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PLANTING FOR BEES

84K views 243 replies 62 participants last post by  BULLSEYE BILL 
#1 ·
I have read that plantings for bee forage is not generaly a profitable endevor.
OK, so this is a hobby.
I have ten acres of crop land left that was not put into CRP and would like to put it into use for the bees.
My area is just west of the Flint Hills in eastern central Kansas. Main crops in this area are wheat, milo, soybeans, corn and sorgum. Alfalfa and clover do quite well here, I do not know if canola would.
I know that the clovers will bloom at different times and there is some overlap, I do not know in which order they bloom. I have thought of sowing a mix of white, yellow, and red with alfalfa, however it may be better to strip sow them seperatly in hope of cutting them to possibly entice a second bloom.
I have quite a few questions and would like anyones input on how they would or have done this.
Some terms that I have read and do not know are the names; sainfoin, trefoil, and trifolium clovers. What are these?
The local co-op listed both red and crimson clover, is one better for bees than the other? Another that I had not know of is hubam.
And lastly, does anyone know of a source for goldenrod seed?
Any help would be appreciated.
Bill
 
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#52 ·
Last year was my first year for harvest and the honey was absolutely beautiful. I was told by local beekeepers that the white clover was reason. I have planted quite a bit for the last several years for deer food plots. It looks like the bees was an unexpected addition to the benefit. I planted more in the February snow.
 
#53 ·
i think that some beekeepers never see a particular plant being worked by bees,and assume it's not used,but bees visit different plants at different times of the day,i'm not an early riser so i usually miss them hitting the buckwheat.maybe more cluster or compound type flowers retain nectar longer into a hot day and are hit later?also i think bees do have preferences as to taste,some plants seem to be used only if nothing else is going on(like ironweed).
 
#54 ·
Once a honey bee starts foraging a floral type, she will continue to forage that floral source until the nectar is completely depleted. And in heavey honey flows the same bee will actually continue visiting the same forage source day after day automatically.
This is why buckwheat can be hard to gather from, if flowering fields neighbour it. Buckwheat secretes nectar late morning and finishes early afternoon. Where as canola and clover secrete nectar first thing in the morning, continuing later in the day. Works to our advantage I guess, clover/canola honey pays more of a premuim.

Ian
 
#59 ·
>My planting experiment is underway!
>I planted eleven acres this last weekend. >I decided on five distinct areas of >forrage.
>Three acres of Yellow clover
>Three acres of Huban clover
>Three acres of Alfalfa
>One acre of Canola and
>One acre of Safflower/Sunflower mixed

>The bad news is that I am told that the >clover will not bloom the first year, that >it needs a dormant period first. Well, we >will still have plenty of forrage for this >year.

>You have been a great help, I have >identified many plants on my property that >I had not known to be nectar producers. I >am looking to have a good year.
>Bill

>[This message has been edited by BULLSEYE >BILL (edited March 17, 2003).]


An update on my field of dreams.

The yellow clover has taken off well and is about two foot high and looks just like a good stand of alfalfa, and no, it did not bloom hardly at all.

The Hubam is another story however. It is about three foot now, not thick or leafy, but a thinner stand and thinner plant in general. The good new is that I have a good bloom going on! There is a nice white hue to the field even though we have been in a drought, the field is looking GOOD!

The alfalfa stand is thin and short and I have been told it takes at least two years before it takes off. For now I am cutting the weeds off about one foot high.

One caution about planting safflower. Don't let it get in your pasture! I thought musk thistle was bad, cripes... Next year after the bloom I will have to go dig each plant out.

The canola did well this year as well as the sunflowers (state flower). I am going to reseed the canola again for a better stand.

All in all, I am getting excited for next years crop. I have pretty resigned myself to just growing bees this year as I am expanding my number of hives, and next year I will produce honey.




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Bullseye Bill
Smack dab in the middle of the country.
 
#60 ·
Bill- we planted white and yellow sweet clover last Fall and had plenty of flowers this year, so you will probably have pretty good success with that one. It's a little too soon for Fall planting in this area, but come September...
Question for anyone with experience growing buckwheat- when is the time to plant it, Spring or Fall?
Thanks.
 
#62 ·
>Question for anyone with experience growing buckwheat- when is the time to plant it, Spring or Fall?

Plant it anytime. Frost will kill it, but it survives drought really well. It's a short cycle (don't remember off the top of my head what) and so you can plant it and in a few weeks you have blooms. I like it, not because I can count on the bees using it, but if you stagger the planting of several patches you can disk it under when it goes to seed and you can have blossoms all year. That way, they may ignore it some of the time, but it fills in the gaps in the nectar flow.
 
#64 ·
#65 ·
Thanks, Michael. So I guess it's an annual rather than perennial? We just recently had our field disked, so I guess I could broadcast some seed and see if it produces anything for Fall. We won't get much for rain for a few weeks, but maybe it would be able to sprout in September and maybe bloom before frost, then reseed for next year.
 
