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  1. #1
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Bowdoinham, Maine, USA
    Posts
    78

    Question

    Does anyone use them? Do you find them effective? Do you leave them on the hive all year? Are you comfortable having them on with honey supers?

    Thanks for your opinions. David

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2000
    Location
    Medford Lakes,NJ,USA
    Posts
    94

    Cool

    I have only heard of treating for tracheal mites or foulbrood with grease patties. I do not suggest keeping them on all year around.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Bowdoinham, Maine, USA
    Posts
    78
    Grease patties with Terramycin(sp?) do indeed work well against tracheal mites and foulbrood, we use them after the honey crop is removed and leave them to be consumed over the winter. My intention is to use unmedicated patties, Crisco and sugar, to help control tracheal mites during the rest of the year. Bees eat the patties not because they like them but because the patties are in the way of normal hive activities. There should be no reason that the bees would store any of this substance in the honey supers. I have every intention of researching this subject further but still suspect that this is an acceptable procedure. Thank you for your post NewBee, I will keep in touch. David

    [This message has been edited by mainelybees (edited May 28, 2001).]

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    smethport, pa usa
    Posts
    39

    Post

    grease patties are a tracheal mite supressant, leave them in the hive year round, terrrimiacin mixed with grease patties is a bad old idea, all this succeeds in doing is producing a antibiotic resistant strain of afb. mix your terrimiacin 2tbl spoons of powdered sugar to i teaspoon of terrimiacin, sprinkle 1 tablespoon an the top of frames along the edge of hive body after your supers have been removed. joel

    [This message has been edited by Admin (edited December 24, 2001).]

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Bowdoinham, Maine, USA
    Posts
    78

    Question

    What's the difference? The unmedicated patties are used during the honey season, while the medicated patties are put on after the honey crop has been harvested. Please explain to me why putting TM in my grease patties is wrong and mixing TM with powdered sugar is right.

    ------------------
    Maine-ly Bees
    David Wallace and Family
    Bowdoinham, ME
    mainelybees@farmbid.com

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    smethport, pa usa
    Posts
    39

    Post

    it is the same reason you dont mix fumidil with your syrup everytime you feed your bees, or leave apstain strips in overwinter. sfb can build a resistance to terimiacin. feeding with powdered sugar once a week for three weeks is recomended (cornell university master beekeeping program, apprentice level spring course,lesson #11)

    [This message has been edited by Admin (edited December 24, 2001).]

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    crown point, NY, USA
    Posts
    971

    Post

    Hi,

    This is one point I must agree with Joelz. TM resistant AFB is now on the rise. This is something that occurs with antibiotics. But at any rate TM is no cure for AFB. All it does is supress the disease yet it still remains. It is a brood disease not a box disease. I would suggest throwing it in the garbage. Save your money as I said it is no cure. You would be far ahead to cull infected frames(and destroy unless you have a wax press). As long as you are a diligent beekeeper you can control the disease without dopes. Shaking bees down onto new foundation is one way to control the disease.

    Clay


  8. #8
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Bowdoinham, Maine, USA
    Posts
    78

    Question

    Thank you for the explanation joelz.
    Now, how long have you been keeping bees? How many hives do you currently have? And, EXACTLY how are you "associated" with Cornell University?

    ------------------
    Maine-ly Bees
    David Wallace and Family
    Bowdoinham, ME
    mainelybees@farmbid.com

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Bowdoinham, Maine, USA
    Posts
    78
    Thanks Clay.
    I am considering using the mineral oil treatment spoken of in the FGMO posts, both the mop cord and the fogger applications, in conjunction with screen bottom boards. I will then have to go with the powdered sugar method of medicating with TM if the need arises.
    Have you tried or thought of trying FGMO?
    David

    ------------------
    Maine-ly Bees
    David Wallace and Family
    Bowdoinham, ME
    mainelybees@farmbid.com

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    smethport, pa usa
    Posts
    39

    Post

    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Clayton:


    It is a brood disease not a box disease.

