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  1. #1
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    Sep 2004
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    demossville,ky. usa
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    why not use matel for frame for the hives?

    ------------------
    tony

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
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    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
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    Metal? Like sheet metal? It would transfer cold and heat way too much for a hive to handle, especially if it was in the sun. Metal is usually used for excluders (although there are also plastic ones) and frame rests and screening, but that's about it.

    Of course metal on top of wood for a roof is common.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
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    demossville,ky. usa
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    i was think more a long the line of aluminum frames. the frame are inside the housen of the hives, so how would this effect the heating cause i'm not following the logic for instint let say our house has a roof that protect us the sun and this provide us protection for matel suffuse heating dose it not what the different has any one try this to see what would happen tony williams

    ------------------
    tony

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Fremont, New Hampshire, USA
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    695

    Post

    Problem is that the frames transfer heat away from the brood area.

    Not a new idea. It's already been tried and proven - not beneficial to the hive.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    demossville,ky. usa
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    Post

    ok why didn't you say that the first time did they try alumi.tony williams

    ------------------
    tony

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
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    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
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    I have heard of (and seen pictures of) aluminum comb like PermaComb only aluminum. I don't think it would work well in any cold climate. It certainly would draw heat from the cluster in winter.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    May 2000
    Location
    Fremont, New Hampshire, USA
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    695

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    Also at one time there was a foundation that had an thin aluminum core simular to the plastic on todays Duragilt foundation. It was embossed with the cell shape and it too fell out of favor quickly.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    demossville,ky. usa
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    Post

    what was the main reason for the failure the heat or the cold i'm not quite sure i understand this like i said before. may add a roof to it and use that real thin pink of insulation on the hot side of the hive maybe that would reduce the cold and heat of the alum.tranference

    ------------------
    tony

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
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    Metal on the outside insulated by wood or other insulative materials works fine. The metal foundation seemed to be what failed. It just tranfers heat too well.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
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    demossville,ky. usa
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    Post

    i see where we are miscommi. dude i'm was thinking wood body and matel frame and your talking about matel all away

    ------------------
    tony

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
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    Well, a "frame", in beekeeping terms is the piece that the bees build their comb in. I had no idea whether you were refering to the hive being made of metal, a frame to hold the hive together being made of metal or the actual frames being made of metal, so my original answer I mentioned everywhere that metal has been found to be useful in a hive. Frankly, I'm still not sure what you are refering to. But a hive made of metal would be an oven. A lid made of only metal without some insulation under it (wood, or whatever) would be too hot. Foundation made of metal has been a failure and I'm guessing a frame made of metal would fail for the same reasons, that it would conduct heat out of the cluster in winter.

    What did I miss?

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    demossville,ky. usa
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    59

    Lightbulb

    ok let say we build the hive of wood,and insula. the outside with the thin pink panter insula.the top of the hive has like the fancy roof and between the roof and the telescope your thin pink insula.the telescope covering the frames, i'm basically saying design the hive a way our house are design it would have a some what control environment

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
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    That much insulation is really only useful in the winter and only in very cold climates, but many people wrap their hives in insulation. The down side to insulating every box is it's expenisve. The WBC hive has a double wall to provide insulation, but it's very heavy. Betterbee and a few others sell the Styrofoam hives that are much better insulated with that as the selling point.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    demossville,ky. usa
    Posts
    59

    Lightbulb

    yall i know but i want to try the matel frames. if you use matel wire in the frames work you should be able to use some type of matel inside the hive that do not conduct heat or get cold tony williams

    ------------------
    tony

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
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    >yall i know but i want to try the matel frames.

    What metal frame? I don't know of any in production now.

    >if you use matel wire in the frames work you should be able to use some type of matel inside the hive that do not conduct heat or get cold

    The wire is like piano wire. VERY thin. It does not conduct very much heat because there is VERY little mass of metal in the frame.

  16. #16
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Salem, Oregon
    Posts
    460

    Post

    Here is a link to a metal frame. They aren't selling them. They just have some pictures of one that someone sent them.
    http://website.lineone.net/~dave.cushman/aliframes.html

    Pugs

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    demossville,ky. usa
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    Post

    well i am in the process of design one on paper and going to get one of my friend that is an engineer to fine a low dense matel that can be use that hold a lot of heat or get cold and then start work on but i think i need some info. for you micheal bush dose glass tranmit heat? cause i think i might have something tony williams

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Aug 2002
    Location
    Nehawka, Nebraska USA
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    >for you micheal bush dose glass tranmit heat?

    Yes it does. Not as much as metal but more than wood. That's why good windows are double panes to create an air space for insulation.


  19. #19
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    demossville,ky. usa
    Posts
    59

    Lightbulb

    insulat alau. i have an ideal I believe it a work

    ------------------
    tony

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Golden, CO
    Posts
    171

    Post

    How about making the frames out of cellulose fibers bound with lignin. It would be light weight, insulating and unlike money it actually does grow on trees. All you have to do is let it dry and cut it into the shape you want. As a bonus, it's renewable, biodegradable and may even have antimicrobial properties.

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