Handling Queens

[Oxankle]

Ok, Fellows,
I need more advice from you fellows who make a living at this.

Buddy called me today and said that one of his hives had gone queenless. So, I go out to a nuc that holds a tiny swarm we caught last week and find the queen. She is big and pretty and I catch her in my trusty Edelstahl Rost Frei queen catcher.

Oops; now what coach? I have not the slightest idea how to get her in a queen cage. I had an old cage, and I made up a tablespoon of candy this morning, but how do I get her in there?

To make a long story short, I put her back on the comb and tried to catch her in my big fat fingers, but she wound up flying off the comb and is now no telling where.
I had to take a split over for him to combine with his queenless hive. Luckily I had a 5-frame nuc full of bees with a nice queen.

Tell me, fellows; how do you get a queen out of the queen catcher and into a cage?

If you do not use a queen catcher, how do you get the queen from a mating nuc into a cage?
Ox
Ox

[Michael Bush]

I have a couple of methods. First, take her and the cage in the house in the bathroom with the door shut and work in the window. If she flys she'll go to the window. Second, I hold the cage in my left hand and the clip in my right and try to close the path between and open the clip. Usually I can get her in the cage.

Another method is you buy a glass pipe that you put over the queen and wait for her to run up the pipe and then blow her (gently) into the cage.
http://www.beeworks.com/uspage3.asp

Look for the "glass queen catcher"

Of course, pacticing doing it bare handed with drones is the best in the long run.

[Rob Mountain]

“Practicing doing it bare handed with drones is the best in the long run”

Sturdy hands and soft fingers. This is also good practice for marking and clipping queens, practice on drones.


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If a job is worth doing - Then do it well

[odfrank]

Gently grab her by the wings and run her into the cage. If you want to mark her, move her to your other hand holding her by two legs. Queen catchers are only good if you want to lock her up while you work the hive. And they can easily escape from many queen catchers. Never use mine any more.

[Oxankle]

Thanks, fellows;
Michael; I can see that taking the queen into the house will work. However, if you are handling bees, have propolis and honey all over your hands and clothing and probably a little on you shoes, just one time is all that a wife will allow this.

Even if she would permit this, no beeman can run to the house every time he wants to cage a queen.

My fingers are pretty much rough as rebar. I expect a lot of drones will die before I learn this.
Ox

[Michael Bush]

>Even if she would permit this, no beeman can run to the house every time he wants to cage a queen.

True, but it's a way to practice without losing the queen.

[bjerm2]

What I do is just put her in my hand and let her walk up my palm (fist) with a cage where my pointing finger and my thumb is. They walk right in, OR just pick her up by the wings and stuff her into the cage. No problem. Then again my favoret, use a queen intoduction cage. See
http://members.aol.com/queenb95/QnIntroInstr.html

Dan

[kookaburra]

Will she sting if I use my big fat fingers?

Everything I've read says no, and I believe that in my mind, but when trying to handle her (an old queen), I can see her stinger, trying to sting, and that make my hands protest!

thanks rick

[bjerm2]

Ok, ok you got me, 99.9% of the time she won't sting you. I too have that question on 0.1% possibility but in my 30 years of handling them I can say I never got stung by the queen. Yes she will take her stinger out and look like she will sting you but I never had her do that even when I crushed her in my fingers.
Dan

[Michael Bush]

>Everything I've read says no, and I believe that in my mind, but when trying to handle her (an old queen), I can see her stinger, trying to sting, and that make my hands protest!

I'm with Bjerm2. In 30 years I've never been stung by a queen. I've heard the possibility discussed but I've only ever heard one person claim to have been stung by one:
http://www.beesource.com/pov/andy/andy5.htm

Here's a discussion of queens stinging:
http://www.beesource.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001186.html

[Dick Allen]

I was stung by a queen once.

