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Thread: Spring build up

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
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    I have 3 hives with Russian queens. I lost one over the winter, 3rd year with no treatment. I should have done a mite drop last fall but I was too confident after 2 years with no treatment. there were stores in the hive but they were all dead. Quite a large cluster by the way, about half were all the way into the cells as if they were starving. Maybe they just didn't move to the stores.
    Now to the question. For a spring build up will the bees use the left over stores or does it require a the 1 to 1 syrup to stimulate them into brood rearing? :confused:

  2. #2
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    Now to the question. For a spring build up will the bees use the left over stores

    Yes.

    > or does it require a the 1 to 1 syrup to stimulate them into brood rearing?

    Yes.

    They will consume a lot of stores raising brood and the left over stores will help with that. 1:1 sugar syrup is the best I know of for stimulation. But then if they've got pollen coming in they usually start rearing brood anyway.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  3. #3
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    *They will consume a lot of stores raising brood and the left over stores will help with that. 1:1 sugar syrup is the best I know of for stimulation. But then if they've got pollen coming in they usually start rearing brood anyway.

    Michael
    Will the pollen substitute do the same thing.

  4. #4
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    Pollen substitute will help some as far as stimulating them to raise brood. The problem is that substitute makes inferior bees. Pollen mixed with substitute is far better than straight substitute. But substitute will give them something to work with.

    I have not had much luck with patties (pollen or substitute), but open feeding pollen seems to go over well with the bees. They took about 2 1/2 gallons yesterday in about 2 hours. They were all over it. Literally. I'm going to try to buy some expeller processed soy flour tonight to mix with it so I don't run out. I already ordered some substitute from Brushy Mt. but I want some soy flour in case the weather warms up before it gets here.

    I haven't tried the Vitamin C trick with the patties though.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  5. #5
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    Michael-do the bees go into a feeding frenzy with open pollen feeders.

    Thanks. Terry

  6. #6
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    If you place pollen or pollen substitute in an open feeder, they will work it hard when they can fly till something better comes along.

    In patties, I use honey in with the mix, it seems to work for me.

  7. #7
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    MountainCamp-I use pollen substitute patties on the frames above the cluster of bees.
    3parts soybean flour
    2parts brewers yeast
    2:1 sugar syrup
    I,m thinking it would be less stress for the bees with open feeding.
    Terry

  8. #8
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    I find it is best to do both. I open feed syrup and pollen sub. and I also do both inside the hive on the top bars.
    The stronger hives make better use of the outside sources, while the hives that are not quite on the same par, make better use of the internal sources.
    I also find that the external sources keep the stronger hives occupied and they spend less time in the early / late season when foraging sources aren’t there trying to get into other hives.
    The internal sources also allow all to work on them when they can't fly.

  9. #9
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    >Michael-do the bees go into a feeding frenzy with open pollen feeders.

    Yes and no. They get very excited but are so busy rolling around in the pollen there is no fighting and no dead bees in the feeder.

    >In patties, I use honey in with the mix, it seems to work for me.

    So did I and they seemed to ignore it. That was real pollen and real honey. The substitute patties with sugar syrup and substitute were worse. But then sometimes it's just the timing, the mood or whatever is going on with them.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  10. #10
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    Where can you get expeller soy flour?>>>>Mark

  11. #11
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    I just buy whole soy flour. I think it's the same thing. The point is there is also the kind they stole all the fat out of, which is even more lacking in nutrients.
    Michael Bush bushfarms.com/bees.htm "Everything works if you let it." ThePracticalBeekeeper.com 40y 200h 37yTF

  12. #12
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    Soy flour – Soy flour is the main non floral protein supplement for honey bees rations.

    It comes in two forms, either Expeller press which has 6% soy oil, or Defat soy flour (chemically extracted) which has only 2% soy oil. The crude protein level is 48% 50%. Soy flour is more of an adult bee feed and appears to assist in making adult bees more active while on a honey flow.

    Expeller press soy flour is more palatable to the bees than defat soy flour. This was demonstrated in trials conducted on the preference or palatability of protein feed for bees, Expeller press soy flour is good when there is limited pollen available. Defat soy flour is satisfactory when reasonable volumes of low quality ground flora pollen is being collected by the bees

  13. #13
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    I feed both, open and patties, and recomend to anyone to do the same. Open feeding is important only in the very early spring when there is bee flight but no pollen avaliable. this gives the bees something to work on and leave the neighbours alone. Starts the hive into a good brood rearing mode, and blasts them into the pollen flow.
    In my opinion, if you are going to start stimulating brood rearing with open feeding, you must have on patties also, to allow the bees to continue eating throughout adverse weather. I also feel that having a patty on throughout the early pollen flow adds insurance of properly nurished hives as they start emerging in droves. Unfavorable weather through out the early spring can set a busting colony back down the line.
    My spring work is so short that I must have the hives up to splitting strenght right off the mark, weather plays a factor in my splitting rate

    Just one way I try to help my bees manage with my beekeeping schedule
    Ian Steppler >> Canadian Beekeeper's Blog
    www.stepplerfarms.com

  14. #14
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    Soy flour is sold in some grocery stores.

  15. #15
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    I have feeded at spring my bees with pollen patties with good results 12 years. Last year I changed 80% pollen to bakery yeast and soya flour. It tasted well for bees even they got pollen ouside. 30% pollen content is sure that they like to eat.

    I make dough cake and roll it between greaseproof paper. Then pieces of paper over the brood frames. A pig hive consumes 1 lb per week that dough.

    I am just searching researches concerning aminoacids of plant species. Just I learned that
    willow pollen is "light" food for bees. 15-20% rax protein.

  16. #16
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    Finman--Welcome,are you the same Finman on Beemasters site.


    Terry

  17. #17
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    I am the same

  18. #18
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    Diddicult to draw here, but here is

    Aminoacid content of

    1) need of bee
    2) medium pollen
    3) dried brewery yeast
    4) soya flour


    xxxxxxxxx 1) 2) 3) 4)
    Arginine 3 5,3 2,2 7,1
    Histidine 1,5 2,5 1,1 2,8
    Isoleucine 4 5,1 2,1 4,5
    Leucine 4,5 7,1 3,2 7,4
    Lysine 3 6,4 3 6,1
    Methion.1,5 1,9 0,7 1,3
    Phenyal 2,5 4,1 1,8 4,8
    Threom. 3 4,1 1,1 3,9
    Trypot. 1 1,4 0,5 missing?
    Valin4 5,8 2,3 4,5
    Raw Prot.> 20% 26 % 45 % 48 %

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