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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
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    Pittsburgh PA
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    399

    Default undecided b/w two table saws

    I want your help in deciding b/w a craftsman table saw model 21806

    and ryobi table saw model bts20

    I was almost decided on craftsman until now when I read reviews about ryobi, also I remember one of our beesource members bought the ryobi to make top bar hives.
    Thank you
    ps this is a gift from the wife but I need to decide by tomorrow
    There is no greater satisfaction than the satisfaction of a job well done.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Location
    Fort McMurray, Canada
    Posts
    220

    Default fences make the difference

    I have an old craftsman my neighbor gave me to rip with. Its ok but I really like the Ridgid I got from Homedepot.

    The Craftsman is for ripping and the Ridgid for dados. The reason is the difference in fences.

    Whichever saw you choose, buy as much fence as you can afford.

    I think the Craftsman may have more choices for aftermarket fences if you decide to upgrade later.

    A smooth, accurate fence will make days in the shop a pleasure.

    Good luck.
    Lat 56N

  3. #3
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    Mar 2005
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    Troupsburg, NY
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    4,074

    Default

    I wouldn't buy another craftsmen if it was the only saw on the market, i'd chew through the wood first. You might better buy the robyi, or look at the ones grizzely has.
    "I reject your reality, and substitute my own." Adam Savage

  4. #4
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    Aug 2006
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    Pittsburgh PA
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    399

    Default

    You guys are confusing me further Grizzly has bigger saws than what I require. This is going to be my first table saw and other than an occasional home project I will hardly use it. Bee boxes mainly
    There is no greater satisfaction than the satisfaction of a job well done.

  5. #5
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    Mar 2005
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    Troupsburg, NY
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    Default

    All the more reason you should buy the right saw the first time. Dad always had craftsmen saws. So that was what I got. The $700 radial arm couldn't cut a straight line if it had too. I still use it, because I can cut peices out fast on it, but I have to cut them long so I can square them on my grizzely.

    Craftsmen...............can you say cheap imported junk?:mad:
    "I reject your reality, and substitute my own." Adam Savage

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Sparta, Tennessee
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    2,121

    Big Grin

    Quote Originally Posted by peggjam View Post
    I wouldn't buy another craftsmen if it was the only saw on the market, i'd chew through the wood first.
    Peggjam, tell us how you really feel...Don't sugar coat it!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Freedom, Indiana
    Posts
    51

    Default

    When I bought my replacement 10 years ago I bought a Makita.
    At the time it was no more expensive than a crapsman or many others.

    Craftsman are usually underpowered in my opinion.
    The Ryobi's I've had experience with don't hold up but that's my experience.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Ft. Collins, Colorado
    Posts
    491

    Default

    Check out Bosch with it's stand on wheels. Great fence. I love this saw!!
    May need to find a special on it, if I remember it's a little higher priced than others.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2003
    Location
    Greenville, TX, USA
    Posts
    4,204

    Default

    Those two saws are essentially the same. They are both direct drive, ie the blade is mounted on the motor. That's not good for accuracy. Motor bearings aren't designed for that type of application. A belt drive saw will have the arbor mounted in it's own bearings creating a much more rigid and accurate saw. Belt drive saws are typically called contractor or cabinet saws. I see older Delta (Rockwell) contractor saws for sale in that price range all the time and they are a much better value. Check craigslist.org and local penney saver papers as well as the closest major market newspaper. Beyond that, the single most important thing on your saw is a good fence. The biesemeyer type is bullet proof, accurate, and easy. Lots of people now clone it.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    piperton,Tennessee,usa
    Posts
    369

    Default

    Those two are the same saw. I agree with Ross.
    I wish you knew the problems I went thru with Delta and their saws recently. I learned a whole lot in a very short time. Anyways if I had to do it again Id buy a used saw.
    But it depends on what you are wanting to do with it. Even then Id find a nice used saw.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Denton, N.C.
    Posts
    68

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by peggjam View Post
    All the more reason you should buy the right saw the first time. Dad always had craftsmen saws. So that was what I got. The $700 radial arm couldn't cut a straight line if it had too. I still use it, because I can cut peices out fast on it, but I have to cut them long so I can square them on my grizzely.

    Craftsmen...............can you say cheap imported junk?:mad:
    I have 2 -10" radial craftsman saws and they both have an adjustment for making sure that the saw rips or cross cuts correctly. Over a period of time they will get out of adjustment and have to be corrected. Tommy

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Pittsburgh PA
    Posts
    399

    Default

    Thanks all for the responses. After thinking about it for a while I think I'll let this opportunity pass I'll save some money and get the bosch 4000-09 instead. Who knows maybe I'll get a good deal on that saw. Its a popular saw as far as I have seen...
    I agree that it is worth stretching your budget to buy a quality saw instead of something that will remind you every time you use it..

    http://www.sears.com/sr/javasr/produ...seBVCookie=Yes

    is this a good idea?
    Thanks you guys are great!
    There is no greater satisfaction than the satisfaction of a job well done.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Berkey, OH, USA
    Posts
    1,486

    Default

    The table saw is the heart of your shop. Go out and find a good used table saw somewhere.

    I bought a used Delta contractor's saw 20 years ago, it has been great. I upgraded the motor over the years, added a dust collection / outfeed system, added a fence (that cost twice what I paid for the saw!) but overall it is still heads and tails above anything else you can buy for twice the price including the upgrades I have made.

    If you can't find something on Craig's list, go to or call a local tool store and see if they have anything they took in on trade. Go to the local lumber store and see what is on the board

    ps
    I have a craftsman radial arm saw I will GIVE you!

