  20. #20

    Default

    No studies that I know of, however anecedtal evidense suggests that you get the same results as those who used fluvinate, and coumaphos. It stops working, so you pour more into your hive, then you go onto the next big thing. I know some of the commericial guys that used it, also were the biggest outfits that lost bees to CCD. hmmmmm.

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