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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Corralitos, CA, USA
    Posts
    1,247

    Post

    Many of you would call me a "liberal tree hugger," but I would agree with the sentiment of just ignore those fools at PETA. Their website on bees is truly bizarre.

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Bartonville, TX USA
    Posts
    456

    Post

    The author is Holly Lewis, appropriately she does not post her name on the site, perhaps out of fear of embarrassment over the poor research and misrepresentations, or perhaps out of experience from proclaiming falsehoods before. Anyway here is her registration information, addresses and phone number. Clearly from her article this women is at least twice as smart as a rock.

    Domain ID 14796528-LROR
    Domain Name:VEGETUS.ORG
    Created On:07-Dec-1999 20:22:22 UTC
    Last Updated On:08-Dec-2003 02:23:57 UTC
    Expiration Date:07-Dec-2004 20:22:22 UTC
    Sponsoring Registrar:R98-LROR
    Status:OK
    Registrant ID:CTLG28273
    Registrant Name:Holly Lewis
    Registrant Organization:Holly Lewis
    Registrant Street1:5710 Phillips Ave. #A16
    Registrant City:Pittsburgh
    Registrant State/Province:PA
    Registrant Postal Code:15217
    Registrant Country:US
    Registrant Phone:+1.6174939147
    Registrant Email:vegetus@vegetus.org
    Admin ID:CTLG176744
    Admin Name:Holly Lewis
    Admin Organization:Holly Lewis
    Admin Street1:6113 HLS Holmes Mail Center
    Admin City:Cambridge
    Admin State/Province:MA
    Admin Postal Code:02138
    Admin Country:US
    Admin Phone:+1.6174939147
    Admin Email:vegetus@vegetus.org

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Oct 2003
    Location
    Bainbridge, Indiana USA
    Posts
    63

    Post

    Arguing with peta is a lot like wrestling in the mud with a pig, eventually you realize the pig is enjoying it!

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Kent, OH, USA
    Posts
    14

    Post

    I whole-heartedly agree that one cannot argue with the insane. However, as beekeepers I think we need to do all that we can to diffuse PETA's misrepresentations of honey and beekeeping. Not in order to change anyone's mind at PETA but to aid the generally uninformed public in finding unadulterated facts. Fight fire with water. Show what a kind and gently thing beekeeping is. Show the benefits of honey and other hive products. Show our committment to the bees and the agriculture that keeps this great country of ours well fed. http://petathinksbees.dontexist.com

    ------------------
    I Speak For The Bees

  5. #25
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    corinth ky.
    Posts
    10

    Post

    Thank you for the PETA hates Beekeepers article. It was really entertaining and good for a laugh......... Some folks just have too much free time.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Attleboro, MA, USA
    Posts
    18

    Post

    Sorry to break it to you all, but the website in the original post is not a PETA site..

  7. #27
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Blountstown, Florida
    Posts
    535

    Exclamation

    Well Kosh, By Gosh...... yer right. lol

    Doesn't change anything, but yer right. And when yer right, yer right. :->

    ------------------
    It's Not The Destination, It's The Journey. We Cannot Change The Wind, But We CAN Trim The Sails.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Kent, OH, USA
    Posts
    14

    Post

    It's true, but PETA disdains beekeeping and honey the same. My site has some links to PETA stuff that makes the same points without all the skewed research. Whether it's vegetus or PETA, (both share that same opinions on Beekeeping, honey, and bees. PETA is (has made their organization) the figurehead for animal rights, has the most money, and funds people. Links that are PETA's: http://www.goveg.com/active/factshee...lay.asp?ID=122
    http://www.peta.org/factsheet/files/...lay.asp?ID=122

    ------------------
    I Speak For The Bees

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Kent, OH, USA
    Posts
    14

    Post

    I may be sloppy but I'm not full of crap. I've put the 2 links to PETA's site stating the same garbage as Vegetus.org on:
    http://petathinksbees.dontexist.com/

    I just came across the Vegetus site first.

    ------------------
    I Speak For The Bees

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Attleboro, MA, USA
    Posts
    18

    Post

    I will admit the vegetus site is a little out there with their view of it. I did read the GoVeg peta site and there isnt anything in there that isnt true. One thing that was left out, that beekeepers will know, but non-beekeepers will not usually know is that the drones always die when they mate with a queen, regardless of whether a person is involved or not. I didnt see any information that was embellished or a lie.

    I am not always a fan of peta's tactics, but their fact sheets are what they are.. facts.. i've read many of them and researched the info and know they are not making stuff up.

    I think i'm probably an odd man out on the site here, i'm a beekeeper and a vegan.. go figure! I'm a beekeeper because i find it fascinating, i like the extra pollenation for my veggies, and i want to know that any honey or beeswax i use comes from bees that are treated well.

    Peace,
    Jason

  11. #31
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
    Posts
    46,341

    Post

    >I am not always a fan of peta's tactics, but their fact sheets are what they are.. facts.. i've read many of them and researched the info and know they are not making stuff up.

    Their "facts" are very out of context and usually an exception rather than the rule.

    For instance, implying that most queens are artificially (or instrementally) inseminated (raped was their word) is simply not the typical scenerio. Very few of us can afford an II queen. Most of them are naturally mated.

