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  1. #21
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    May 2007
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    Austin TX USA
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    Quote Originally Posted by peggjam View Post
    I found a hive recently that built a queen cell out of the face of the frame that was almost 4" long, it really looked like...... ......well you know . .
    Peggjam,

    No fair teasing us! Can you post a photo to the photo section? It sounds like one for the history books...or a mass media blitz.

    It reminds me this recent story: God in an eggplant.
    ~May your hive thrive
    Aisha

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
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    Troupsburg, NY
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    Sorry, I wish I had gotten a pic that day, because they tore it down a week or so later..and the queen, just a plain ordaniary old queen. For those of us dreaming of a super huge race of honeybee queens able to lay eggs nonstop, well, we already have one, what do we need another one for.
    "I reject your reality, and substitute my own." Adam Savage

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Craiova, Romania
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    42

    Cool

    Very big queencells appear most of the time because the beekeeper, when he moves the frames and turn them, etc. the larva from the queen cell slides to the opening of the cell; the bees will not put it back, but only make the cell longer.
    60% Expert American/English Speaker

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
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    Troupsburg, NY
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cristian Radut View Post
    Very big queencells appear most of the time because the beekeeper, when he moves the frames and turn them, etc. the larva from the queen cell slides to the opening of the cell; the bees will not put it back, but only make the cell longer.
    Or bounces them on a trailer for 6 hours. Hadn't thought of that explanation, sounds plausible.
    "I reject your reality, and substitute my own." Adam Savage

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Location
    Suffolk, VA
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    2,277

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    Cristian,

    Not trying to start an argument, but I have issues with most of everything you said.

    First, I've raised many EQs and if done under the right conditions will produce very large and very productive queens. If done poorly, the result will be inferior (very small) queens. However, all the same rules for grafting apply to EQ, so we're not talking about special precautions necessary, except with respect to the "old comb" concept that I accept as plausible.

    Second, it is not always the case that the "first out" will destroy all remaining Q-cells. Not hardly. I've seen hives with as many as three emerged virgins with intact cells remaining. The colony as a whole has a lot to do with what goes on within the hive, including the actions of virgins.

    Third, grafting is done for many reasons, but primarily for efficiency, i.e., mass production of queens.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cristian Radut View Post
    How much honey did you got with those emergency queens that you consider fine? Emergency queens are always smaller than normal queens, according to my eyes.

    Yet, when creating emergency cells, the bees choose all kind of larvae, from 1 to 3 days older and first will born the bad queens, raised from old larvae; when get born, in a few hours all the rest of queen cell will be destroyed by her. And the colony remains with "the worst of" queens.

    I wonder why queen breeders graft larvae, use starter colony and finishing colony, instead of making "the best of" queens using Smith's advice... So, i think i'll ask Joe Latshaw for this.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Craiova, Romania
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    It's not hard to observe that the EQ on the new combs are bigger than those started on dark combs. I would just never go so far to recommend EQ, but it's your choice and i respect that.

    The "first-out" queens raised from older larvae will be always the worst from the whole effective of Q cells, and most of the time only they will survive.
    A first-out queen destroys 4/5 cells in her first hour after the emerging.

    Grafting brings you "the best of queens". Grafting Queens (GQ) are always bigger than Emergency Queens (EQ), and as performance, you have more chances to get more honey from a colony with GQ queens. More eggs, more bees, more honey.

    PS: I have a question about something i don't understand: the 4" that Peg referred means "4 cm" or "4 inches"?
    60% Expert American/English Speaker

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Location
    Tucson, Arizona, USA
    Posts
    5,032

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    One set of double quotes - " - following a number in digit form is the abbreviation for inches.
    48 years - 50 hives - TF
    Joseph Clemens -- Website Under Constructioni

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
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    43,492

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    " = inches. ' = feet. # = pound.

    One of my sons is 6'2" tall. Which is read "One of my sons is six feet two inches tall".
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Craiova, Romania
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    I wasn't sure... but now it make sense! Now i can tell i'm 70" tall...

    Now, Peg, i imagine that you've been extremely impressed about that 4" queen cell, who would not be? I thought it reached 4 cm, but 4 inches :confused:

    60% Expert American/English Speaker

  10. #30

    Big Grin

    Quote Originally Posted by Cristian Radut View Post

    Grafting brings you "the best of queens". Grafting Queens (GQ) are always bigger than Emergency Queens (EQ), and as performance, you have more chances to get more honey from a colony with GQ queens. More eggs, more bees, more honey.
    ”Grafting Queens (GQ) are always bigger than Emergency Queens (EQ), and as performance, you have more chances to get more honey from a colony with GQ queens. More eggs, more bees, more honey.”
    All queens reared are emergency queens except swarm and supersede queens. My experience tells me that you can get “the best of queens" with emergency rearing method. A lot of people use emergency queens and they are very pleased with them. To get” bigger than Emergency Queens” you can use even Ezi- system, no problems. I do repeat all reared queens a emergency queens except…..

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
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    Troupsburg, NY
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    "I do repeat all reared queens a emergency queens except….."


    I disagree with this statement.....swarm queens certainly are not emergencey queens.
    "I reject your reality, and substitute my own." Adam Savage

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Craiova, Romania
    Posts
    42

    Thumbs down

    Drone, i do remember that on this forum you only had questions, but now you show me unpractical answers. What i meant is that a queen obtained using grafting is generally superior to one that bees get by the "natural emegency way". By grafting, starting, finishing, you'll get superior queens. How can someone say that an emergency queen cell has a larva of proper age, if didn't choosed personally that?
    60% Expert American/English Speaker

  13. #33

    Default

    I’ll stick to my opinion: the best queens are from swarming queens( i can explane why I think so). You can find for sure very good queens between emergency queens. Sorry for asking it’s my way of learning. Reading too. Isn’t yours? Sorry for telling you it’s my way of learning because reading I find out even that it’ s not good to convince other people that you are right. Sorry for telling you this but for the moment I know from asking and reading that all reared queens are like emergency and the only natural way is swarming and supersede so not emergency. Perhaps I’m wrong. This is the way on Forum It’s not necessary to agree with you.
    See you soon and let’s change the subject.
    PS.
    Sorry guy for bother you.I do promise not to start arguing with Cristian Radut I think is useless to try to convince somebody.

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Craiova, Romania
    Posts
    42
    Let's see...

    1. Even beginners know that the best egg-laying queen are those from swarming, we all know that, but their colonies will swarm again and again. That's why i excluded them from the discussion, for me swarming isn't a bennefit. If you see it as useful, go on...

    2. You may start the grafting way of breeding queens using the emergency, but:
    - you'll finish them in the finisher collony,
    - that collony has a normal life and feeds better the queen, because after these queens get out, in the cell remains a lot of royal jelley; the same applies to swarming or superseding, but not to emergency.
    - you don't risk to have a queen of unsuitable/improper age.

    3.
    60% Expert American/English Speaker

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Craiova, Romania
    Posts
    42
    for the 3. it was "Thumbs up!"
    60% Expert American/English Speaker

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