[Dick Allen]

This should take you to an up close and personal view of the queenÂ’s sting. As can be seen, contrary to popular belief, the queen does indeed have barbs on her sting. Granted, though, they are not anything like those of the worker.
http://gears.tucson.ars.ag.gov/beebook/queen/1.43.html

[Dick Allen]

>99.9% of the time she won't sting you

Like Michael I, too, am in complete agreement with that. At the time, several years ago when I was a brand new beekeeper, I brought the queen indoors and was trying to mark her at the table. I was completely rattled, trembling like a leaf, with sweat pouring off my forehead. I fumbled with the poor creature for at least 15 minutes. She got out of my hand once and started running across the table. I reached out and cupped my hand over her, then fumbled some more. Once again she got loose and started running across the table. I was able to cup my hand over her again, but this time I guess she had enough of my nonsense and jabbed me. My first reaction was not pain, but panic. Had I just killed my queen by making her sting me?!?!? Well, there was no stinger in my hand and she looked ok. I gave up, put her in the hive and checked on her the next day. She was busy laying eggs. Later on in the season I did mark her.

[Jack Grimshaw]

At EAS 2002,I took a 1 hr lecture from Dennis vanEnglesdorf (PA State inspector) on queen caging.20 of us assembled queen cages,made queen candy,inserted the queen(drone),and then preceded to add 6 attendants.We had a blast.The attendants are the most fun.You have to grab the bee while it is feeding on an open cell(or the queen when she is stationary for a moment) firmly but gently on the thorax with your thumb and index finger.Aim for the spot between the legs and wings so presure is applied from the sides instead of the top or bottom.Insert the head in the uncorked hole,release presure slightly ,and scoot her in with your middle finger.Cover hole with the other thumb.Repeat. 1 queen 6 attendants
Dennis said they used to race in college.

And no-one got stung!

[This message has been edited by Jack Grimshaw (edited October 01, 2004).]

[Hook]

I use my queen catcher, take her away from the hive, and wait for her to walk into the unscreened, unstapled queen cage. Usually she will just walk in. Once she is in, go back to the hive, holding the screen in place, and let the workers smell her. Wait until 5 or six workers go to the screen, and gently flip it over. At that point, you have a queen and however many workers you want in the cage. Then staple it.

Since I only have one arm, (aka Hook), it is about the only way I can do it. It works just fine, and it can be done in less than a minute. Marking queens, I use a queen cage,(marking kit), and pin her down gently, and dab her with a paint marker. Clipping? Something I have not really tried yet, but I have a son and wife that would help me if I asked. But I'm sure, after 30 years of having a hook, I would figure something out! But that's my problem....

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Dale Richards
Dal-Col Apiaries
Drums, PA

[This message has been edited by Hook (edited October 01, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by Hook (edited October 01, 2004).]

[dickm]

Here's a way to begin. Get a big clear baggy. Put your dominant hand, holding the queen cage and the clothespin holder, inside. Use a rubber band around your wrist. Now you can relax about losing her and just coax her into the cage. Works well for removing attendants in a new queen's cage, too. (This last is a must for smooth queen introduction).

Dickm

[jfischer]

> Even if she would permit this, no beeman
> can run to the house every time he wants
> to cage a queen

A truck or car works just as well, as
long as you remember to close the sunroof.
The proper technique for grabbing a queen
without harming her for marking, caging,
whatever is one of those things that is
easy to learn from someone else, but very
hard to learn from a book.

Find someone with more gray hair than you
have, and ask.

I don't know anyone who is serious about
bees who uses more than a queen-marking
plunger gizmo, and that only rarely. All
the other stuff designed to "handle"
queens are simply not used, but these
guys use gloves when they are, taking
stings, keep their veils close by, and so on.

[Rob Mountain]

I have been stung many times by virgin queens during I.I. Once the virgin has been anesthetized with CO2, and successfully inseminated one of the only was to get her out of the holding tube is the place the tube in your mouth and gently blow her out head first. This of course often meant that my lips came in contact with her sting.

Yes, many jokes have been made about this.


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If a job is worth doing - Then do it well

[Oxankle]

See? I got a college education here in the space of a couple of weeks!
Ox

[hollowlog]

I can pick up queens and put them in cages but how do you insert workers? The same way with the fingers?