#66 ·
>So I guess it's an annual rather than perennial?

That's how I treat it. I assume it is. Since the frost kills it.

>We just recently had our field disked, so I guess I could broadcast some seed and see if it produces anything for Fall.

I think it goes to seed in 10 to 12 weeks, and it blooms for quite a while.

>We won't get much for rain for a few weeks, but maybe it would be able to sprout in September and maybe bloom before frost, then reseed for next year.

It might make it to seed this year. You could harvest the seeds if you want and use them next year. I don't have a method for that.
 
#67 ·
Interesting subject.
The plant that I have not seen mentioned is the Basswood tree. I am new at this bee thing but when the basswood were in bloom my girls made a super of honey per week, per hive. Of course that is only 2 weeks. The trees in the shade bloom a little later then the ones in the sun.
I have been collecting sweetclover seed, from ditch plants, and am going to plant this fall in an area I burnt the grass off of. It is very persistent in this area and blooms for a long time. Esp[ecially if both yellow and white are present. I just have very little right close to my bees.

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Erwin
 
#68 ·
trying late season buckwheat. we had some unusual rain in August (did't everyone) and have more ground moisture going into fall. trying to get a stand of buckwheat early and keep adding strips every couple of weeks. I understand bloom is 12-15 days after emergence. Is this true?

Will be frost seeding hairy vetch this fall. Last year's red clover did well on adding nitrogen but the bees didn't work it at all.
 
#69 ·
>I understand bloom is 12-15 days after emergence. Is this true?

I don't have the facts in front of me, but that sounds right. They also bloom for quite a while. I think when there are more reliable sources of nectar (that start earlier in the day?) they will ignore it, but they will really work it if there isn't much else.
 
#71 ·
You can plant buckwheat anytime from last frost up to about 45 days before 1st frost. It begins blooming about 3-4 weeks after planting. It likes warm/hot weather and does well with little rain. Bees love it and it's probably cheaper that feeding sugar syrup. Bees don't work red clover, but they really like crimson clover. Crimson is good to plant in the fall (just before 1st frost). It will be blooming the following April. Btw, crimson makes a great ground cover and green manure. There is an annual white sweet clover (think its also called hubam) that blooms during the summer. Plant in spring after last frost for June/July blooming. I've read (but it may be a myth) that it produces up to 500lbs of honey per acre.
 
#72 ·
>There is an annual white sweet clover (think its also called hubam) that blooms during the summer. Plant in spring after last frost for June/July blooming. I've read (but it may be a myth) that it produces up to 500lbs of honey per acre.

Contrary to what others told me, it is true that it will bloom the first year if planted in the spring. To my suprise it bloomed late June until mid August. I expect it to be a better stand and a better bloom next year. Still it was four foot tall, thin, but gave the girls a lot to work with.

I hope the myth is true also. I have three acres planted in Huban, three in Yellow, and four in Alfalfa.

Now if I can get through the winter with 20 colonies...



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Bullseye Bill
Smack dab in the middle of the country.
 
#73 ·
Wfarler- I planted some buckwheat last week and it is coming up pretty well. If it flowers within a couple or three weeks, then it should be flowering very soon, but to be honest, it doesn't look to me like it's anywhere near the flowering stage. With all this rain, though, I'm hoping for a good flowering season before it gets too cool. Where did you buy your seed? I got a 50 pound bag at Marshall Grain in Fort Worth. Couldn't find it here locally.
 
#75 ·
>I was at a local feed &seed store today & they had some seed they called Giant white clover,
they also said they planted it for hay,
Has anyone ever heard of this or used any for the bee's? thank's>>>>MARK

I have heard of it, haven't tried it. After reading the links posted a page or two back I was sold on the Hubam. In those links I found grafs that showed the potential for honey crops between the various types of clover.

I wanted to keep the flow going as long as possible, that is why I planted the yellow for an earlier flow and the Hubam for a later flow. The Alfalfa for a filler inbetween.

My concern is now I have been told that I need to be careful when to cut the clover for feed hay. That it will cause abortions in livestock if not cut and baled at the right time.

Anyone know of this?



------------------
Bullseye Bill
Smack dab in the middle of the country.
 
#76 ·
>My concern is now I have been told that I need to be careful when to cut the clover for feed hay. That it will cause abortions in livestock if not cut and baled at the right time. Anyone know of this?

I had not heard that of clover, but of fescue grass because of the endophytes. Basically in the grass it is a fungus that lives in the intersticial spaces that causes abortions. It's also the same fungus that gets on grain (ergot) and causes the same problems. I'm wondering if, in a humid climate, it gets on the clover. My guess is that Kansas is too dry for that on clover.
 
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