    Implying that it is common practice to kill off bees, when a query on here could not find one beekeeper that currently does it, is not what I would consider "factual". It may be that some beekeeper somewhere still does it, but I've never encountered anyone who does and most beekeepers I know wouldn't even consider it.

    Their are certainly a lot of implications that certain practices are common when they are not or that put certain practices in a light that I do not believe the bees, if they could communicate with us at that level, would agree with.

  12. #32
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Kent, OH, USA
    Posts
    14

    Post

    I have absolutely nothing against vegans, for the record. I would never insist that they need to be like me. I have a problem with, as was stated above, the context in which the "facts" are presented makes the truth sound like lies. The larger point is, no one is telling vegans to eat honey or to keep bees. BUT alot of people have no problem with it or don't know much. To misinform others, contextually or factually is WRONG. Peace& Bees

    ------------------
    I Speak For The Bees

  13. #33

    Lightbulb

    If these people are for animal rights and fair treatment, why do they mutalate the animals through casrations and spaying. It's all for population control and health reasons right? Not to mention the SLAVE OWNER factor. I guess the 70 pound Labrador retriever wants to live in a kennel box in the 3 room apartment.( alone for 9 hours a day until you get home from your job at Starbucks. Things that make you go Huum..

  14. #34
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
    Posts
    46,341

    Post

    Maybe they are trying to be realisitc. After all, if you don't believe in euthanasia for animals and you don't believe in hunting them and you don't believe in population control you will eventually end up overun with animals.

    On the other hand, I know some of them are against even having pets because you are subverting a animal by making it dependant on you.

  15. #35
    Join Date
    Nov 2003
    Location
    Lyndon, KS
    Posts
    357

    Post

    I got a kick out of the site telling me I was a "slave owner" I guess I did "buy" my bees but that is as far as it goes........I gave them a nice home to live in and they seem to like it to the point that they have build alot of nice storage for them and me......but then again I did notice that one bee was missing the other day...just one....has PETA set up an "underground railroad" for bees?

  16. #36
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Attleboro, MA, USA
    Posts
    18

    Post

    Coyote, too funny, i share my home with 3 demanding cats.. i feel your pain..

    Michael bush, you make some valid points.. Though the information there is factual, you are correct, it is taken out of context. I read that, thinking.. "I've read all of this before in several beekeeping books and heard it from the instructor of the beekeeping course i took. " but as I re-read it, I realized that it doesnt mention everything, and only paints negatives that not everyone does. I mean yeah, i'm sure there are some odd people out there who kill their bees at the end of the season, but I bet very few do that How is that economical? Why would you want to start over every year and have to wait for the bees to build up? and who wants to spend $60+ per hive every year for bees? Honestly, I dont think they display a strong argument against using bee products.

    Peace,

    Jason

  17. #37
    Join Date
    Jul 2003
    Location
    Kansas
    Posts
    1,262

    Post

    I read the page. It is a bit bombastic.

    It's meant to attract attention. LOL

    I don't see a correlation with babies in the womb. That topic deserves a remark however....

    But I'll pass.

    [This message has been edited by Daisy (edited June 20, 2004).]

  18. #38

    Post

    You better quit while your ahead James. Someone might accuse you of being a free thinking individual.

  19. #39
    Join Date
    Jun 2003
    Location
    Pomfret, MD, USA
    Posts
    242

    Post

    James,
    You are absolutely right, dead is dead. However, there is a difference between dead from lethal injection and dead from a bloody, often times horribly maiming and painful dog fight. When you talk about a dog "taking it's chances in the ring" it assumes that if the dog keeps winning, eventually he might escape that existence. Unfortunately, that's just not the case. A dog that keeps winning keeps fighting. There is no retirement from the sport.
    Euthanasia is the only choice, since many of these dogs are vicious and dangerous and could never be put up for adoption.

    In terms of how to best do that euthanasia, I agree it would be cheaper to just shoot them all on the spot and bury them. However, as I am sure you are aware, there are valid reasons for not doing it that way which go beyond simply the cost. There are health reasons, safety reasons, and legal reasons.

    Finally, please remember that Animal Control and Humane Society organizations and the people who work for them have a whole variety of responsibilities and job duties. Dealing with situations as you describe is just one of the things your tax dollars are going to.

    Most of these organizations, (especially Humane Societies, which are usually private non-profit organizations which receive small amounts of government funding), struggle with insufficient operating budgets and resources.

    Respectfully,
    Kai


  20. #40
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Jackson, Ga USA
    Posts
    146

    Exclamation

    I had to reply, I tried not to but couldn't help myself.
    First off - What is the key ingredient to everything you stated? MONEY. Why is money so powerful? PEOPLE. People give it power because of GREED. Humans do alot of stupid things because of greed. Greed is one of the seven deadly sins. SIN. If we all didn't sin then maybe things on this planet might be just a little bit better for us all.
    Second - I live in the country and I do own two dogs. However my property is fenced and the only things my dogs chase and kill are frogs.
    Third - Killing is wrong period! Whether it is a dog or a fetus, it is wrong. It is also a sin, see above.

    I replied to let you know where I stand on these issues. I am a firm believer in 'right is right and wrong is wrong' and all human beings know the difference. We all just need to do the 'right' things.

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