    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    not a box disease? afb spores in a infected hive are to be considered in all wooden ware, the inside of the hives need to be flamed with a propane weed burner, the frames and foundation, burnt, i would not suggest processing afb infected wax, just not good beekeeping. and as for shaking your bees on new foundation, a sure way to save your bees, but the bees must be quarrentined inside the hive for three days,on foundation without feed, this way their gut is clean of any contaminants, i have had a outbreakof afb, when i started beekeeping, the equipment was purchased at a bargin from a old expeienced beekeeper,one more word of advice on quarenting on new foundation, two beekeeeper working together will make the whole operation much easier, one beekeeper handling the bees, the other handling the smoker, it is also a bit easier if you are able to do this on a cool mornig or later at night when less bees will be flying

    [This message has been edited by Admin (edited December 24, 2001).]

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    smethport, pa usa
    Posts
    39

    Big Grin

    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by mainelybees:
    Thank you for the explanation joelz.
    Now, how long have you been keeping bees? How many hives do you currently have? And, EXACTLY how are you "associated" with Cornell University?

    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    beekeeping for 10 years, 25 hives, 15 overwintering nucs, produce approx. 50-75 mated queens each year, journyman level beekeeper enrolled in cornell,s master beekeeper program, and you?

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    smethport, pa usa
    Posts
    39

    Post

    <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by mainelybees:
    Thanks Clay.
    I am considering using the mineral oil treatment spoken of in the FGMO posts, both the mop cord and the fogger applications, in conjunction with screen bottom boards. I will then have to go with the powdered sugar method of medicating with TM if the need arises.
    Have you tried or thought of trying FGMO?
    David

    <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

    one question you will have to go with tm when the need arises? when you say the need arises, you must be talking about a hive infected with afb? afb is highly contagious, you are not going to eliminate afb with a dose of tm, its too late then.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Mar 2001
    Location
    Bowdoinham, Maine, USA
    Posts
    78

    Post

    Didn't mean to sound like I was questioning your knowledge or experience in beekeeping joelz.
    I have only been keeping bees for about five years. Currently running 25 hives total in four separate bee yards. Yearly blueberry pollinating contract. Oh yeah, also neighbor and student of Maine's only certified Master Beekeeper.


    ------------------
    Maine-ly Bees
    David Wallace and Family
    Bowdoinham, ME
    mainelybees@farmbid.com

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    crown point, NY, USA
    Posts
    971

    Post

    afb is highly contagious, you are not going to eliminate afb with a dose of tm, its too late then.

    reply:

    TM doesn't eliminate AFB! It only supresses it until resistance occurs (which is now occurring). Then you will have to contend with the disease after.

    Clay

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Apr 2000
    Location
    Birmingham, West Midlands, UK
    Posts
    751

    Post

    I can't comment on treatment for AFB, as the only legal option in Britain is currently burning, but cases of EFB recurring some time after treatment have been common enough to cause concern. Serious cases are burnt, treatment is only used in milder cases. Experiments with shakedowns combined with treatment seem to produce better results, but this only goes to illustrate the point that TM is nothing more than a prophylactic. To me, the real question is, how prevalent would brood diseases be in the States if you stopped treating?

    Regards,

    Robert Brenchley

    RSBrenchley@aol.com

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Dec 2000
    Location
    crown point, NY, USA
    Posts
    971

    Post

    Hi Robert,

    but this only goes to illustrate the point that TM is nothing more than a prophylactic. To me, the real question is, how prevalent would brood diseases be in the States if you stopped treating?

    reply:

    You are correct that TM is only a prophylactic. Not a cure whatsoever. Why treat if the disease still remains? If they stopped treating in the US there probably would be massive outbreaks Robert. As they have only covered it up not dealt with it(some do burn which may be to drastic unless very serious case). One would be far better off to cull infected combs or shake the entire colony down. This at least removes the disease not cover it up. One must be a diligent beekeeper to do this and it may not be best for the beginner to do. They may be best to burn. But with experience this isn't necessary in MPOV. Mush of disease may be to para foul triggered by parasites.

    Clay


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