  14. #14
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    Mar 2005
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    Troupsburg, NY
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tommy View Post
    I have 2 -10" radial craftsman saws and they both have an adjustment for making sure that the saw rips or cross cuts correctly. Over a period of time they will get out of adjustment and have to be corrected. Tommy
    You can come over and adjust it for me......I've tried, and it just doesn't work, no matter what you do.
    "I reject your reality, and substitute my own." Adam Savage

  15. #15
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    Mar 2005
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    Troupsburg, NY
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BerkeyDavid View Post
    The table saw is the heart of your shop. Go out and find a good used table saw somewhere.

    I bought a used Delta contractor's saw 20 years ago, it has been great. I upgraded the motor over the years, added a dust collection / outfeed system, added a fence (that cost twice what I paid for the saw!) but overall it is still heads and tails above anything else you can buy for twice the price including the upgrades I have made.

    If you can't find something on Craig's list, go to or call a local tool store and see if they have anything they took in on trade. Go to the local lumber store and see what is on the board

    ps
    I have a craftsman radial arm saw I will GIVE you!
    I'll have one to give away as soon as I can talk the wife into thinking the spot would be better occupied with a real saw.
    "I reject your reality, and substitute my own." Adam Savage

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Silicon Valley, CA
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    1,236

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by peggjam View Post
    You can come over and adjust it for me......I've tried, and it just doesn't work, no matter what you do.
    Peggjam,

    It's a Zen thing...... After 25 years me and the saw are one. I just built
    a bunch of nucs in just a couple hours. It was really nice to cut the bottom board and have the rectangular nuc fit properly.

    Hint: It starts with a framing square that is actually square (most are not). A friend who does cabinet work told me about this. At your hardware store or improvement center find an expensive aluminum level to use as a test base.
    Start by taking any pair of framing squares and place them back to back on the aluminum level rail. If the squares are truly square the edges will touch all the way from top to bottom. If they seperate, either at the top or bottom then they are not square. Keep sorting until you find a good pair.

    Fuzzy

  17. #17
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    Apr 2003
    Location
    Greenville, TX, USA
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    4,204

    Default

    I can adjust radial arm saw, any brand. They all work about the same. Craftsman has a problem of under-speccing fasteners. The first thing you do is upgrade all the bolts to grade 5 bolts so they don't stretch, then your adjustments will stay for awhile. There is a specific sequence for setting up a radial arm and deviating will cause you grieve.

    Start by taking any pair of framing squares
    and what if they are both out in opposite directions? The only way to check a square quickly is the Pythagorean theorem, otherwise known as a 3-4-5 (or 6-8-10 depending on the size of the square) triangle. Measure 3 units down one side, 4 units down the other side. The distance across the opening between those two points should be 5, exactly. If it's not, it's not square. It doesn't matter what the units are, they just have to be all the same. You could use your foot if you wanted to as long as you are accurate. This is how pyramids and other ancient structures came to be laid out accurately. In colonial days, they did it with a 13 knot rope (it's a test, try it, all it takes is 13 equally spaced knots). I timber frame. It's a rule in most shops that when you hear a square hit the floor, everybody stops and checks their square. You just don't bend an 8x8 timber into position.

    I host a forum for Wood magazine on their website on old tools and machinery. I love hand tools and big old cast iron machines.
    Last edited by Ross; 06-25-2007 at 12:08 PM. Reason: addition

  18. #18
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    Nov 2004
    Location
    Kirkland, WA, USA
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    1,020

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ross View Post
    I love hand tools and big old cast iron machines.
    Man would you have loved talking with my neighbor when I was growing up. Worked both metal and wood (though he preferred metal), did so on a shop that looked like Doctor Frankenstein's lab. His lathe still had the pole drive sticking up into the air where it had once been powered by a water wheel. His press was the same age - I'll never forget helping him weld a tank AROUND it, then pour motor oil into the tank until it was full. "It'll work when I'm done", he'd say. He was right.
    http://www.voiceofthehive.com - Tales of Beekeeping and Honeybees

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Tucson, Arizona, USA
    Posts
    5,024

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by balhanapi View Post
    I want your help in deciding b/w a craftsman table saw model 21806

    and ryobi table saw model bts20

    I was almost decided on craftsman until now when I read reviews about ryobi, also I remember one of our beesource members bought the ryobi to make top bar hives.
    Thank you
    ps this is a gift from the wife but I need to decide by tomorrow
    Earlier this year I did basically the same thing you are doing now. I decided on the BTS20, I have been very pleased with my decision and the Ryobi saw. I have currently dedicated this saw to using a stacked dado set for dado cuts, I ordered the optional throat plate insert Ryobi sells for using the saw with a dado blade. It saves the time and trouble of creating a custom throat plate, and performs satisfactorily. So far my main task has been to recut the box joint tenons in medium super ends that I have cut down from 10-frame to 8-frame size. My model is the BTS20R.
    Last edited by Joseph Clemens; 06-25-2007 at 04:22 PM.
    48 years - 50 hives - TF
    Joseph Clemens -- Website Under Constructioni

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Sparta, Tennessee
    Posts
    2,121

    Big Grin

    Quote Originally Posted by peggjam View Post
    I'll have one to give away as soon as I can talk the wife into thinking the spot would be better occupied with a real saw.
    Peggjam, ahhhhh, would you be paying shipping to Owego NY too? Sounds like a bargain at twice the price! Put my name at the head of the list pulease!

    LOL, just kidding and I hope you get the saw you want!

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